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  #11  
Old 07-24-2010, 05:13 PM
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Sorcha17 Sorcha17 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Superjast View Post

Unconditional love does seem to be person specific. You can`t tell yourself, or force yourself to feel it, or command it to show up when you 'want' it.

It`s either there, or it`s not.

The great thing about being poly, is we don`t have to force ourselves to stop loving someone, if we can`t be with them. You learn to love from afar, and carry on investing in new loves elsewhere.

Great sentiment Superjast. BTW what is a super jast? I absolutely believe this to be true about love, unconditional to be specific. I have experienced it really. As always Immaterial you bring up great points.

Last edited by Sorcha17; 07-24-2010 at 05:15 PM.
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  #12  
Old 07-25-2010, 01:14 AM
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Mohegan Mohegan is offline
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Good reads! Great topic!

Unconditional love became a huge topic for my family when I found out about Karma's most recent affairs. I can't tell you how many times I heard, "how can you still love someone who hurts you like that?"

How can I not? Should I attempt to stop loving him b/c he made a mistake (or several)? Yes he hurt me to the core, but I love him. And had he not taken responsibility and not worked to resolve the problems, I would have left, b/c love doesn't equal door mat for me, but I'd still love him.

Not parts and pieces of him. I love Karma. Yes there are things about him that drive me up a wall, but they are part of the intricate web that makes up who he is. How can I love part and not the whole? That doesn't make sense to me.

It's been hard for him to understand, as he grew up in a "I love the good you not the bad you" type home as well. He began learning to hide mistakes to keep from feeling that sense of unlove mixed with disapproval. My heart aches to think of a child living that life. But the adult Karma hid his mistakes from me for fear of the same type of rejection. That's just alien to me. My parents always tried to help me find a way to reach the same goal without the same consequence. I was very rarely afraid to say " Mom I screwed up."

Which in turn has influenced my adult life. I find studies on our parents influence on our adult life very interesting. Parents are not perfect, but there is no hiding the fact that they influence us in our adult lives.

So in a long winded roung about way, that's unconditional love to me. It means mistakes are forgiven and lessons are learned and the love is always there regardless. Anger doesn't equal love or no love, pain doesn't either, neither does happiness. Love is something of it's own. Influenced by all emotions but comanded by none.
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  #13  
Old 07-25-2010, 01:31 AM
RGee91 RGee91 is offline
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I believe unconditional love is just what it says, unconditional. No matter what someone does or how they treat you, even if they stop loving you, you still have an unfaltering love for them, even if a relationship ends, it may no longer be a romantic love, but just a love for the person. I think that all parents should have unconditional love, no matter what their children do.

I also believe that in marriage there should be an unconditional love, which is for some reason so rare these days. It's so weird to me how people get married, say "for better or for worse" knowing full well that they really mean "for better or *mumbles incoherently*". This may be controversial and I don't mean to offend anyone here, but I believe the divorce rate in america is just pathetic and proves nobody takes their vows seriously anymore. When I hear divorced people say things like "we got divorced cause he cheated" or all the other "go-to" reasons, I always say "that's the for worse part." Don't make the vow if you know you don't mean it

sorry about the rant...hope i didn't offend any divorced people... it just irks me that str8 people can get married and divorced in a day and nobody bats an eyelash, yet it's so taboo for us gays
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  #14  
Old 07-26-2010, 04:11 PM
immaterial immaterial is offline
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Yes, I agree the double standard regarding marriage is quite hypocritical. Funny that the "Defense of Marriage" laws are always proposed and voted on by so many confirmed philanderers. :-)

I have enjoyed everyone's perspective on unconditional love. I continue to meditate on how I can live from a place of love and not from a transactional orientation of always expecting something in return. It's slowly dawning on me how I grew up in a context of "love scarcity," and how infinitely abundant the reality is.

