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  #11  
Old 08-22-2010, 02:59 AM
X-User1335 X-User1335 is offline
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Majik,

I am in a triad. I don't worry about when they are out, that has never entered my mind. Humm....maybe I should be more of a thinker! LOL

To get right down to business, the real worry I have is one night they will decide to be together and I won't like it.

I don't want to feel that way and I want to make sure before it happens that I don't. I want to make sure that I feel nothing but happiness the first night they are together, alone.

I want it for them both, just as I know he wants it for her and I. I know he'll have this same question in his head, though we've never discussed it. Maybe that's the key. I am a big talker, but I have to yet speak to him about it. I suppose I need to. I think I need to talk to them both and let them both know how much I want the connection between them to be tight and boom in such a way that will make the clouds shutter!

I just don't want to feel jealous when they do it.

Honestly, I don't think I will.

I love her..........I love him. They both love me. I know that is a undenyable fact. I think I just helped myself by writing this response!

It's simple really. I love them, they love me, and they love each other. I'm not left out in that. Anything they do alone together I'll somehow be a part of because I'm a part of them both.

I love that.
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  #12  
Old 08-22-2010, 05:10 PM
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That sounds like something really important to keep in mind. And yes keep talking, if it turns out that there are feelings that suprise you. Talk about them, maybe journal them first so you can get them clear in your own mind. But it sounds like you are on the right track.

Majik
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  #13  
Old 08-22-2010, 05:48 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Hey Jen,

Damn you're so much like someone I know !

Creating problems before they actually appear.

Maybe (likely) you will feel some twinge of jealousy. But you've done all this hard work understanding what jealousy truly roots in - right ?????

So when it happens you'll be able to identify it, take it out and look at it, and toss it away as an incompatible animal emotion. Right ?

But playing with the tiger before he appears will only make him bigger and scarier. Maybe better to assume he may (or may NOT) appear and just have your weapon loaded. Spend enough time in the jungle and it's more likely eventually you may need it. But until you do just sling it.

GS
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  #14  
Old 08-23-2010, 12:28 AM
X-User1335 X-User1335 is offline
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Grounded, that's my plan. Learn all there is out there on it and if and when it rears it's ugly head be able to toss it away, where it belongs!!

PS..who do I remind you of?
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  #15  
Old 08-23-2010, 01:51 AM
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Default First Time Jealousy

Maybe other people react to this differently, but to me there's a logical part of the mind and then there's something instinctive, and even when it's me I don't have complete control of the instinctive part. Some people may be better suited to sharing mates, possibly a cultural thing, I'm really not sure. In some societies it's normal, everyone does it, no big deal. Most of us in the States were raised otherwise, possibly not all of us. But, I've seen jealousy arise in the partners of my partners even if they weren't new to the concept of polyamory, especially when the relationships were more than casual. Possibly among men it's an ego-driven process, if you're "the best" it's ok, and if you think you have a real competitor it's not. I've seen this in myself just recently, from the other side of the coin so to speak, and even though I recognized what was happening it still took three weeks to process and burn out. The instinctive mind gets bored and looks for something else to do after awhile, fortunately. Until it reaches that point life is horrible. Fascinating process to watch, miserable to be trapped in it, eventually if you're patient you can work through it. If the misery is centered on someone else -- someone else has the jealousy problem -- I'm not sure what the right solution is. I've sometimes backed away to make things easier on the people I care about, but there may be better answers than that. Actually I'd hope there are, because that one always sucks.
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  #16  
Old 08-23-2010, 01:55 AM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sage View Post
@ Jenjuice re interesting jealousy stories. You're in luck, I wrote mine up on my blog .
http://polyamorouspeople.typepad.com...ompersion.html

At the time I was a total mess but I now see it as a kind of "jealousy crisis". I've felt jealousy since but never as bad. This happened over two years ago and I can still relate to the feelings but I can also see some humor in it now.

