#101
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And where is it that I "sink into fantasy"? Quote:
"To relegate or confine to a lower or outer limit or edge, as of social standing." within the social environment you share with that person. Quote:
If I ask a doctor for him to speak "basic English" in explaining my health issues because I was confused about what he meant, I would expect that he would take a moment to figure out a simpler way to state his point, not a more or equally complicated one. Quote:
I have found in r/l that if a person insists on giving long-winded thoughts to a complicated topic when talking to people who lack comprehension-they tend to get the "i'm lost in lala land" stare and no return conversation. With ALL due respect, I know that personally reading the font you use gives me a headache-so i try to limit myself to doing so only if you are talking specifically to me. Additionally it seems that you tend to tear apart every sentence of every post that is directed at you, instead of just answering the basic premise and accepting examples as just examples that don't need to be addressed specifically since they aren't specific to the topic. I think this may be one reason a number of people feel that you are "interrogating" them. There seems to be no room in conversing with you for them to speak without you analyzing each word, it's.... like being under the gun really. You may not "mean it that way" but if that's how it comes across to more than one person-it seems reasonable to assume that it's a common understanding of what those actions mean. For example, I am "honest to a fault". I have had to learn that often times people take that honesty to mean I don't like them. So I've learned to pre-curse it with "You know I love you-but..." that way I am actively addressing their insecurities (or the potential in activities where I am in control-of them feeling marginalized) before I go on to make my point. Quote:
At 30 (in management) I fought with the owner to allow 14 year olds to work for us. The argument was that they were "irresponsible". Yet the owners hadn't actually WORKED with any 14 year olds-it was just an assumption. So we compromised to allow 14 year olds to volunteer for 3 months and if they learned well and seemed responsible I could hire them on a temporary basis. It worked well and those owners as well as MANY customers and others community members now see that in fact their age didn't guarantee that they were "bad employees" in fact they were BETTER employees then many of the older people, due to the older people having become "jaded" in life and wanting more pay/benefits etc. Quote:
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BUT I'd love ideas and am willing to work on trying to implement them.
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"Love As Thou Wilt"
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#102
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![]() Glow-this is true. At 20 I felt SURROUNDED by older people, now at ONLY 34 (ok I added the only for my own self-esteem) I seem to spend a LOT of time around people younger than me! I hope it's not horrible for them though-as I really really enjoy hearing their stories and talking with them!
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"Love As Thou Wilt"
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#103
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One thing I run across A LOT in dealing with teaching people is the need to really personalize it for them, or they just don't "get" it. When someone is asking about marginalization it helps to take a specific example (marginalization of young polys in the general poly community as an example) and identify HOW the marginalization shows up in THAT instance, how things could be changed to stop or minimize that marginalization and then step to how each individual can work on this within themself. I think (THINK not sure) that is where the whole point is getting lost. Some of this is "old hat" for you-as you have studied it and worked on it. But for most people (as you know) it's a "foreign concept". So the things that seem obvious-have to be stated specifically. In this thread topic specifically-I don't see it happening, and since the thread started, I have been talking to other "young'uns" about it-from 16-38. But none of them feel that way or are aware of it either. Ok... obviously SOMEONE SOMEWHERE is-but how do I help if I don't know them. I know how to work on reducing marginalization GENERALLY within my community, using first self-introspection for my own prejudices and preconcieved ideas, educating others around me about the topic, talking with others and helping them see/find their internal prejudices and preconcieved ideas. In fact I've been doing this SPECIFICALLY in helping 4 people on a daily basis-roughly 10-14 hours of my day every day, for the last three weeks in addition the hours I spend generally teaching the kids in my care-and the topic of how we treat others while OBVIOUSLY not including a word like "marginalization" does certainly IMPACT marginalization for future generations.
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"Love As Thou Wilt"
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#104
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LovingRadiance, I have always had older people in my life, Ive always connected with them better in some ways. Im sure it isnt horrible for your friends =) youre great!
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-Glow |
#105
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you didn't sound stupid. ![]() It was a relieving lightness of spirit. Good for the soul!!
