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  #1  
Old 03-01-2014, 03:59 PM
kaduhwin kaduhwin is offline
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Default Open relationship with pick up artist

I'm new to this site and to polyamory as well. I am a 24 year old female who up until very recently, had been single for 6 years. About eight months ago I met an amazing guy and its been one hell of a roller coaster ride since finding out months after meeting him that he did not believe in labels- refusing to have the boyfriend/ girlfriend title and was only willing to partake in open relationships. Initially I hesitated. After a two year relationship with a guy who constantly cheated, and the jealous/paranoid/ snooping traits I picked up along the way, I feared that I would again become engulfed in those horrible emotions. I didn't want to share. But because of the strong connection I felt for him, I decided to just accept it, enjoy my time with him, and the minute I felt I couldn't handle it anymore, end it. Looking back, it was a very naive, selfish idea.

I'm having a difficult time dealing with the idea of his being with multiple people, especially since he is a practicing Pick Up Artist (an individual who trains in the skills of finding, attracting, and seducing women) his success rides on the high amount of successful attempts he has picking up girls. His goal being to have his own dating agency. And I want to whole heartedly support him and his goals but the idea of his actively engaging with, flirting, kissing, and sleeping with numerous girls on a frequent basis, makes me engulfed with feelings of insecurity, jealousy, and anger. And it doesn't help that our "dates" are extremely sporadic- sometimes every two weeks, even though we live walking distance from each other. In my mind, once the weather becomes better here in New York, he will have less time for me, because he'll be out picking up girls...

I've realized my unsatisfaction. And in multiple occasions expressed these thoughts to him, to which he promised he'd make the effort to see me more (hasn't happened). Realizing that the situation would not get better because I have a habit of feeling neglected, I have attempted to end it. And have failed each time since he believes that I can overcome these insecure emotions so long as I tried. That I am ridiculous for wanting a monogamous relationship because humans are not monogamous creatures by nature. Basically, he refuses to let the relationship end.

And I don't know what to do anymore. I love him dearly, and he says he loves me too. But it's been much more difficult than I thought it would be. Its been rather painful. And lately all we do is fight, mostly because of comments I've made about my belief that relationships don't last, and how I could not learn to pacify my jealousy and insecurity...

Please help.
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  #2  
Old 03-01-2014, 04:20 PM
bookbug bookbug is offline
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While jealousy and insecurity may indeed be an issue, I would say that regardless of anything else, the lack of quality time is the one that predominates. You two want very different things. He does not want a defined relationship and is satisfied with seeing you infrequently, whereas you want a guy who is there for you. Bottom line, he is not that guy.

As for the insecurity / jealousy issue, it might be something you could overcome if your relationship with him was not affected by his other pursuits - but it is in terms of time, if nothing else.

That said, in polyamory, you don't have to break up with him to date someone else. Find someone who can be there for you, someone who can meet the needs he is not meeting.
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  #3  
Old 03-01-2014, 04:43 PM
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SchrodingersCat SchrodingersCat is offline
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You clearly are not happy in the relationship, you've tried to end it but you've allowed him to change your mind. If you don't want to continue on this path, you'll just have to be more firm with him.

It's one thing to be poly. It's another thing to be a pick up artist. It's another thing entirely to use that as an excuse to neglect the feelings and needs of people you're dating.

It takes two people to be in a relationship. It takes one person to end it. He does not have the power to "refuse" to end it, unless you give it to him.

Send him an email, along the lines of "Yeah, I could probably get over these feelings. But really, you're just not worth the trouble. You don't show consideration of my needs, you don't empathize with my feelings, and I don't have time to waste on someone like that. Besides, why should I be the one to change? There's nothing wrong with me, we're just not compatible. Have fun with your pick-ups, but I'm out." Then the rest is on you: don't answer his phone calls, don't reply to his messages, and for the love of Spaghetti, don't contact him yourself.

I happen to agree that humans are not monogamous "by nature," i.e. that we're not genetically programmed to be monogamous. That being said, socialization is an incredibly powerful process, and it has absolutely made many people unwilling to engage in non-monogamous relationships. There's absolutely nothing wrong with being one of those people, with only seeking out partners who feel the same way you do, and with not doing the hard work required to get over the jealousy and insecurity that's triggered by sharing partners.