Can anyone else relate to a "jealousy crisis"? When you're hit by it like an emotional ton of bricks and all rational thought goes flying out the window?
Sage, I could completely relate to that feeling. I have felt it before. I have lived it before. I could see myself in your story.
The thing is... It wasn't a "jealousy crisis" for me. I never saw it as that. I never thought of it as that.
For me, it was a terrible, terrible experience of abandonment and loneliness. I've actually experienced it a couple of times, each worse than the next.
But there was never another woman involved. Never. And it wasn't always my boyfriend, either... Friends, family, too.

I'll give you my strongest one: I was supposed to have my first time (ever) and my boyfriend never showed up. I called him, he didn't answer. I had the apartment (my parents', at the time) to myself for that day, had planned out the whole evening, he never came.
I was left alone and it was horrible. Every second that past I resented him more. As I finally fell asleep after an incredibly long night of calling, texting, crying, I just felt empty.
It turned out the next day that he had spent the night in the hospital... Nothing too serious, he was out the next day, but it was definitely something I could understand, and certainly not his fault. It didn't "fix" the fact that I was left so lonely, but most of the negative feelings just vanished. Oh, so he hadn't abandoned me. He hadn't left me. He was still there. Really, in the end, I was kind of the one who hadn't been there for him, in a way. It really changed my perspective on the whole thing.

That feeling, I believe, at least in my case, isn't jealousy. It's loneliness, abandonment, the feeling of not being appreciated, not being important. In your story Sage, I feel like it might have been the same thing. I could be wrong but tell me, if it had been a business trip rather than going to see his other girlfriend, and the rest had happened exactly the same way, would you have felt the same, or would it have been different?
Your feelings had nothing to do with his girlfriend I feel (and I'm sorry if I'm completely mistaken), they had to do with you, and how it made you feel.

I've worked on myself to be less dependent on people and realise that things do happen. When someone doesn't answer their phone, I used to assume they were either upset with me or too busy having fun to answer. But now I realise that's not the case.
I think it takes a lot of trusting to stop feeling that way. You need to trust that even though they're away and not in contact with you, these people still care about you, and you're still important to them. Just like they're still important to you. In the end, for me it turned out to be my own insecurities talking, and the reason why the person or people in question couldn't be reached was irrelevant to that. And the time, with no contact, no knowledge of what they were, what they were doing, I obsessed and imagined the worst and fell into a depressive state, mixed with a lot of resentment because they "were hurting me", and "if they loved me they wouldn't be doing that to me", but really, I was doing it to myself.

So, I recognise myself in your story, but in my case at the very least, I wouldn't say it was jealousy. I'd say it was abandonment, possibly withdrawal, and a lack of self-confidence. I've always seen jealousy as being directed at "the other one", or at least something where "the other one" is relevant, but in your case you're not talking about how you thought she was better, or that he loved her more than you, you were annoyed that you couldn't reach him and it made you feel like he had brushed you off.

I realise I wasn't there and might just be projecting my experience on yours, so I'm sorry if I seem out of line there.
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  #17  
Old 08-23-2010, 05:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonberry View Post
That feeling, I believe, at least in my case, isn't jealousy. It's loneliness, abandonment, the feeling of not being appreciated, not being important........

I've worked on myself to be less dependent on people and realise that things do happen. When someone doesn't answer their phone, I used to assume they were either upset with me or too busy having fun to answer. But now I realise that's not the case.

I think it takes a lot of trusting to stop feeling that way. You need to trust that even though they're away and not in contact with you, these people still care about you, and you're still important to them. Just like they're still important to you. In the end, for me it turned out to be my own insecurities talking, and the reason why the person or people in question couldn't be reached was irrelevant to that. And the time, with no contact, no knowledge of what they were, what they were doing, I obsessed and imagined the worst and fell into a depressive state, mixed with a lot of resentment because they "were hurting me", and "if they loved me they wouldn't be doing that to me", but really, I was doing it to myself.
I like this. It backs up my theory of jealousy for myself. There is always something behind jealousy. Until I find what's behind it or at the bottom of it, it is jealousy. I have to walk right up to the feelings and pull them all a part. Jealousy is not one emotion/feeling, it is many all lumped together. Once pulled a part, then it becomes something a group of feelings, as you have said above Tonberry.

