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  #201  
Old 08-12-2014, 11:36 AM
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swirl swirl is offline
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Originally Posted by Candiedlove View Post
I'm Asian. And isn't the definition of minority that they are, well, the minority?
Cuz in BC. Canada everyone else seems to be but mostly upwardly straight white folk and yes I am too a visible born raised Canadian bi racial but identify BLACK BABY yea!
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  #202  
Old 08-12-2014, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by kdt26417 View Post
Heh, greetings Hades36, good to see you again.

I think one's "poly visibility" (or likelihood to be practicing a poly life) is actually influenced by a complex array of factors, for example not just one's ethnicity but also what part of the world one lives in. I believe Eponine spoke well when she contrasted a world of collectivist culture against a world of individualist culture.

Perhaps this is off-topic and uncomfortable for me to ask, but, I am wondering if white folks have (up until now) felt more free to be openly gay than folks of color. What I'm driving at is, is it a "white man's tradition" to attend sexually innovative conventions (and potlucks) and to march in parades? Heck is any of this related to the 70's when it was much easier for white students to get into famous colleges and then come to fight for social change in the environment of those colleges? Maybe if the social order pushes some people onto a relatively blue-collar career path, those people won't have time for the kind of crusading that the privileged class congratulates itself for.

If I'm right in suggesting that, then I should note that it's probably mostly just an American (Western in general?) problem.

I mean I know minorities have sacrificed much to do marches and demonstrations for their racial rights ... yet, usually when I picture a get-together of gay people, I picture most of them being white. Is that a problem of my own personal perception, or does this poly/racial subject also relate to gay/racial matters? and kink/racial matters too, come to think of it. Even disability/racial matters. It's okay if I need a kick in the rear here for being way out of line. I just wanted to ask.

Sometimes I think that the internet is our greatest hope right now of dissolving some of the racial divides that exist (both in poly matters, and in other matters). It helps when people can't make as many assumptions about the ethnicity of the other person they've just met on their computer screen. At least that's my theory ...
Here in bc as most know gay marriage first caused Canada wide but i have both US cousins gay not out yet My canuck cuzins are way out 20 30 yrs previous or more some so America has a piety problem stol land still don't do nothin to raise your huddle masses so the need not grovel or huddle in slum areas but we have natives without electricity here blacks held hi but in prairies horrible but to the point no black culture there very different upbringing and here were no slaves they came here that said is it cultural you tell me a black woman of your american culture is far fr catching up to ours...Now that said yea ridicule comes from ignorance and religious freaks u have but here freedom first a ur free to be religious even tho in old testament organised religion an deities are ground on but all christian do love there saints to pray to so y would they look out side their taught n told theories of right an wrong was that not how these 2 countries were made by enslaving one race the two and standing on the necks of thee original peoples .
So to finish ,when religion an faith r realised to be separate then maybe that church dude who read you your sermons was wrong and its all in interoperated different be ye catholic to evangelistic so whose right we ALL ARE! for each to their own as it should be as wasn't it some dude in a book long ago said be happy in yourself and the knowledge it will bring now could b said the internet still need push harder!!!
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  #203  
Old 08-12-2014, 12:07 PM
JessicaBurde JessicaBurde is offline
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Based on discussions I've lurked on in the PolyResearchers group, the few surveys there are show that people in the US who identify as poly are predominantly white, with a smaller representation of minorities than the national demographics would suggest.

The problem with these surveys is they don't include poly folk who are in the closet or groups like those Hades mentioned. There's been some pretty huge discussions in PolyResearchers about whether groups like that should be considered poly or not. They are clearly non-monogamous and structure is a way that resembles some poly relationship, but if they choose not to ID as poly do we have the right to stick that label on them and claim them as part of what we are doing?

This ties in with larger discussions about poly and politics--do we push for poly rights (as someone whose kids were taken from her for being poly my answer is whole-heartedly "Yes!"). If we do can we focus on poly rights, or should we include all forms of ethical non-monogamy in our fight? If we push for poly rights will people who don't ID as poly be covered by the same protections? How do we not walk in the footsteps of the LG(BT) rights movement, and the way it for years focused almost exclusively on L&G rights while ignoring or throwing B&T under the bus?

