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  #21  
Old 02-19-2011, 02:23 AM
Charlie Charlie is offline
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Perhaps not a door.

But a threshold...
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  #22  
Old 02-19-2011, 02:40 AM
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So long as I'm paid, whaddah I care?
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  #23  
Old 02-19-2011, 02:55 AM
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Dang, Brother, I know you ain't in it for the money.
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  #24  
Old 02-19-2011, 03:04 AM
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Shhhh!! Whadda ya tryin' here, to ruin my REP-u-TAY-shun?!!
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  #25  
Old 02-19-2011, 07:56 AM
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Word Wars IV: A New Hope...

"An image arises of a wall, a fence, a door, ... a border crossing, with the line being sharp and distinct."

Well, I only have myself to blame, since I started this by saying "no, it's more like *this* from where I'm sitting..." (though I tried to include irony in my tone of keyboard) but let's not get into universalising our own experiences - I'm comfortable with you being uncomfortable with "to", so long as you're comfortable with me being comfortable with "to" - since it doesn't do all that wall-fence-door stuff for me. I don't assume any sharp transitions, but also no reason to assume it won't feel like a change of state, at least in retrospect - and I'm really way more interested in the journey anyway, since that's the only part I'm certain about .

So by all means, you can be on the door (wherever that is), but I'm dancin' across the prairie!
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  #26  
Old 02-19-2011, 06:48 PM
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Yoxi,

I was just riffing off of your post, that's all. You see, *I* have this concern, this worry, that *some* folks will get themselves into an unfortunate bind (knot) by envisioning Dharma practice, meditation, sadhana (spiritual practice) as a journey somewhere else, when in reality the journey is simply further into one's own true nature -- or into the awareness and experience of that already existing fact / reality. Oftentiimes, folks combine this notion with the notion that they have to "get rid of" part/s of themselves -- and so they go to war within themselves. And I find this a particularly counterproductive approach to the journey. I wasn't saying that YOU were doing this. I just wanted to have my concern expressed. That's all. Your post evoked that concern, even if that evocation was entirely unrelated to your writing's intention.

Furthermore, all my chit-chat about selling my "wisdom" was nothing more than mildly caustic giggle rousing.

Last edited by River; 02-19-2011 at 06:51 PM.
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  #27  
Old 02-19-2011, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yoxi View Post
I don't assume any sharp transitions, but also no reason to assume it won't feel like a change of state, at least in retrospect
Here's how I see it (But I could certainly be wrong!): I already possess, albeit in limited degree and proportion, those qualities which are the qualities folks have been calling "enlightenment". So do you, and so does everyone else -- in differing degrees and proportions.

The primary attribues of "enlightenment" are, as I see things now, (a) lovingkindness and (b) mindful awareness. Each of these, when practiced effectively and in combination, bring about more enlightenment, which is to say more of these two. And the more one has of these two the more freely this whole directional trend of growth and development (unfolding) is likely to unfold. Only when we get in the way of these two qualities of "awakeness," when we contract awareness, compassion, etc., do we apply brakes on the "journey" of "enlightenment" -- which might be better called "enlightening," since I doubt there is a terminal conclusion to the process.

Of course, my model (which I've borrowed from others) goes a long way toward eliminating the whole Worshiped Guru projective fantasy that too many folks get caught up in. It also allows us to meet our favorite teachers face to face, as -- ultimately -- equals. This diminishes all kinds of idealizational fantasies which prevent us from seeing ourselves and others in a true light.

Last edited by River; 02-19-2011 at 08:14 PM.
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  #28  
Old 02-19-2011, 11:25 PM
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It caught me by surprise to have an old, old button pushed by what you wrote - the "whatever you say, it's not good enough!" button, and nothing to do with what you actually said - well, almost nothing! Since I haven't yet successfully unpushed this button again, I can't converse sensibly about this, it'll just be toads and snakes coming out of my keyboard. I know this to be so because I've just deleted a whole bayou of them.
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  #29  
Old 02-20-2011, 12:55 AM
Charlie Charlie is offline
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Meditation, anyone?
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  #30  
Old 02-20-2011, 01:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yoxi View Post
... it'll just be toads and snakes coming out of my keyboard. I know this to be so because I've just deleted a whole bayou of them.
LOL!

I know just what you mean, brother.
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