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  #151  
Old 01-28-2011, 09:56 PM
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*warning neon and others that prefer my posts are edited... I realize this isn't. My phone is biting the dust and I am getting a new one tonight, sooo there* *i know the term is dick zillion btw* excuse me dinged, this is a hyjack, you and I have talked via PM so I'm going to assume you don't mind me clearing something up that I have wondered about.

This is what I get from todays posts on here. My repetative posts about MY point of view are seen as judgmental by some posters that are regulars? If I write a fuck zillion of posts on casual sex as I see it or LDR's as I see it or "rules" as I see it then its seen differently than neon posting? This makes me some kind of "motherly" polyfi freak? *sarcsm* fuuuck... I only do it because people ask the same shit over and over again and don't bother READING what has gone before. Everyday its the same threads started. Its the same everyday. If a thread doesn't have any sort of indication that my opinion is covered, I add it. Plain and simple. There is nothing more attached to it than what I am doing sorks for me. The formula I use for my poly works. I am not everyone, I am not wanting to be everyone. I am me and I only stay here because I appreciate and love hearing other peoples stories. I love hearing the diversity amongst my community. I like to meet new people, not because I want to be a "mother." for the record I don't identify as poly fi as I am not involved with a closed tribe. I am closed, but everyone else (except Mono of course) is open.

We are good magdlyn, we always have been in my eyes. You might be different from me, but I never judged you. I would appreciate no judgment in return. You and others brought me through some really hard times and I appreciate that. Please realize that when people go through shit they are not always able or don't always notice that they might come across as judgmental on line in their sarcasm. I am guilty of this for sure, which is why I let people know I am being sarcastic... And often don't even attempt trying to be funny. For some reason from me it sounds extra judgmental. I dunno.... These are just random thoughts coming from a woman who is really not doing so good right now, so bare with me.
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  #152  
Old 01-28-2011, 10:03 PM
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I dunno, I think twat-zillion sounds pretty good.
You're right. I didn't think of "twat".
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  #153  
Old 01-28-2011, 10:11 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
*warning neon and others that prefer my posts are edited... I realize this isn't. My phone is biting the dust and I am getting a new one tonight, sooo there* *i know the term is dick zillion btw* excuse me dinged, this is a hyjack, you and I have talked via PM so I'm going to assume you don't mind me clearing something up that I have wondered about.

This is what I get from todays posts on here. My repetative posts about MY point of view are seen as judgmental by some posters that are regulars? If I write a fuck zillion of posts on casual sex as I see it or LDR's as I see it or "rules" as I see it then its seen differently than neon posting? This makes me some kind of "motherly" polyfi freak? *sarcsm* fuuuck... I only do it because people ask the same shit over and over again and don't bother READING what has gone before. Everyday its the same threads started. Its the same everyday. If a thread doesn't have any sort of indication that my opinion is covered, I add it. Plain and simple. There is nothing more attached to it than what I am doing sorks for me. The formula I use for my poly works. I am not everyone, I am not wanting to be everyone. I am me and I only stay here because I appreciate and love hearing other peoples stories. I love hearing the diversity amongst my community. I like to meet new people, not because I want to be a "mother." for the record I don't identify as poly fi as I am not involved with a closed tribe. I am closed, but everyone else (except Mono of course) is open.

We are good magdlyn, we always have been in my eyes. You might be different from me, but I never judged you. I would appreciate no judgment in return. You and others brought me through some really hard times and I appreciate that. Please realize that when people go through shit they are not always able or don't always notice that they might come across as judgmental on line in their sarcasm. I am guilty of this for sure, which is why I let people know I am being sarcastic... And often don't even attempt trying to be funny. For some reason from me it sounds extra judgmental. I dunno.... These are just random thoughts coming from a woman who is really not doing so good right now, so bare with me.
redpepper, i'm not sure what you mean by "prefer my posts are edited".

