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Old 08-26-2010, 04:11 AM
eskimo eskimo is offline
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Default She can't talk to her friends without feeling like a whore

So I met someone aa few months ago. I really like this lady (m).

We met a few months ago, at a brunch that my wife took me too. My wife (s) was a surrogate mother (she gave birth at the end of July), and M is too. I loved watching M play with her son and my kids, and she's also extremely pretty and attractive.

I talked to S about my attraction and she asked me not to mention us being open unless it "just came up", so I respected her wishes. M and I started developing a plutonic friendship. We went to the beach, I helped rake her lawn when she was on bedrest, I took her to the hospital when she had an ear infection. Nothing more than just a friendship.

And then one day the topic came up. It came out that S & I were in an open relationship. She asked me if I was attracted to her, I said yes, and things got off to a very fast start. We had sex in my living room that night.

And then things got complicated. When M & I went out later that week for dinner, she told me a lot about her past that I didn't know before that. She had recently gotten out of some abusive relationships (the last one the guy tried to run her over with his truck), and only a few months earlier the very thought of ever being sexual with a guy made her feel physically ill. And also that her first time having sex was when she was forced to at 12 years old.

Obviously she's had a traumatic past, but I really admire the fact that she's a very strong woman who has pushed through a ton of shit and has done some incredible things, being a single mother to two wonderfully healthy and awesome children, having so much compassion for people who can't have children that she's carrying one of another couple she hadn't really known, watching the way she plays with little kids, and seeing that she hasn't given up on her dreams, and just having the strength to pull herself out of the cycle some people can get trapped in when they're in abusive relationships. It's incredible to meet someone so amazing like that. S is amazing too, in some ways for the same reasons, and in other ways for different reasons. Im lucky enough to know two women who are so incredible.

I did say something stupid that night (if I wasn't so thick, I would have known the answer to the question before I even asked it), I asked her if it would bother her if I introduced her to someone as my girlfriend. She said she wasn't even thinking about it. I shouldn't have asked, it was really dumb of me.

Things got confusing, she wasn't pulling away, but she wasn't really engaging in a sexual relationship either. I knew there were many reasons why she wouldn't, all of which were understandable, reasonable, and more than fair. Last week, we went out mini-golfing, S watched our kids and her kids.

Afterwards we went back to her place, she said no to sex, and on the way out I told her that I knew she wouldn't want to talk about what was going on, but that I wanted her to stay friends with me no matter what else, and she said I was cute and kissed me. That gave me hope that we might still have more of a relationship than just friendship.

Tonight, I was hanging out with her again, and she said that in addition to still trying to be OK with herself, she usually likes to talk to her friends about her boyfriends. And with me, she can't do that without feeling like a whore. I'm crestfallen. I was so hopeful that in a few years, we might all move in together and become one big family together, Me, S, M and the 4 kids.

I'm sad, I've got about 4 shots of tequila in me and I'm still sad. I'm making her feel like a whore, and she deserves better than that. She's not a whore by any means, she's a wonderful, amazing and beautiful woman.

I want to make her not feel like a whore, but at the same time I have to recognize that I can't control her feelings. If she's reacting to this negatively, then it's probably best for her happiness that we aren't anything more than friends. And I have to put that ahead of whatever else I may want.

But I'm really, really sad about this. I saw a future with her in it. But she doesn't seem to feel the same way. I wish I could change it. Has anyone else been in a similar position, can it be changed, or do I just have to deal with it and move on, like I think I do?
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Old 08-26-2010, 05:28 AM
Quath Quath is offline
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I think that is a self image she will have to overcome. She could easily call herself a stud, a player, or just a woman who likes you. It is all in how she wants to see herself.

My guess is that her past will play a lot into this. I have dated several women who have been sexually abused when they were young. There is a lot of stuff they have to work through. These women were very good at not showing the hurt or abuse they felt until they really felt comfortable with someone.

You could try to offer some words of comfort like say that anyone who would think she was a whore for this is not someone she should want to hang around.

My problem is that I get too logical. One woman I dated said something similar. My first reply was, "But I am not paying you." Not the best of answers.
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Old 08-26-2010, 06:54 AM
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redpepper redpepper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eskimo View Post
I was so hopeful that in a few years, we might all move in together and become one big family together, Me, S, M and the 4 kids.
Wow, this is kinda moving a little too fast I think. You seem to be coming on a bit strong perhaps. Or investing too much into her too early. Maybe she is fine with just a bit of a cuddle and closeness, and some sex every now and then. Maybe the title of girlfriend is a little hasty and the whole her living with you all a bit rushed...

ya, slow it down and give her some breathing room. She sounds a bit overwhelmed to me and perhaps not as interested as you. Give it time and space and maybe don't invest so much yet. It's all new to her and the relationship is new to both of you. Nurture it and allow it to grow into what it will be, without expectations. Maybe if you tell her that you are slowing down and not going to rush a good thing, it will free her up to relax and get to know her position... she will be a metamour to your wife after all and a secondary I would think for a time... all stuff to adjust to. That is no small thing for anyone!
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Old 08-26-2010, 12:58 PM
eskimo eskimo is offline
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Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
Wow, this is kinda moving a little too fast I think. You seem to be coming on a bit strong perhaps. Or investing too much into her too early. Maybe she is fine with just a bit of a cuddle and closeness, and some sex every now and then. Maybe the title of girlfriend is a little hasty and the whole her living with you all a bit rushed...

ya, slow it down and give her some breathing room. She sounds a bit overwhelmed to me and perhaps not as interested as you. Give it time and space and maybe don't invest so much yet. It's all new to her and the relationship is new to both of you. Nurture it and allow it to grow into what it will be, without expectations. Maybe if you tell her that you are slowing down and not going to rush a good thing, it will free her up to relax and get to know her position... she will be a metamour to your wife after all and a secondary I would think for a time... all stuff to adjust to. That is no small thing for anyone!
I fully admit that it started out pretty fast, but I never told her anything about seeing us all becoming one big family together at all. That was mostly from conversations S and I had.

