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  #11  
Old 05-11-2010, 05:12 PM
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Mohegan Mohegan is offline
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Red Pepper- It may take a bit for me to answer you, so I want you to know I am not ignoring your post or questions.

Last edited by Mohegan; 05-11-2010 at 05:18 PM.
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  #12  
Old 05-11-2010, 05:21 PM
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No problem M, its a big question and I would be honoured if you responded at all. I just really want to understand. Thanks for your consideration.
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  #13  
Old 05-11-2010, 05:36 PM
Ariakas Ariakas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohegan View Post
It really did help, thank you. Aside from the fact that we were already discussing a poly relationship. You and I share an almost identical situation. I think one of the hardest things for me is my hubby has cheated all through our relationship. I went from being Completely open to anything when we first met to closing up and getting more and more paranoid with each time. Yet I keep forgiving him. This is the only one that lasted more than once or twice and the only one he's loved. It seems that he only cheats at the points our relationship is on auto pilot or my illness has gotten to the point that I want no sexual contact for weeks at a time. At first I thought, what a jerk, I can't help my illness. But I realized that he was feeling ignored, and that being my care taker takes a lot out of him and he just wanted that small act of acknowledgment and affection, and I was so caught up in myself I ignored him. Along with our inability to communicate, that is something we are working on.
I would like to coin something in here. Its all good that you keep forgiving him but I find this odd. My wife has been sick on and off for years, which sometimes effects her sex drive. I have gone <<cough>> months without sex at times. It actually got to the point where my sex drive was declining because I just wasn't doing it. Luckily, things have resumed....

I have never been able to cheat (yes temptation rears its head, but for some reason I just can't do it, I consider myself lucky) and can't fathom how anyone can do it repeatedly, unless they enjoy cheating. Obviously there "can" be one offs, but you have a serial cheater on your hands. Maybe he enjoys the cheating as much as the sex.

PS he was a jerk...try and justify it anyway you like but by saying what you are saying gives men an excuse to keep cheating. Heck, you have given me an excuse to cheat

I am curious to see your answers to RP's questions too...
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  #14  
Old 05-11-2010, 07:37 PM
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That's a good point AR, some people just like the thrill of getting away with stuff and feel no shame and guilt afterwards. Even if they do, to them it was all worth it.

I was just talking to derby about affairs and cheating. Its a part of sailor life it seems. As is "don't ask don't tell (DADT). Sure some can justify to their hearts content because of that but it still causes damage to innocent people who they profess to love. Not only that, it can also perpetuate the endless cycle of the slavery of children to the sex trade in other countries, create damaged women who think they are not worth more than the bodies that house their souls etc etc... I'm not saying that is the case here but I do believe that to forgive over and over again perpetuates an already damaged culture in this way. Its passed on to kids living in homes where one is being dishonest. Any kind of "not talking about it" silence is known in families, whether its verbalized or not. Kids aren't stupid, they suck everything up like sponges. If they are not taught to talk and be open then they won't be either as grown ups..

I could go on, but really I don't know what the story is here so I don't want to project my thoughts too much as they may not be valid.
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  #15  
Old 05-11-2010, 10:43 PM
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I'm sorry, what does your need to be taken care of have to do with it?
Our relationship and he as a person gets ignored. This is an undeniable problem that needs dealt with. From what I have read about spouses being caregivers, they get their own "symptoms" form the illness of their spouse. His symptoms were being ignored so he looked elsewhere for comfort and a way to alleviate the symptom.