Speaking for myself, I don't think your posts come across as "judgmental". I do however, agree with Mags that sometimes it SEEMS like you have a knee-jerk reaction when someone mentions casual sex, LDR's, or what-have-you, but I have never seen you imply that what works for you must work for everyone else and is the "only" right way. In fact, the opposite seems to be the case.

I'm thinking that at some point, we'll move these "hijacky" posts over to the wank (Forum Sociology) thread.
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  #154  
Old 01-28-2011, 10:52 PM
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LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
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Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
These are just random thoughts coming from a woman who is really not doing so good right now, so bare with me.
Hugs, hugs, hugs, and a big kiss on the cheek.

I was sitting here perplexed thinking poly-fi? I didn't think that they were in a poly-fi dynamic.
Then I thought;....

just goes to show everyone has different definitions.

AH yes-that was the point!


Seriously though-I think that in some ways you do come across as a poly-mother. Not the way you took it though.

I used to be a stripper. There was a "housemom" whose job it was to take care of the dancers, keep anyone from getting themselves into a dangerous situation, be sure we had what we needed to do our job safely.

You somewhat remind me of a "house mother" in that way. Always trying to help people avoid the pitfalls you've already experienced or witnessed in polyamory.


XO
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  #155  
Old 01-29-2011, 04:16 AM
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Maybe a title of "venting here" or "lots of sarcasm here" would help.
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  #156  
Old 01-29-2011, 04:23 AM
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Originally Posted by NeonKaos View Post
redpepper, i'm not sure what you mean by "prefer my posts are edited".

Speaking for myself, I don't think your posts come across as "judgmental". I do however, agree with Mags that sometimes it SEEMS like you have a knee-jerk reaction when someone mentions casual sex, LDR's, or what-have-you, but I have never seen you imply that what works for you must work for everyone else and is the "only" right way. In fact, the opposite seems to be the case.

I'm thinking that at some point, we'll move these "hijacky" posts over to the wank (Forum Sociology) thread.
I meant that you have said before that it drives you crazy sometimes when people don't edit.

I HAD a knee jerk reaction to some threads that were a hot topic in my life. That is how I process.... I will have you know that I don't any more as its all been said before and nothing at this point holds any passion for me in the poly/swinging/open/fucking world... I couldn't give a shit about casual sex or anything really. Go fuck who ever you want peeps. RP doesn't give a shit! that was a joke.... now can we fucking get over it!? FUUUUUUUCK. I'm so sick of hearing that I have some opinion about shit that I don't give a fuck about! GAUD! It's done now okay....?! thank you...... that was a vent folks and now I'm done.

yes, moving this to the sociology thread is an excellent idea.... have fun with that as I won't be here for a couple of days. I've lost my patience.... please don't bother posting to me here or in PM, I'm not interested any more in anything anyone has to say. K? thanks. I'm not mad, just WAAAAY over whelmed with real life and this is really not that important to me. Have a good weekend. Catch you on Sunday... or something.
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  #157  
Old 01-29-2011, 04:32 AM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
I meant that you have said before that it drives you crazy sometimes when people don't edit.
I don't recall saying that about "editing", but I have said it about formatting. It also drives me crazy when people don't make an effort to read the basic stuff on the forum (and I can tell when they have and have not done so just by the phrasing of their sentences).

What I really fail to see is how the focus has suddenly been turned on me this time.

Moving posts to wank thread in T-minus 5.... 4... 3.... 2...
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  #158  
Old 04-18-2011, 10:13 AM
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Unhappy Sniping, point-scoring, and jumping to conclusions on polyamory.com

I found (and find) this site to be an oasis from the outside world, where I can be (and have been) accused of being immature, unable to commit, incapable of “real” love, all because of my belief in the possibility of an infinite love, without jealousy or possessiveness. An oasis of [not 100% equal-minded, but at least] people sympathetic to my choice of how to live my love. There is an encouraging interchange of information, advice, expressions of support (and commiseration when things are going screwy), and interesting life-stories that is refreshing after the standard heterosexual, monogamous near-monopoly on views about relationships that one finds in the desert beyond this oasis.

