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  #21  
Old 10-14-2010, 08:07 PM
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I think you're right Derby. I'm not sure if you've followed the whole thread, but that's the realization I had somewhere in the middle there.

Basically the answer is "no, I don't want to risk our friendship over it." Easy answer. It's honestly just nice that I can be upfront with my wife about having a close friend that I'm attracted to. I don't know that it even needs to go any further.
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  #22  
Old 10-14-2010, 08:50 PM
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The other thing is, knowing what I know, there almost 'has' to be some correlation between her and my relationship with S. But I can't tell if it's her trying to keep my attention on her, or if she's intrigued by the idea that I might be "in demand." It's hard to say.
Well, I can give you the point of view of a wife
When my husband had an interest and confided in me, I felt much closer to him emotionally. I felt trusted, and like I was sharing something important in his life. It made me feel good about myself.
At the same time, when courting J (the woman in question), I took an active role in it. In a way, it's like I wanted to seduce her, as well, since if she was going to have a relationship with him, she had to take the whole package. That is, she wouldn't have a romantic or sexual relationship with me, but I'll be there, too. She had to be okay with that, so I guess I was desperate for her to like me.
So I ended up in some kind of a "courting mode", as well.

It's possible your wife is going through some of the same emotions.

Now, going back to your issue. It seems to me there are two things:

1) you both wish you had more partners.
If all there is to it is sex, a swinging club might be the perfect answer: no complications due to emotions, you don't know the people, etc. But careful, maybe you're on the wrong path. Maybe that wouldn't work for you. Maybe you need not just the sex, but emotions to go with it, or a commitment, or whatnot. It's worth thinking about it.
Some people are fine about the sex (for their partner) but find out they have a hard time with the emotions (of their partner for someone else). Some other people think they just want the sex but it doesn't leave them satisfied. They need something else.

2) You are attracted to your friend
It seems that you've realised there is more to it than physical attraction. Strong friendship? Romantic attraction? Either way, be absolutely honest about it with your wife (she has okayed the sex, but maybe she wouldn't be on board for more. It's hard to tell, so do a lot of talking) and then consider telling your friend.
However, it's like always with dating or confessing: she might not feel the same way. If like you said she saw you as "safe" because you're married, it might be a shock for her. She's had bad experiences, you say, so she needs to be reassured that you're not like all the other guys who disrespected her.
If you do talk to her about how you feel, make sure you let her now how you value her as a person and a friend. How you would be fine with no sex at all. Make sure she feels like an important person, valued as a woman, and not a piece of meat. This way, even if she doesn't feel the same way, I think that shouldn't endanger your friendship as much.

This feelings of being attracted (either physically or emotionally) to other people can be very confusing because we're taught they're wrong. As a result it's sometimes hard to know exactly what you feel. Sometimes it's harder to confess to physical attraction, because we're still told it's normal to be physically attracted to other people (as long as you don't do anything about it!). Confessing to others, but also to yourself, that you also have feelings for other people is much harder because there is a much stronger social stigma.

On the other hand, you are on a polyamorous forum here We're all about the feelings (well, we put them first at least). So I don't want to think we might have pushed you to say you also have feelings for her if you actually don't. The bottom line is, you need to figure out what it is exactly you want. It's the first and most important step, but often it's the hardest.
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  #23  
Old 10-14-2010, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
I think you're right Derby. I'm not sure if you've followed the whole thread, but that's the realization I had somewhere in the middle there.

Basically the answer is "no, I don't want to risk our friendship over it." Easy answer. It's honestly just nice that I can be upfront with my wife about having a close friend that I'm attracted to. I don't know that it even needs to go any further.
Oops busy at work and I think I missed some of the thread (either that or you all just post way too quick). Carry on...
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  #24  
Old 10-14-2010, 09:24 PM
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Oops busy at work and I think I missed some of the thread (either that or you all just post way too quick). Carry on...
I buttered him up there for ya derby. We think so much a like you and I. That's why you're my sweets *kiss*
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  #25  
Old 10-14-2010, 10:26 PM
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It was cool to be honest with my wife. We talked more at some length and I let her read the thread. I think she has a good grip on things. She told me the sex wasn't related to S; which really puts my mind at ease.

