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  #11  
Old 02-23-2010, 12:21 PM
Ceoli Ceoli is offline
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I guess I have two questions.

1. Why are you still with this guy? (I don't mean this as in "Why haven't you left yet?", but as in "What are you actually gaining by being with him?")

2. Is this really the kind of relationship you want to model for your daughter? Do you want your daughter to grow up thinking that this kind of relationship is normal and what she should be going for?
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  #12  
Old 02-23-2010, 01:21 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceoli View Post
I guess I have two questions.

1. Why are you still with this guy? (I don't mean this as in "Why haven't you left yet?", but as in "What are you actually gaining by being with him?")

2. Is this really the kind of relationship you want to model for your daughter? Do you want your daughter to grow up thinking that this kind of relationship is normal and what she should be going for?

Answer 1) I don't think I am gaining anything at the moment. But I am trying to get to a place where I can gain back my companion, my friend, my family member, the glow I used to have every time I looked at him and said, "yep, this is who I'm spending my life with." I had a revelation last night. I am in no state to accept that he can be that person again. I have literally been waiting for the smallest mess up to say, "AHA!!! You didn't change! I knew it!" Because I'm scared to trust again. I'm not in that place and I have no control over his actions. All I can do is get myself to a place on last time where I can accept any positive changes that happen wholeheartedly and give this relationship one last try. I'm not a quitter. Its so freaking hard to throw in the towel on anything. So I have to try, but I have to get myself to a place where I can try. I woke up drained this morning. It's how I've woken up most days for the past several months. The ups and downs of working on building the dynamics of our poly relationship, then the ups and downs of a family in shambles. I need time to recover before I can truly "be in this" again.

Answer 2) I absolutely do not want our daughter thinking this is okay. His behavior or my behavior. She has witnessed his dishonesty towards me. It was something that he brought up last night. He blames himself for a lie she told me Sunday night. That she is learning this from him and it's not okay and it's something that he must fix. What she has been learning from me is, it's okay to be treated this way and that mother's and wives don't deserve respect. That is absolutely not okay and this is something I must fix and I am doing so. But a big lesson that she has learned (something I didn't want her to learn at such a young age) is that we are a family and families have troubles, sometimes BIG troubles. I want her to learn the second half of that important lesson... Gosh I'm crying typing this. I want her to learn that Family sticks it out and doesn't give up on each other. That they apologize and forgive and rebuild. I never got the second half of that lesson growing up. I want that for her. I want her to have the family that her father and I set out to make a long time ago.... I want that family and I know deep down so does he. We are just at a place where there has to be a time out. I want time with my daughter where I am not worrying about my relationship with her father and that's what I am focused on right now. Once i recharge my batteries, I will try one last time and if it doesn't work out then we will have to start planning a new family that can function properly for her.
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  #13  
Old 02-23-2010, 06:34 PM
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redsirenn redsirenn is offline
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Well, the first step is awareness.

Sounds like you won't be fooled, which is a good thing. Abuse comes in many forms - this is certainly one of them. I am sure you know this, but you'll have to draw the line somewhere. I was married to a mentally abusive man who quickly turned into a physically abusive one as soon as he noticed I was growing a pair.

I should have left way sooner - I spouted out all of what you are saying now. Yes, people change, but sometimes we have to realize that we cannot wait for it to happen.

I guess I am just writing to say, that I wish you strength. Know that you are not alone, and that if you leave this is not a failure.

RS
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  #14  
Old 02-23-2010, 08:28 PM
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SchrodingersCat SchrodingersCat is offline
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People don't change if they don't have to.

What's his motivation to change if you keep enabling him?

You're sending him the message "it's ok to lie to me because I'll forgive you."

You're sending your daughter the message "Women should stay with people who lie and hurt them."

If she ends up with a husband who beats her, do you really want her prevalent lesson of families to be

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilove2men View Post
that Family sticks it out and doesn't give up on each other. That they apologize and forgive and rebuild.
How many times would you watch her come over with a black eye before questioning this lesson? How many times would you take your grandkids to the hospital with bones that her husband broke before wishing you had taught her to put herself and her children first?
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Gralson: my husband (works out of town).
Auto: my girlfriend (lives with her husband Zoffee).

The most dangerous phrase in the English language is "we've always done it this way."

Last edited by SchrodingersCat; 02-23-2010 at 08:30 PM.
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  #15  
Old 02-23-2010, 09:31 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Originally Posted by redsirenn View Post
Well, the first step is awareness.

Sounds like you won't be fooled, which is a good thing. Abuse comes in many forms - this is certainly one of them. I am sure you know this, but you'll have to draw the line somewhere. I was married to a mentally abusive man who quickly turned into a physically abusive one as soon as he noticed I was growing a pair.

I should have left way sooner - I spouted out all of what you are saying now. Yes, people change, but sometimes we have to realize that we cannot wait for it to happen.

I guess I am just writing to say, that I wish you strength. Know that you are not alone, and that if you leave this is not a failure.

RS

Thank you. That's all I needed was an ear to listen to my fears that this was a sign that he indeed had not changed. The fact is he didn't repeat the same apology last night that he always does. There was a lot of pouring out of his soul and apparently there is more. There is a letter at home waiting for me. So I will update either tonight or tmrw more about where we are at.
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  #16  
Old 02-23-2010, 09:48 PM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SchrodingersCat View Post
People don't change if they don't have to.