It therefore comes as something of a disillusion and disappointment to see a certain amount of sniping, point-scoring, false assumptions, and hasty jumping to conclusions that goes on in this forum. I have witnessed examples of this aimed at myself and at others... and I don’t like to see either.

[In a way, I prefer to have them aimed at me, because – although I take criticism seriously (An acquaintance once said to me: “I give you 10 out of 10 for really listening to criticism and considering its validity, without rejecting it offhand.”) – I have learned to have a certain faith in myself, a self-security that means that I am not devastated by criticism. (This self-security was hard-earned after a childhood and adolescence plagued by an inferiority complex.) Whereas some other members – especially some who were new to this forum - have obviously been stung by carelessly-worded comments directed at them. Some [of these members] have disappeared completely. And I find that a shame, because they were likely the very people who most needed a feeling of support through their difficult process of adapting to polyamory.]

But perhaps it would be easier to describe what I’m getting at if I cite my first-hand experience. [It doesn’t devastate me, but it gets me down.] And please don't believe that I think that "I'm being got at!": I notice this sort of thing being aimed at others. I'm just using my 1st-hand experience as an example.

After writing about my viewpoint on certain matters, I’ve had (not often but occasionally) the feeling that I’m being attacked. Sometimes my original words were not chosen with enough care, sometimes after a great deal of thought (it can take me up to an hour to compose a single posting)... but then were misunderstood anyway, and my motives or judgement were called into question.

There is a big difference between the spirited debate of ideas and slinging personal criticisms around.

On occasion I’ve posted a playful or ironically-meant comment (I’m a semi-professional clown, and something of a joker by nature. IMHO a laugh now and then doesn’t hurt.) I have tried to remember – when I’ve made these playful comments – to make it obvious that that’s what they were, sometimes by the use of smileys , sometimes by obviously playful phrases (e.g. “... but then, I’m a pervert.” / “Don’t let me tempt you down this path of perversion.” Both in reference to my personal valuing of cuddles and emotional intimacy over “hot sex”.) Often my comments have been accepted in the joking spirit in which they were intended. A few times they appear to have been taken totally seriously – and badly.

Other times I have offered a completely sincere opinion and it has gone down very badly. At times, other members have attempted to belittle me for the views that I hold. [I also think that members should be very careful about using comments like: “Oh, you’re so young!” – or “inexperienced” (implied: “and therefore relatively clueless”). Although this one hasn’t been applied to me on here, I remember - from when I was young - how little this persuaded me to heed the advice or the comment being given.]

And other difficulties / criticisms have arisen when:

a) I haven’t been conversant with the special polyamory use of language. In polyamory, certain normal (outer-world) words are used, but have a whole new meaning in polyamory use. An obvious example is “unicorn”. This one caused me wonder when I first came across it, but no real grief. But how about “veto”? I’ve just looked it up in a Collins dictionary and found: “1. The power to prevent legislation or action proposed by others; prohibition [...] 4. To refuse consent to (a proposal, esp. a government bill) 5. to prohibit, ban, or forbid: her parents vetoed her trip.” On one thread, the OP appeared to me to have used the word in this wider sense. When I commented, also using the word in this sense [asking – in a joking way – a very serious question: “What’s the difference between ‘vetoing’ and ‘setting clear boundaries’?”], I felt under attack, treated like an absolute arsehole, for messing about, playing with words – the assumption: that I should know perfectly well that ‘veto’ (in polyamory circles) means exclusively “forbidding your partner to have a relationship with such-and-such a person” (or also, even worse, with anybody).