Huge, long, discussions about this stuff, and no easy answers.
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  #204  
Old 08-12-2014, 12:19 PM
JessicaBurde JessicaBurde is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdt26417 View Post
Perhaps this is off-topic and uncomfortable for me to ask, but, I am wondering if white folks have (up until now) felt more free to be openly gay than folks of color. What I'm driving at is, is it a "white man's tradition" to attend sexually innovative conventions (and potlucks) and to march in parades? Heck is any of this related to the 70's when it was much easier for white students to get into famous colleges and then come to fight for social change in the environment of those colleges? Maybe if the social order pushes some people onto a relatively blue-collar career path, those people won't have time for the kind of crusading that the privileged class congratulates itself for.
Vague recollection of seeing studies and surveys on this question, with the answer that black men (I don't recall seeing anything discussing women) under a huge amount of pressure to not be gay, due to culture stuff and probably related to the hyper-masculinity which has become part of the idealized 'black man.' I remember a few black feminist blogs writing about this about the time the one basketball player (Collins?) came out last year.

Pushing for social change is definitely a province of the young, if only because the young are less likely to have jobs to lose, families to take care of, etc, and can afford to go to Washington for a week, or put all their time into organizing marches. Read a fascinating article once about how a large part of the success of the Civil Rights movement in the 60s was how they used the existing organization of black churches as a basis for the movement's organization.

I don't know about pushing for social change being a province of the rich, I expect the tendency of change to explore of colleges has a great deal to do with the way colleges gather a huge group of young people with lots of energy, black&white views of the world, and plenty of time on their hands, but access to money definitely helps. (though as Obama's fundraising campaigns demonstrated, a well-organized group that is able to motivate a large number of small donations can work just as well as just having large amounts of money)
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  #205  
Old 08-12-2014, 06:10 PM
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Hey swirl,

I take it you're saying Canada is doing better with race issues (which is no surprise), and that organized religions can cause some divisiveness. As for the internet needing even more momentum, I say amen.

@ JessicaBurde ... my first thought is that poly rights could be pushed for per se, but in such a way as to grant responsible non-monogamists in general more rights as well. As for how to sort out the demographics, I think I vote to let individual people eschew the poly label if they want to and not apply it to them in adding up the numbers. A better long-term solution is to get poly (and poly dialog) more out in the middle of public discourse where more people will hear about poly and consider it as it relates to their own lives.

Will widespread churches eventually advocate for polyamorists? I think right now some are struggling to advocate for homosexuals, but that battle is just begun. I personally am a pretty lame poly activist: My version of activism is joining a local poly group (and reading/posting on poly forums ). I guess I'm a believer in slow change, change that originates in the minds of the people. A new way of looking at things precedes a new way of handling things, to sum it up. I also think showing by example that poly is "no big deal" will help improve collective consciousness about poly, but I'm not even that good of an activist because I live almost entirely in the closet. About the only example I set is set right here in posts on this website.
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  #206  
Old 08-13-2014, 02:09 AM
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nycindie nycindie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hades36 View Post
Hey everyone! It's been a long time since I was on this board, even as a lurker. But, yeah, so i see you folks are still talking about the minorities in poly thing? Cool!
Hey there, Hades36! I haven't been posting much myself - just been too busy - but it's so-o-o-oooooo nice to see you here again! I do think of you from time to time, since Philly's so close to NYC! Someday, maybe a visit....

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  #207  
Old 08-14-2014, 11:37 PM
Semienigma Semienigma is offline
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Being new to poly, this was something I wondered about a lot. Being black myself, I wondered if I could even be apart of a community like this. As weird as it sounds, I do like that there is discussion about it.

Personally, I tend to be "that one black lady" at many places I go to.
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  #208  
Old 08-14-2014, 11:44 PM
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D'oh -- you're the "token black lady." Well we're workin' on it ...

Welcome.
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