He made an agreement with you and he broke it.... why do you keep forgiving him?
I don't know how to answer that. I love him. I do believe part of why this is a repeat action has to do with problems in our relationship that instead of dealing with, we fix enough to bandage the wounds and then try to forget about it. No behaviors, for either of us are actually changed.
Does he not just have his behaviour reinforced each time because he knows you will forgive him?
Possibly. I have left. Once before we were married and once 3 yrs ago. At the point 3 yrs ago I had already started to file for divorce. He promised to never let the issues get in the way again. He promised to come to me and discuss things. About a yr ago I noticed a big change in him. He stopped caring about everything and everyone. He was only out to get what he wanted. After a lot of heart to hearts this week, I don't put that on myself or my medical issues. That was his inability to deal with some things from his past, but me not being there as a wife did play a role. This, if we make it through it, is the last time I will forgive him and he knows it. We both made eachother aware of what we were missing in the marriage. Yes he is the one that acted instead of making me aware of the problem, but we are both to blame for the problems.
I don't understand how you could put this on yourself? He could of talked to you about how your illness was affecting him. Yet, he chose to do it again?
I don't put it all on myself, but I do understand that I played a role in hid unhappiness. Yes he could have/ should have talked me. That is part of what we are dealing with and plan on discussing with a therepist.

What is it that keeps you with him exactly... ?really to me it's bordering on abusing the situation if this continues to occur over and over again. To me I see him mocking you at this point. Why? because it seems to me that anyone that feels shame and guilt because they are getting away with a behaviour resorts to mockery to make themselves feel justified....

Maybe he is, but I don't think so. I do think he wants to get his way. Who doesn't? The difference is he didn't care who he hurt in the process. Why do I stay? He gets me. He knows me. He takes care of me. When times are better, we laugh a lot together, we think a lot alike. Spiritualy I don't think I will ever connect with someone the way we have. We have a lot of likes and dislikes in common. Honestly our views on sex and what is okay and not okay are the ONLY thing we disagree on/can't find a compromise. Aside from this situation, we rarely fight. We rarely disagree. When we do, we have a healthy discussion of the situation. For whatever reason, sex and our views on right and wrong in regards to it, is our problem. I can't just throw away what we have, because he screwed up.

Red Pepper-I hope I answered your questions. Sometimes it is hard for me to focus thoughts into words on a screen. Aside from our views on sex and him acting on it instead of working things out, he is a truly amazing man. He has never hurt me (aside from the mentioned situations). He takes great care of me and we greatly enjoy our time together. We just needed to remember where we began and why. If I could remove the feelings of mistrust in regards to other women, I'd say we are on a road to recovery and actualy dealing with our problems instead of pushing them aside. We are getting back to the beging. Taking time to make sure we are both having all of our needs met, physicaly, emotionaly and sexualy. I know it is hard to understand why I am with him. I hope I was able to explain it. I'v read a lot of what you've had to say in forum and respect your opinion and thoughts on things. I may not agree, but you may not agree with me either, but I still respect and will give thought to your words.

Last edited by Mohegan; 05-11-2010 at 10:48 PM.
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  #16  
Old 05-11-2010, 11:03 PM
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Thanks for the response. It sounds like you are both dedicated to figuring out how to work on this together. I respect that and understand.

There are others that will be connected to you entirely if this doesn't work out. Not just in certain areas. It is possible. But you can also connect with him entirely too if you are both chose to do the work. It might also mean that poly is the best option for him and therefore you if you are willing to stay with a man that you don't connect with sexually. Nothing wrong with that at all.

Thanks for sharing
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  #17  
Old 05-11-2010, 11:21 PM
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Before I got sick, we did connect in all ways. Unfortunatly, neither of us saw this coming nor were we prepared for the changes. That's part of what we need to work on. In the aftermath of my illness getting worse, we both were left going "WTF, what happened to the life I knew yesturday?" We are commited to working that out. I just wish we had made eachother aware of it sooner.

Maybe he is a serial cheater. But I think it is more that to him sex is sex and love is love and they do not need to meet. We have been discussing a poly lifestyle for yrs. But it seems like everytime I get to a point of trusting him and being okay with it, I find out he cheated.