There is a polyamory glossary on this board that is already 5 pages long. It’s very useful, as a reference work, to look up a word of which you’re not certain. I seriously doubt that many of you have read it through from start to finish. Should I have to search through it (because it’s constantly being added to and therefore isn’t in alphabetical order) every time I’m thinking of using a word like “veto” (or “house” or “car”), to make sure that it doesn’t mean something completely different on a polyamory forum? Should I be treated like an arsehole because I didn’t already know the polyamory meaning of every word? How many of you are aware that in Australia, they use the word “spoof” to mean “spunk”, “jism”? (And it’s quite likely that my aged mother only knows one meaning of “spunk”: courage or spirit. [While looking that up in my dictionary, I find that Collins doesn’t even give the sexual connotation of “spud”!])

b) I have been accused of not reading the whole of a thread before making my ill-informed comment. It’s true that I don’t always read the whole thread first when I want to reply to another person’s comment that has caught my eye. Is this forbidden? Is there some rule that we’re not allowed to comment on any particular thread until we’ve read right through it? In that case, I’m either going to have to withdraw from this forum or limit my replies to short new threads and those in which I have a very special – almost obsessive – interest, because my internet time is limited... and some of the threads on here are dozens of pages long. [In actual fact – and ironically – the one time this accusation was made of me was when I had read through that particular thread with great attention. For some people “ill-informed” is simply synonymous with “disagreeing with my opinion”.]

c) I have been accused of playing around with formatting, of being more interested in formatting than in the matter at hand. I do tend to use underlinings more often than most members. But that’s because the written word carries no inflection of the voice, and I wish to draw attention to a particular word, or let you hear (in your head) that I’m emphasising this word. This criticism has been made by (among others) one of the moderators. If it really bugs you so much, perhaps you should suggest - in one of your policy meetings – the removal of the formatting option. (Either that or just ignore my formatting...)

d) There are people who just can’t let well-enough alone. If I have been criticised for something, accept the validity of the criticism, and apologise, it’s rather galling that somebody else jumps in to criticise me for what I’ve already apologised for!

Oh, I could go on and on. (A justifiable criticism of me would be that I do go on for too long.)

In a nutshell: “You want people to listen to what you’re saying? Then be careful how you say it!”
Advice and constructive criticism can be very helpful (and I'd be the first to recognise this)... but not if they're not listened to because of the tone in which they're spoken (or written).

What I’d like to see is that on this thread – of all places – we were all willing to “walk two moons in each other’s moccasins” before we jump to conclusions about what the other person means... or feels. Perhaps even better, maybe we should all take off our shoes and touch each other, bare foot sole to bare foot sole, in a ritual of mutual acceptance which, in Kurt Vonnegut’s early novel “Cat’s Cradle” was declared by the dictator to be punishable by death.
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  #159  
Old 04-18-2011, 10:18 AM
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To forestall accusations that I’m a hypocrite, that I myself am guilty of attacking or belittling others on this board, allow me to state:

1) I have attacked rather vigorously certain aspects of a religion that some members hold dear. It’s the one that I was brought up in, and its mainstream interpretation (in my opinion, an ugly corruption of the original, beautiful teachings) caused me untold damage (I was self-loathing, border-line suicidal as a child) that took years to recover from. In a later post I apologised for my outburst. As far as I am aware, at no time did I criticise any person on this board for following this religion. I did heavily criticise the established hierarchy of the religion for betraying its origins. I stand by that still.

2) I have poked fun at a couple of hypotheses put forward in a book that several members hold in the highest esteem. In that post, I proposed another hypothesis of my own and invited anybody who wished to to poke fun at it. (“I have a right to propose my own whacko theories, don’t I?”) I also introduced readers to an alternative hypothesis in another book that I hold in the highest esteem. But, as I wrote, “Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer choice”. It is my view that everyone should be free to believe whatever they want. Again, I don’t feel that I attacked any member personally.

3) I expressed a personal opinion that BDSM practice was a symptom of imbalance, that a truly healthy, well-adjusted person would get pleasure neither in inflicting nor in receiving pain, would not feel the need to either dominate or be dominated. But I emphasised that this was my personal feeling, and added: “Different strokes for different folks”. Once again, I don’t feel that I attacked anybody personally over this. In fact, the best friend that I’ve made on this board – the only one to whom I’ve revealed my true identity [not counting my true identity Mister Pedant Man, which knowledge is open to anybody on here] and to whom, after reading several of their excellent posts, I sent a PM declaring my “undying love” - is into BDSM.