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"Love As Thou Wilt"
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#106
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There are those who genuinely care about people other than themselves and seek to stop social structures that disadvantage others while recognizing where these structures benefit them. They actively work together and work against accepting oppression as the norm they were trained to think it was. This includes stopping the replication of these structures in communities we create for ourselves such as the polyamorous community. It is disheartening that such derision has been directed at Ceoli here because she is vocal about issues of privilege. Contrary to implications otherwise, she is entitled to voice these views and serves as a welcome ally in creating change. It is a surprise for me to see within this forum the rejection of people joining each other across difference in this way. Even so much that it is stated that it is quite normal to be repelled by difference. It lends an undertone of dis-ingeniousness to the forum where love and acceptance is so often spoken of. Quote:
~Raven~ Last edited by Ravenesque; 02-05-2010 at 02:54 AM. |
#107
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You stated that the perceived appearance of the poly community as "ridiculous" should somehow influence whether these issues are addressed. That's superficial. Somehow you managed to ignore those who did say they have felt marginalized based on age. There are those who stated they did not feel marginalized but were concerned about others who did. There were some who refrained from stating whether they felt marginalized at all. For you to then tell others maybe it's time to move on to topics that "DO pertain" as though marginalization does not, because to you it does not seem to be an issue within this forum (where of course it is) is condescending and dismissive. Yeah, it is easy to blithely and glibly say, we're all people and we should agree that their are different types of people. However many have to struggle every day simply for being different. They are marginalized. They don't usually gain the rights to a full life unless others understand their struggle, the part we all play in that struggle, and seek to stop the prejudices that reinforce marginalization alongside them. Small scale or large. Is it really then a surprise to be treated in the dismissive haughty way you've treated others because the topic doesn't matter to you? Why should you not be treated in the manner you've addressed this thread and those who participate in it? Quote:
Perhaps you feel your views are strengthened somehow by whispers outside the open forum. PMs have no relevance to the topic being discussed and you've yet to show a reason why they should have significance. I don't address shadowy figures (or introduce them lol) anymore than I address fantastical motives that have been brought into this discussion from who knows where. I respond to what is actually said not rumored. For someone who speaks about the "real" you've brought a lot of shallowness to the foreground. Quote:
*laughs* Whoo. "A number of people." "More than one person." Funny enough to be sad with the he said she said. I also don't feel the need to justify or validate myself through other people. This is where I get off on the degenerating spiral into nowhere and return to the topic of marginalization with those who wish to talk about it and methods of addressing it. ~Raven~ Last edited by Ravenesque; 02-05-2010 at 02:59 AM. |
#108
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There are 1,525, members on this forum and 322 active members. Would all those who feel marginalized as young polies please say something. Perhaps this is a valid topic, perhaps it is in the mind of a limited few, so I'm begging you....if you feel marginalized say something so the rest of us can at least feel there is actually a problem here. Pretty, pretty please
![]() My frustration with this topic is that no one seems to be admitting that they feel marginalized because of their youth. And no one seems to be able to concisely explain what the fuck that means. I'm editting to expand on my request - I am not that smart - I want an example...a real world, tangible, already occured, occuring event.
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Playing the Game of Life with Monopoly rules. Monogamy might just be in my genes ![]() Poly Events All Over Last edited by MonoVCPHG; 02-05-2010 at 03:10 AM. |
#109
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At the risk of sounding even MORE condescending (which is also not the intent), I felt the same way when I was your age (that everyone around me was older). Quote:
I'm not saying you're here to "recruit" people, but you really do need to acknowledge that other people's priorities in life might be different from fighting against ageism, racism, mono-poly-isms, whatever. And you MIGHT want to consider using a different font and/or color because the ones you use also give me a headache (and no, I haven't been PM'ing with LR about you) the same way it does when someone writes in all caps. But far be it from me to cramp your style. That is all. Carry on. Last edited by NeonKaos; 02-05-2010 at 04:33 AM. |
#110
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![]() -Derby |
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Tags |
ageism, exclusion, marginalization, tng, young |
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