So given that I may not be able to get over my anger for his g/f, I am going to have to learn how to handle a V instead of Triad we had agreed on.
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  #18  
Old 05-11-2010, 11:56 PM
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LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
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Mohegan-

To take the other side of this conversation for a moment,

IF you knew for CERTAIN that him having sex with other women had NOTHING to do AT ALL with his love for you.

Would that change your feelings?


I ask this because I was "a serial cheater" in the sense that I had a long term affair with GG while married to Maca.
I didn't have anyone else-but when I say long term-I mean years.

I know FOR CERTAIN in myself-that my love for Maca never waivered.
In fact I WANTED to do what he said he needed me to do-which was to be true to him by not having sex with anyone but him.
I just couldn't do it. Now before the flamers come to get me-Yes I physcially did do it-and it resulted in years of deep depression, medications, therapy. Nothing helped.

The issue wasn't that I could not stop having sex. I can, I did. The issue was that I could not stop being me inside and so when I was "obeyed the rules" in my outside life-my inner-self suffered because I was denying my true self.

I could only do that for so long (couple years actually) before I broke down and went back to GG....

So-my curiosity-and like RP-I don't know your husband-so it's all congecture. But my curiosity is-if you knew that the REAL problem was that he didn't know how to be HIMSELF in this society-with the rules and strictures we have created as a society, and so he broke down and chose the role of a "cheat" because the only other option was SO not true to who he was internally-

would you be able to let go of your angst and fully accept that he loves you and wants to be with you, but simply can't be the man a monogomous society expects??
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  #19  
Old 05-12-2010, 12:24 AM
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LR- thank you for your words. I do know that his love for me doesn't change simply b/c he is with other people. I want him to be his whole self. I love him b/c of who he is and this is part of him. I know that doesn't change his love for me.

Day one when we met I told him to be honest with me. Honesty is a HUGE thing for me. Cheating I can forgive, lieing is more difficult to get over. It bothers me that this is what he keeps disregarding.

I do want him to be his whole self, but I want to know I can trust him.

You're words did help me though. I've had a hard time figuring out why thi happens over and over, why can't he keep his promises even though he says he wants to? I think I have my answers now.
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  #20  
Old 05-12-2010, 12:37 AM
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I understand what you are saying clear as day..........
Now.

Unfortunately it took a near divorce in my life to get it.

Maca was clear to me from the beginning as well-his mom and his exwife cheated and he was point blank-
"Just tell me if you are going to F*** someone else so I can leave. I would rather you be honest with me."

My problem was that I did understand his words. BUT I also loved him and didn't want him to leave. No amount of struggle on my part could keep me healthy and whole by his terms though. I tried-I tried hard and I failed harder.

It wasn't until I found this board actually that I realized that what I thought was "something wrong with me" was actually just ME and that I needed to just BE me.

When I figured that out-it wasn't rocket science to tell him, "look I fucked up. I told you I was going to be your monogomous wife-but at the time I didn't know that I just can't do that, because it isn'twho I am. I do know now and feel I must tell you who I am. (elaborated then)."
I ended by letting him know that I do love him and would respect if these terms weren't agreeable and he felt he had to leave.
That was the hardest thing I'd done in my life.
But it was also the best.

Unfortunately-even though it seems obvious to be honest-our society flat does not teach honesty!
We teach ABOUT honesty-but we don't teach the art of BEING honest or ACCEPTING honesty from others.

So many of us are "behind the 8 ball" so to speak when we get into relationships and have to figure out how to express who we are to someone-because our WHOLE LIVES we've been taught to keep who we are to ourselves for our own "safety" and "well-being".

Crappy deal.

I think it's awesome that you two are trying to find a solution to the breakdown in your relationship. I don't know what the answers are-but I know being real was the answer in mine-and it was hard for both of us to see that being real HAD to come first.

I read something recently-in one of many self-help books I've read in the last 9 months.

They said, "you can't be true to ANYONE else, until you are completely true to yourself. First you have to acknowledge who you REALLY are, then you have to claim yourself and BE yourself to others. THEN you can be true to another person."
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