If anybody feels that I have attacked or attempted to belittle them in public, I would like to take this opportunity to apologise and to assure you that that was never my intention. (It’s just that I can be awfully clumsy.)

Misunderstandings are bound to occur. Let’s be generous with each other and not jump to conclusions or be too hasty: either to take offence or to criticise...
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And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.
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  #160  
Old 04-19-2011, 01:22 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Hi Far,

I'd like to toss in a comment or three on some of your post.

As someone who has been with this forum for......seemingly ages, I've had an opportunity to see much of what you're speaking of, see it discussed, addressed etc. I can only say this. The 'overall' tone and atmosphere of the forum has improved quite dramatically since it's early days.
You have to keep in mind, the contributors are human too - and subject to all the same strengths and failings, moods and opinions of the species. Same for the moderators.
So you need to expect a certain amount of errors and 'from the hip comments' - same as you would in a live public setting.

Specifically..................




Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
.............

It therefore comes as something of a disillusion and disappointment to see a certain amount of sniping, point-scoring, false assumptions, and hasty jumping to conclusions that goes on in this forum. I have witnessed examples of this aimed at myself and at others... and I don’t like to see either.
Interesting. I don 't see much of this now (sniping & point scoring). Jumping to conclusions....well, see my above comment on human nature.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
.................
Whereas some other members – especially some who were new to this forum - have obviously been stung by carelessly-worded comments directed at them. Some [of these members] have disappeared completely. And I find that a shame, because they were likely the very people who most needed a feeling of support through their difficult process of adapting to polyamory.]
It's going to happen. The words may not always have been as 'careless' as they were 'blunt'. Dealing with such approaches is a communication skill worth developing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
.............

After writing about my viewpoint on certain matters, I’ve had (not often but occasionally) the feeling that I’m being attacked. Sometimes my original words were not chosen with enough care, sometimes after a great deal of thought (it can take me up to an hour to compose a single posting)... but then were misunderstood anyway, and my motives or judgement were called into question.
There's that key word - 'feeling' ! Seems we hear that a lot
Search and study up on a lot of discussion on feeling vs fact.

Misunderstanding is common. You later clarify the reason yourself (part of at least) in discussing the whole context/vocabulary conundrum. And sometimes it does take some seemingly wasteful posts to clear those up. But that generally happens.

Calling your 'motives' or 'judgement' into question ? Isn't that part of the whole point of such places and discussions ? To get an outside viewpoint ? Get used to it
Another opinion may be more accurate - or less. It's ONLY another opinion. Consider all and either accept or reject them as having some substance. Then move on.



Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
There is a big difference between the spirited debate of ideas and slinging personal criticisms around.
Word of advice here.
Debate often encompasses criticism. But you have to understand that it's ideas, concepts, opinions etc that are being criticized. NOT the speaker ! Common mistake that leads to a lot of wasted dialog.




Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
Other times I have offered a completely sincere opinion and it has gone down very badly. At times, other members have attempted to belittle me for the views that I hold.
Are you sure ? Was it "you" or the 'views" ? See above comment.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFarFromRight View Post
[I also think that members should be very careful about using comments like: “Oh, you’re so young!” – or “inexperienced” (implied: “and therefore relatively clueless”). Although this one hasn’t been applied to me on here, I remember - from when I was young - how little this persuaded me to heed the advice or the comment being given.]
I can see where this could be valid. We do deal with all ages and experience levels here. I don't like to see those type of responses either. But we do see a certain amount of questions, opinions etc that really are born from nothing more than youth and inexperience. They are SO basic and fundamental about relationship dynamics that they aren't even about poly per se. I choose to just ignore (not respond) to such posts but maybe that's just as bad ? But really there must be better 101 level places out there to get answers to some of that stuff ?


You did go on more.

I'm going to stop here.

GS
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