S and I had talked about seeing other people and said it was OK before, but never talked about the actual details of it. When things started with M, S started asking me where it was going, and after I sat down and thought about where I might want it to go, that was the conclusion I came to.

I know that she'd need things to move slowly, so I hadn't been talking about things that might happen down the road. After the conversation where I stupidly asked her if she'd be OK with me calling her my girlfriend we hadn't talked at all about defining what we were or what we were doing, I was trying not to bring it up, to give her room to figure out what she'd want.

This isn't the decision I hoped she'd come to, but I certainly plan on giving her space and respecting her decision to just be friends. It's more important to me to have at least a friendly relationship with her than to have none at all.
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Old 08-26-2010, 01:25 PM
X-User1335 X-User1335 is offline
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And you did say that you were hoping that in a few years. That's like 3 years. That's not moving to fast, IMO. That's actually taking your snail pace time! LOL!

She sounds like a good girl to me. If she weren't she wouldn't be having these kinds of feelings. I know you don't want her to be hurt and it be due to your relationship. Is she on the site here? Maybe you could tell her about it and she could do some reading.......I bet that would really help her overcome those feelings.

Take care!
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Old 08-26-2010, 03:30 PM
eskimo eskimo is offline
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Originally Posted by jennjuice View Post
And you did say that you were hoping that in a few years. That's like 3 years. That's not moving to fast, IMO. That's actually taking your snail pace time! LOL!

She sounds like a good girl to me. If she weren't she wouldn't be having these kinds of feelings. I know you don't want her to be hurt and it be due to your relationship. Is she on the site here? Maybe you could tell her about it and she could do some reading.......I bet that would really help her overcome those feelings.

Take care!
As far as I know she's not on the site here, it probably would help her, if she wants to be this way. I remember what really made me OK with it was an interview I hear from a radio show (I'm going to have to try and dig up the link), where someone was talking about how they were happy for their husband when he made out with someone he had a crush on for a long time.

S & I had been open for years, but I was never OK with doing anything myself, it felt cheap. The idea that I could have romantic feelings for more than 1 person made it feel nice instead.
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Old 08-26-2010, 06:51 PM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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I think a lot of women have to fight that image that "comfortable with your sexuality = slut". And polyamory does have a lot of negative connotations as well with the uninformed public.
My boyfriend was telling me, when he says he's poly people never really care. When he was with married women people didn't judge him or anything. But his girlfriends, when they came out, people saw them as sluts and voiced their disapproval. It's unfair and ridiculous, but that's how it goes sometimes.
Of course guys also have to fight the "he's a misogynistic jerk who wants a harem" stereotype, so I'm not saying they have it easy, either.

I think people a) think of sex too negatively, and b) can't wrap their head around the idea that there are feelings involved in polyamory.
Talking about you would probably be the equivalent of telling people she's a mistress or a swinger, I would say people react about the same to all three. While there is nothing wrong with swinging, for someone with such a heavy sexual history, it can be hard to accept her own sexuality, and be over-precocious in how she appears to her friends.
So, yes, it can be daunting for her... But you're not making her feel like a whore, society and her past experiences are.
Take your time with it, make sure to make her very comfortable and she should start feeling better about it.
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Old 08-26-2010, 07:17 PM
Ariakas Ariakas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonberry View Post
I think a lot of women have to fight that image that "comfortable with your sexuality = slut". And polyamory does have a lot of negative connotations as well with the uninformed public.
My boyfriend was telling me, when he says he's poly people never really care. When he was with married women people didn't judge him or anything. But his girlfriends, when they came out, people saw them as sluts and voiced their disapproval. It's unfair and ridiculous, but that's how it goes sometimes.
Quite glad to be in the location I am. When Pengrah and I talked about being open, we were both called sluts or people were indifferent. The third option was for them to join us ...

Quote:
Of course guys also have to fight the "he's a misogynistic jerk who wants a harem" stereotype, so I'm not saying they have it easy, either.
To call a spade a spade, this is an easy one to fight. There are misogynists in poly. OPP exists. If its a truly open relationship and not an OPP setup, then it is hard to put the misogynist label on someone

I think the easiest way to fight being called a slut is to not hide. Thats my take anyways. Its hard to slam someone who is enjoying their sexual lives when they are open and positive about it. The hiding and secrecy make it more apt to being attacked.
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Old 08-27-2010, 01:36 AM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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That is a very good point Ari. The more someone tends to hide people see it as shame instead of a fear of acceptance and it tends to validate the initial negative reaction they may have to it. This is something I'm struggling with myself. I've moved in with Bud where everyone knows me as his girlfriend (neighbors). Little do they know, My fiance will be moving up here with us in a matter of months. I'm not hiding it. I'm new and it really hasn't come up. Just casual hellos and chit chats about our children. My daughter has gotten close to one of the kids and her mom and I have chatted a bit and set up playdates. I worry what she will think. I worry that she won't allow her daughter and mine to play anymore. Due to custody fears for Bud's daughter we have decided not to tell our daughter either so I also worry about her hearing it from other kids instead of from us and having a negative reaction because she feels her parents have to hide it.

As for the whorey feeling... Bud and C have helped me through this. Wear my love with pride. I've got enough enjoyment and responsibility in my life for anyone with judgement about something that does not invole them. This was their advice and they are quick to remind me when I get worrisome over opinions.
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