It turns out C had had some of these thoughts before, too, and had not felt comfortable discussing them, for basically the same reason. It's so awesome to just be able to be honest and candid with my partner, I think things can only get better now.

Regarding S, I think all the advice I've gotten has been so helpful. If I'm being honest, I didn't expect everyone to be so caring and worried about her. Kind of eye opening, refreshing. Anyways, it's all out in the open now...time to just see where things go!
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  #26  
Old 10-15-2010, 11:22 PM
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Not sure if itís any help, but here I go

We(my partner and I) had a threesome with my really good friend (at this point she was his friend too). She is my friend from years back. Sex didnít ruin any friendship for us(neither for me, nor for my partner). The emotional connection, bond, trust that we had is still there now (me and her). Itís all about how you go about it.
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  #27  
Old 10-15-2010, 11:54 PM
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Thanks. What I've come to realize is, as a couple my wife and I can set whatever terms we are comfortable with. The real x factor is the friend, and how she feels about everything.

It's encouraging to know you were able to have that with a friend and not have things get all crazy. My wife is really only worried about the emotional connection, which, while present, isn't overpowering.
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  #28  
Old 10-16-2010, 12:01 AM
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Thanks. What I've come to realize is, as a couple my wife and I can set whatever terms we are comfortable with. The real x factor is the friend, and how she feels about everything.

It's encouraging to know you were able to have that with a friend and not have things get all crazy. My wife is really only worried about the emotional connection, which, while present, isn't overpowering.
I was afraid before that it would make things go crazy between us...but then we started making out a year ago (me and her) and it didn't change the part that I was afraid of...and the thing is I didn't hide from her that I really liked her. It was pretty obvious...and with respect and honesty, lots of things can be achieved
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  #29  
Old 10-16-2010, 05:04 PM
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Yea. Apologies for the litany of swear words below, not sure about the rules here but...I'm just hungover and not filtering well.

I'd like to hear what the posters have to say about this...especially you, redpepper

I went out with S and two other of our "house guys" last night, and we had a total blast. I assisted S with a digit-snag - not gonna lie, we make a pretty fucking awesome team. (guy was actually pretty cute, too...)

C worked all day, and had to work early this morning, so she opted out. I'd be lying if I said she probably wasn't at least a tad weirded out about me going out with S, after I'd been 100% open with her, but she said go have a good time, so I did.

S and I ended up catching a ride back to her place, since it was fairly close to the bar we were at.

So... there's a lot of talk on here / in the community about ground rules. I figured since we'd broached the subject, we should lay some down, just so they were in place - I guess I figured, better to be weird with rules than not with none. So the rules were basically go have fun with your friend, and hands off - i.e., nothing past the friend boundary we had already established. (I might add that, those are the rules that were in place all along , but it felt better/right having them spoken, out loud for some reason.) At some point C texted me "do what you want." I responded, (something to the extent of) "no, there are rules in place, and they will be obeyed, and it's not something we're going to change through a text message."

So, I ended up back at S's place shortly after last call. I was totally hammered, and so was S. I gave her a much-needed back rub, and then came the word-vomit...

Long story short (okay I've re-read this and it is long, but bear with me), I ended up telling her basically everything. I told her about C and I, wanting to experience more, etc. I told her about some of C's fantasies that led to the discussion, and I told her pretty flatly that I was attracted to her. It's hard to recount everything, honestly, because I was drunk, and it was really difficult, BUT, I was totally honest. Some things came up...

I guess I'm not the first married guy that's been interested in her - although I'm the only one that's been honest with her, which made me feel good. She said I was hot, and I 'think' she verified that she was attracted to me (felt really good. I 'was' lookin' pretty damn good.) It was obviously a stride out of her comfort zone to discuss it, which is not surprising in the least, but there ya go.

To make it really simple, I just told her how I felt. I love being her close friend. I told her I value her, and that, basically, even though I was attracted to her, and even if it was "okay" with my wife, I didn't want to fuck her like some notch on the post.