You deserve to be happy. You deserve to date people who approach relationships the same way you do. You don't have a responsibility to change your attitude, personality, and preferred relationship style just so he can play his games without consideration of the effect on people around him. That's crap.
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  #4  
Old 03-01-2014, 04:55 PM
PolyinPractice PolyinPractice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaduhwin View Post
I'm new to this site and to polyamory as well. I am a 24 year old female who up until very recently, had been single for 6 years. About eight months ago I met an amazing guy and its been one hell of a roller coaster ride since finding out months after meeting him that he did not believe in labels- refusing to have the boyfriend/ girlfriend title and was only willing to partake in open relationships. Initially I hesitated. After a two year relationship with a guy who constantly cheated, and the jealous/paranoid/ snooping traits I picked up along the way, I feared that I would again become engulfed in those horrible emotions. I didn't want to share. But because of the strong connection I felt for him, I decided to just accept it, enjoy my time with him, and the minute I felt I couldn't handle it anymore, end it. Looking back, it was a very naive, selfish idea.

I'm having a difficult time dealing with the idea of his being with multiple people, especially since he is a practicing Pick Up Artist (an individual who trains in the skills of finding, attracting, and seducing women) his success rides on the high amount of successful attempts he has picking up girls. His goal being to have his own dating agency. And I want to whole heartedly support him and his goals but the idea of his actively engaging with, flirting, kissing, and sleeping with numerous girls on a frequent basis, makes me engulfed with feelings of insecurity, jealousy, and anger. And it doesn't help that our "dates" are extremely sporadic- sometimes every two weeks, even though we live walking distance from each other. In my mind, once the weather becomes better here in New York, he will have less time for me, because he'll be out picking up girls...

I've realized my unsatisfaction. And in multiple occasions expressed these thoughts to him, to which he promised he'd make the effort to see me more (hasn't happened). Realizing that the situation would not get better because I have a habit of feeling neglected, I have attempted to end it. And have failed each time since he believes that I can overcome these insecure emotions so long as I tried. That I am ridiculous for wanting a monogamous relationship because humans are not monogamous creatures by nature. Basically, he refuses to let the relationship end.

And I don't know what to do anymore. I love him dearly, and he says he loves me too. But it's been much more difficult than I thought it would be. Its been rather painful. And lately all we do is fight, mostly because of comments I've made about my belief that relationships don't last, and how I could not learn to pacify my jealousy and insecurity...

Please help.
I know you don't mean to reinforce a stereotype, but being poly is more than just "being with lots of people." Do you understand?
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  #5  
Old 03-01-2014, 05:15 PM
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nycindie nycindie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaduhwin View Post
I've realized my unsatisfaction. And in multiple occasions expressed these thoughts to him, to which he promised he'd make the effort to see me more (hasn't happened). Realizing that the situation would not get better because I have a habit of feeling neglected, I have attempted to end it. And have failed each time since he believes that I can overcome these insecure emotions so long as I tried. That I am ridiculous for wanting a monogamous relationship because humans are not monogamous creatures by nature. Basically, he refuses to let the relationship end.
I really don't understand how someone can prevent you from breaking up with them. No one who ever broke up with me stuck around just because I didn't want it to end. You are unhappy, dissatisfied, and clearly don't want to be in this situation, so grow a backbone and stand up for yourself. Tell him never to contact you again, and block his number. Simple and straightforward.

To me, his refusal to end it sounds more like you're a prize that he gets to keep, and less that he actually loves you. If someone loves you, truly, they want you to be happy even if it means without them.

Plus, "Pick Up Artists" are generally selfish, inconsiderate buffoons who have absolutely zero respect for women, so why would you want to be with a guy like that? DTMFA!!!!
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Last edited by nycindie; 03-01-2014 at 05:20 PM.
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  #6  
Old 03-01-2014, 05:23 PM
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Dagferi Dagferi is offline
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Life is too short to be miserable.
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  #7  
Old 03-01-2014, 06:00 PM
kaduhwin kaduhwin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bookbug View Post
While jealousy and insecurity may indeed be an issue, I would say that regardless of anything else, the lack of quality time is the one that predominates. You two want very different things. He does not want a defined relationship and is satisfied with seeing you infrequently, whereas you want a guy who is there for you. Bottom line, he is not that guy.