What's his motivation to change if you keep enabling him?

You're sending him the message "it's ok to lie to me because I'll forgive you."

You're sending your daughter the message "Women should stay with people who lie and hurt them."

If she ends up with a husband who beats her, do you really want her prevalent lesson of families to be



How many times would you watch her come over with a black eye before questioning this lesson? How many times would you take your grandkids to the hospital with bones that her husband broke before wishing you had taught her to put herself and her children first?
I answered about my daughter in my response to ceoli. This is my last attempt and Im not even attempting yet. I am taking the time I need for myself before I even think of it. And she will be retaught. I was clear that I am aware of what I am teaching her. I'm not making one single excuse of oh we don't fuss in front of her. I know what I heard as a child from behind closed doors (yelling not physical) and I know that I resented my mother not my father. I know this is one of the reasons I stayed with an abusive husband for as long as did because it was "normal" to me. But also know my mother didn't change and she didn't stand up for herself. She didn't sit me down and tell me that this is not the way things are supposed to be. I have been having very deep talks with my daughter where she has expressed much resentment and I made a promise to her last tuesday that changes for the better are happening and we don't know what those changes are just yet but they are coming because THIS IS NOT OKAY.

He is no longer enabled by me. did enable and make excuses for him. I blamed it on my coming out as poly and then I stopped being stupid. I gave him a choice to stay and love me for me or to leave. Not an ultimatum. A take me as I am. I didn't say stay and treat me as less than. I grew my pair and he has more than just me to be accountable to. He is not forgiven. I am going to try or hear him out, but as I said before there is absolutely no more blind faith.
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  #17  
Old 02-24-2010, 01:59 AM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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So I jumped into a hot bath and read my letter, cried, and then read it again. It was a letter about our past. A very bad time in our life and it was told through his eyes. Something I have never heard before. With one letter (6 pages long) a grudge was released. A little less on my pile. My questions of why about that time were answered and a weight was lifted off of me. No this doesn't make it all better, but it's more than I actually expected. Its a step.

There will be more letters to come. Eight years worth I think. The good, the bad, the ugly. Everything is to be revealed. He is dropping all guards to open himself fully. Sigh, this is what I have been asking for for months. I honestly didn't think he would.

I'd also like to say we had a great family moment tonight. Our daughter (5 years old) read 10 sentences to us effortlessly. I gushed with pride and joy and scooped her up into my arms.

Are things perfect absolutely not. But today... today was a good day.

Also, he read the thread and says we are on the same page. This is our last attempt. None of us deserve the way things have been especially our baby girl.

Last edited by NeonKaos; 02-24-2010 at 01:24 PM. Reason: merge posts
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  #18  
Old 02-24-2010, 04:41 AM
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classycaveman classycaveman is offline
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I'm reading this thread with great interest. So far, from your descriptions, this guy you're with has my respect, but not the slightest bit of my trust. He seems to know how to get exactly what he wants from you when he wants it. He doesn't seem to know how to give you exactly what you need when you need it, or if he does, he only gives it to you as he sees fit...

Does this sound right? (I hope I'm wrong.)
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  #19  
Old 02-24-2010, 05:34 AM
Ilove2men Ilove2men is offline
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Originally Posted by classycaveman View Post
I'm reading this thread with great interest. So far, from your descriptions, this guy you're with has my respect, but not the slightest bit of my trust. He seems to know how to get exactly what he wants from you when he wants it. He doesn't seem to know how to give you exactly what you need when you need it, or if he does, he only gives it to you as he sees fit...

Does this sound right? (I hope I'm wrong.)
Unfortunately, that's exactly right. Something he admitted to in the second letter he gave me tonight. He has been "faking it" as we have identified it. Making it seem as though he's met my needs (respect, comfort, support) when he really has not. And yes for the past several months I've felt like he's been acting this way because something was going on with him (I'm blamed it on me being poly) and so I focused on what I could do to improve our relationship. I thought I was doing the right thing. Accepting that I have no control over him and that with time he would see that I'm completely dedicated to making it work and he would join me. He didn't until I voiced that I was spent and couldn't accept this anymore. I let him get away with it for too long. should have stood up for myself as soon as I saw what was going on. I am truly hurt. I feel betrayed. I feel like my love for him was used against me. I feel like my heart was mishandled and I don't trust him with it.

It will be a long time before I feel safe enough to trust him again. It will take a lot of action on his part. I need to see things happening.

He says he's working on it. the first step for him is pouring out everything. Dropping all facades. Getting real about what's been going on and being honest about any and all manipulation. Because I need to see that he knows what he's been doing. I need him to admit that he's been bending me to his will. He did tonight and I didn't ask for it which is a real BIG deal for me.

I can honestly say while I don't trust him, there's something in my bones... There's something in my boyfriend's bones telling us that my fiance is heartfelt. This is not his bag of tricks. We shall see if it sticks.
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  #20  
Old 02-24-2010, 05:56 AM
Ceoli Ceoli is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilove2men View Post
Also, he read the thread and says we are on the same page. This is our last attempt. None of us deserve the way things have been especially our baby girl.
Have you considered seeing a counselor or a therapist together? It sounds like you're both committed to working on this, but may not have all the resources you need to make it work. A counselor might be able to help with that. Just a thought...
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