We, as a culture are not used to feeling envy or jealousy. It makes us feel uncomfortable and we try to avoid what makes us uncomfortable. That isn't always the best plan I don't think because it doesn't move us forward. When it comes to poly people being jealous, we really do need to look at it because often other people are relying on us to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonberry View Post
I've always seen jealousy as being directed at "the other one", or at least something where "the other one" is relevant, but in your case you're not talking about how you thought she was better, or that he loved her more than you, you were annoyed that you couldn't reach him and it made you feel like he had brushed you off.
This is an interesting thought. hmmmm... so what you are saying is that its only jealousy if it's to do with someone else, rather than how one feels about a situation?

I think it can easily be both. But I hadn't thought of different kinds of jealousy....

neon offers some great threads. I hope that they were helpful. doing a tag search might help you find more.
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  #18  
Old 08-23-2010, 05:29 AM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
This is an interesting thought. hmmmm... so what you are saying is that its only jealousy if it's to do with someone else, rather than how one feels about a situation?
It seems to me jealousy is wanting what someone else has, and resenting that person for having it when you don't/ when you want to be the only person to. With that definition, there needs to be another person to be jealous of, right?

It could very well be that my definition is at fault, mind you. I see jealousy as being angry at other people for what they have, or feeling bad that you, in comparison, don't have it.
The feeling on loneliness wasn't really a comparison to someone else. I didn't think my boyfriend was with someone else, didn't care about it much. I only cared that he was neglecting me, from my point of view.

I can see how they can be linked if you're being neglected because of another person, but then you have to ask yourself, "am I feeling bad only because I am neglected, or also because the other person is treated well?"
I feel that a jealous person tends to still feel jealous when they are NOT being neglected.

But I guess you are right that jealousy can take many forms.

EDIT: To give more examples of what I mean:

Imagine a woman is okay with her straight husband hanging out with his male friends, but not with his female friends. From the woman's point, it is the same lack of time spent with him. The difference comes from who that time is spent with. Therefore I see that as jealousy.

It can be situational too though. If it's fine to spend the night and play videogames, but not spend the night and have sex, that's also a form of jealousy, because it's tied to the activity.

But in my case, whether he was hanging out with friends, male or female, playing videogames or having sex, that wasn't a concern at all. The problem was that he wasn't there with me when he was supposed to and to me it meant "you're not important".

So I guess it felt like a different category of emotion to me, purely self-centred and not focused on what he was doing, but on the fact I wasn't enjoying his company. If that clarifies it in any way.

Last edited by Tonberry; 08-23-2010 at 05:37 AM.
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  #19  
Old 08-23-2010, 05:54 AM
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It seems to me jealousy is wanting what someone else has, and resenting that person for having it when you don't/ when you want to be the only person to. With that definition, there needs to be another person to be jealous of, right?
wouldn't that other person be the one he is spending time with? the other person he is treating well? is excited to be with? wouldn't that be wanting what they have, in other words your partners time? resenting that they are spending time with them and not with you?

This can happen even if you spend tons of time with a partner. Sometimes, I think the jealousy of which we speak is akin to an ache as dynamics adjust to fit in another. There seems to be an element of uncomfortableness as another person is added to ones life... the balance goes off in the whole tribe when dynamics change. Even if we may be perfectly compersioning all over the place, there still can be an uncomfort that presents as jealousy... or perhaps envy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonberry View Post
So I guess it felt like a different category of emotion to me, purely self-centred and not focused on what he was doing, but on the fact I wasn't enjoying his company. If that clarifies it in any way.
Yes, the activity at hand can also make a huge difference... mostly because if a partner has decided to go and play video games once a week at a friends house then there is likely to be no after emotions attached to that. They will come home and life carries on... with them going over to a new girlfriends house to get to know them better and have sex, the likelihood of them coming home with an emotional component is high. That kind of dynamic can mean more of a struggle with jealousy of the type we are talking about.
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