As for the insecurity / jealousy issue, it might be something you could overcome if your relationship with him was not affected by his other pursuits - but it is in terms of time, if nothing else.

That said, in polyamory, you don't have to break up with him to date someone else. Find someone who can be there for you, someone who can meet the needs he is not meeting.
Yes! I do believe that if we were to have more quality time with each other, then those negative emotions that arise would occur less frequently and would be easier to pacify. I've brought it up, we'll make plans and something comes up- canceling four times in the past two weeks. Its tough because he's currently unemployed so his reasoning behind not seeing me as frequently is because he does not want things to feel too routine, and doesn't have his apartment anymore.
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  #8  
Old 03-01-2014, 06:16 PM
kaduhwin kaduhwin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SchrodingersCat View Post

Send him an email, along the lines of "Yeah, I could probably get over these feelings. But really, you're just not worth the trouble. You don't show consideration of my needs, you don't empathize with my feelings, and I don't have time to waste on someone like that. Besides, why should I be the one to change? There's nothing wrong with me, we're just not compatible. Have fun with your pick-ups, but I'm out." Then the rest is on you: don't answer his phone calls, don't reply to his messages, and for the love of Spaghetti, don't contact him yourself.
Often there is no understanding coming from him. He's very set in his thinking, so whenever I express discontent or express my issues with insecurity he'll respond with "how unattractive" I am behaving. I've been trying to cope, reading books on buddhism has helped. But it isn't an overnight deal.

It seems like every other day I've contemplated or initiated the breakup. But have a habit to listening to what he has to say, and give him another opportunity.
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  #9  
Old 03-01-2014, 06:30 PM
kaduhwin kaduhwin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nycindie View Post
I really don't understand how someone can prevent you from breaking up with them. No one who ever broke up with me stuck around just because I didn't want it to end. You are unhappy, dissatisfied, and clearly don't want to be in this situation, so grow a backbone and stand up for yourself. Tell him never to contact you again, and block his number. Simple and straightforward.

To me, his refusal to end it sounds more like you're a prize that he gets to keep, and less that he actually loves you. If someone loves you, truly, they want you to be happy even if it means without them.

Plus, "Pick Up Artists" are generally selfish, inconsiderate buffoons who have absolutely zero respect for women, so why would you want to be with a guy like that? DTMFA!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by nycindie View Post
I really don't understand how someone can prevent you from breaking up with them. No one who ever broke up with me stuck around just because I didn't want it to end. You are unhappy, dissatisfied, and clearly don't want to be in this situation, so grow a backbone and stand up for yourself. Tell him never to contact you again, and block his number. Simple and straightforward.

To me, his refusal to end it sounds more like you're a prize that he gets to keep, and less that he actually loves you. If someone loves you, truly, they want you to be happy even if it means without them.

Plus, "Pick Up Artists" are generally selfish, inconsiderate buffoons who have absolutely zero respect for women, so why would you want to be with a guy like that? DTMFA!!!!

Funny that you've used the word "prize" as he has a habit of saying that to me. Me being the prize. I have a habit of listening what he has to say, give him the opportunity to prove himself, and fall back into the same problem. Often I wonder if I am getting the genuine version of him, or the"Pick Up Artist" who easily knows hows to sway a situation to their liking...
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  #10  
Old 03-01-2014, 07:19 PM
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Marcus Marcus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaduhwin View Post
Funny that you've used the word "prize" as he has a habit of saying that to me. Me being the prize. I have a habit of listening what he has to say, give him the opportunity to prove himself, and fall back into the same problem. Often I wonder if I am getting the genuine version of him, or the"Pick Up Artist" who easily knows hows to sway a situation to their liking...
You are completely head over heals enamored with this guy.
He has demonstrated clear lack of concern for you as a human being.
You are going to stay with him for the foreseeable future.

I'm going to take a shot in the dark and classify your "attempts to break up" with him as a game. You say you are breaking up with him, he shows you a bit of momentary affection and whispers some bullshit to you, you fall for his bullshit and decide to stay with him a bit longer. If you feel like you need to get something more from him you repeat the process.

I'm with nycindie, grow a pair and either accept him for who he is or break up with him. Anything in between is just you playing the same game with him that he is playing with you.
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