She's had an (extremely, like 2 times or so...) casual sexual relationship with one of the house boys, a guy that's one of my 3 best friends (the house boys.) It's weird to know - on the one hand, it hasn't ruined their relationship, so I think that casual 'fun' sex could work between the two of us - THAT BEING SAID, I realized something important: She'll never be close to him because of it. Maybe I'm putting words in her mouth, but I'm pretty sure I'm right. What do you think, gals?


I also feel like a fucking hypocrite, because her casual relationship with him made me extremely jealous for some reason. It hurts to say this because I'm not proud of it, but the thought process was "You can sleep with my other friends, why not me?" Like some party favor. Sick.

I don't approve of what she did with him, because it wasn't for fun - I think she did it to feel good about herself when she needed it, and my own opinion is that she always ends up feeling worse for the wear in hindsight. Maybe it's just me, and my lack of experience, but there ya go. Sex can be for fun, sure, but if it's for fun it should be in the name of fun - not because you're feeling down and you need a pick-me-up. Different things.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is, for better or worse, what I really wanted was to connect with her and not feel guilty about it. Being open and honest was part of that, and I had to say what I had to say in order to do that. It's odd, but, I felt that jealousy fade immediately when I realized that (she might be) closer to me than she's ever been to any of the assholes that have used her, and used her, and used her. And honestly, fuck those guys, I want to kick their teeth in. I feel hatred for them. I feel hatred for the people that have used her - some I'll forgive, some I wont. I can't believe I wanted to join their ranks.

I look back at the post I initially made and I actually feel sick because of it. Because it reminds me of every other guy who's slept with her. They're all assholes. Fucking sick to my stomach. I had built up this version of her in my head that was impervious to feeling; an object.

Honestly, redpepper was so goddamn right...SO RIGHT. Her first post WASN'T harsh, it was goddamn real and true. I'm so fucking happy she said what she said in that post a few days ago - because, for fuck's sake, how self-centered was I being? I know it sounds contrived to say I felt that way then, and "whoa," now I've opened my eyes, but that's honestly how it's been. Maybe people that have already been around a few times know this more naturally, but when you've only had sex with one person ever, and for ten years at that, well...is it weird that someone could have an incredibly solid emotional relationship with their wife, but still think like a little idiot kid when it comes to other relationships?

It makes me sick to think I would have treated her that way. And the worst part? I probably could have. She probably would have. And then I would have been just another in a long line of fucking assholes that stopped by, used her, didn't care about her, and went along on their business. Just like pepper said. Yea, fuck that.

So I guess what I'm saying is...I feel a lot better now? Like a patient in recovery. I told her how I felt, and that felt good just saying it, and I told her how much I valued her as a friend. I don't know if I could have felt the same way if I hadn't included that I was attracted to her; being all-the-way honest is kind of an all-or-nothing deal, in my (albeit newly formed) opinion. I also couldn't have felt that way if I hadn't been honest with my wife.

It feels like a lot of drama just to tell a friend how I felt...I wish more people could just be honest all the time. It's honestly just so eye opening to me. Even though I've always "played by the rules," I was still a manipulative asshole. Manipulative assholes try to twist rules around, they contort things to make them suit themselves...and that's what was in my head, and that's almost my natural instinct. No more. Never again.

Well I think I've rambled on long enough. I could probably go on and on, but I think the important bits are up there.

I'm nursing an excruciating hangover, apologies for how disjointed this is.

You guys opened my eyes. Thanks. It mattered.
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  #30  
Old 10-16-2010, 11:48 PM
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Wow mumbles! I can't make this smile big enough!

You'd be amazed at how many people don't figure out what you did and continue to do what they do for fun without consciousness and empathy; communicating before hand. The disconnect can get bigger and then they wonder why. Not that casual sex is not worth something just for reasons of fun, not to feel more self worth. Its hard to know at the time, which is why its so important to keep in tune with ourselves and be conscious of what we do.

Good for you and your breakthrough! Pass on what you've learned my friend. So that others can learn from you now.
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