Immaterial
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  #15  
Old 11-06-2010, 11:04 PM
Athena Athena is offline
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I am really impressed by the topic, discussion of, and all comments. I don't think I am capable of true unconditional love. I think that for ordinary people yes, even spouses who are beating each other up physically, I can still see the healthy easily lovable parts, and still have a love for their trying to do therapy in the hope they can live in a healthier way. However, there are people like Hitler, like Ahmadinejad who just go out there and say I want to kill everyone who isn't exactly like me - and I just can't find them lovable in any way whatsoever.
I can however, love basically good people who because what they were taught as children is messed up, think they can't love another perfectly good human who doesn't happen to be straight, or they think the only way to love some one who isn't Christian, Muslim, Jewish or whatever is to make that person just like him or her to keep that person from going to hell. Or they will tell people you can't get married to more than one person, because my pastor always said you couldn't so you'll go to hello operator (hell) because your spiritual advisor has a different opinion. (Or people who say you can't live together except if religiously married to those who think no piece of vellum or papyrus in the universe can keep two or more or whatever people together when they don't want to be together anymore). I know that they are thinking the same thing about me. They are thinking, good person, I love her, how do I save her from herself. The difference being, I think, good person, I love him or her, how do I save the world from the mess they are making thinking they're doing good?
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  #16  
Old 12-15-2010, 03:56 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Indeed, a very interesting topic..............

I think the concept of 'unconditional' love is tightly tied to one's definition of the word 'love'.

Because for most people I think the word includes both and adjective and verb tense.

If we define 'love' as our deep desire for someone's (everyone) health, happiness, good life etc, it's easier to generate a feeling & concept of universal, unconditional love.

However, when we must move from philosophy to action and actually play a role in bringing positive things to others, it can get to be hard. There are certain behaviors, attitudes, beliefs etc that make us unable to support someone in their quest for their happiness etc. Because their happiness may include unhappiness or harm to others.

So does this mean that the concept of 'unconditional' love cannot exist ?

Depends on your definition of love.

GS
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  #17  
Old 12-16-2010, 02:50 PM
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Carma Carma is offline
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Can you love a sociopath, unconditionally? Only 4% of the population qualifies, according to a book I just read, The Sociopath Next Door (so sorry, author's name not coming to me). They play on your sympathy, and they have no conscience. They don't "grow" a conscience, either -- they are generally just scheming a new way to manipulate. The book really made me question the idea of unconditional love. I'm not sure who could love these people, really. They can be pitied from afar, but up close and in your life, they will wreak havoc.
However, I do believe it's a worthy endeavor with the other 96% of the world!
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  #18  
Old 12-16-2010, 04:54 PM
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Mohegan Mohegan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carma View Post
Can you love a sociopath, unconditionally? Only 4% of the population qualifies, according to a book I just read, The Sociopath Next Door (so sorry, author's name not coming to me). They play on your sympathy, and they have no conscience. They don't "grow" a conscience, either -- they are generally just scheming a new way to manipulate. The book really made me question the idea of unconditional love. I'm not sure who could love these people, really. They can be pitied from afar, but up close and in your life, they will wreak havoc.
However, I do believe it's a worthy endeavor with the other 96% of the world!
Yes you can. I love Karma unconditionaly. Apparently what your book hasn't told you is that most sociopaths will "grow" a conscience as they get older. Not all. But many of them as they become adults, see how others live and react and want the same thing. So they try to get it. some only achieve immitation, but others ,like Karma, put in the hard work it takes to actualy feel and actualy care.

Karma and I have gone through many things that the Karma now would never do. I still love him, I loved him then and I love him now, in spite of and because of, everything we have been through. Honestly, I love him more now, because I have seen how strong he truly is, and how much this means to him.
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  #19  
Old 12-29-2010, 08:14 AM
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mirrormelovely mirrormelovely is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clairegoad View Post
There are several paragraphs/ maybe a chapter in One:A love Story by Richard Bach that deals with this.

Bach is describing his love for his wife, Leslie, and describes parallel lives where her experiences are very different, (i.e. a drug addict or a prostitute) and questions if he would love her the same, if she was cynical, if she was jaded, if she didn't love him. Interesting discussion of unconditional love.

That's another book I need to re-read. I'm delaying reading the last few pages of The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress... it went too fast this time.

(This is how I remember the passage...I don't have the book for reference)

claire
I LOVE this book. I have thought about picking it back up again as it's been maybe 12 years since I last read it! Agreed...great book on revealing the core of unconditional love.
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  #20  
Old 01-13-2011, 07:02 PM
IanNairobi IanNairobi is offline
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Immaterial, I really appreciated reading your initial post on this thread (comments too, or course). I felt like much of it was a succinct and cogent description of what I currently struggle with myself. While it's been a fairly long process for my wife and I to emerge into an actively poly lifestyle after months of reflection and consideration, now that we're here I find that I am always much more comfortable when I'm receiving active support from one of the "little gods and goddesses" I create for myself. I'm quickly realizing that letting go of the fear is likely to be my biggest hurdle. And I loved this insight:

"I continue to meditate on how I can live from a place of love and not from a transactional orientation of always expecting something in return."
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