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  #41  
Old 05-13-2013, 06:27 PM
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Agreed - this needs to be discussed. It's bothering you and it needs to get out on the table, get all its yucky pieces talked about, and see where you all go from there.

Reestablishing trust is hard, especially this soon, but it'll be impossible to really regain it if she's never given a chance to violate it (and shows that she doesn't).

But if that trust does get violated, at least talking about it beforehand will give them an idea of what the consequences would be. If you discuss it ahead of time, and they still make the decision to go ahead with it, it's a conscious decision, much different from the "doing now, asking forgiveness later" methodology if they know there's no "forgiveness" to be had.

I'm glad you're all talking again - please bring this up among the three of you and discuss it. It needs to be brought out into the light.
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  #42  
Old 05-13-2013, 07:00 PM
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I have my work cut out for me with that wife of mine. She's up to some of her old ways. That's not even my lack of trust speaking. That's seeing the signs and not being oblivious to the obvious.

Case and point. I brought this up to her. Tell me why she has not only known about it but at one point discussed it with her ex? Are you shitting me? I'm beginning to wonder if she really did view me as a sperm donor to give her and her lesbian lover the kids they always wanted? That's how I felt. That's how valued I felt when it came to my opinion regarding my kids. Her excuse was that I'd probably have shut it down. I've said that time and time again. No amount of time will change my view. I'm not going for her having legal rights. Ask me in two years, five years, ten years...and the answer will continue to be a resounding hell no.

It was bad enough with a verbal agreement between them. It's five years later, and severing the relationship between my kid and her ex would probably be a catastrophic mess. I made peace with her solely because of my kid. No other reason. I don't feel like I have much control over that. Could I hurt my kid and risk her hating me for taking someone important away from her? I could, and I've thought about it something serious. So yeah. Ry knows I'd never agree to an arrangement like that, so I do have reason to believe that she'd go behind my back and try it. Sad to say, but I don't put it past her. She's always wanted her ex to be an equal, and a law that would grant that? Man, that's too easy. My opinions and voice have been heard by both. If they choose to go against me, I can't say what I will or won't do. Ry knows divorce is still on the table and real possibility. She knows what's on the line, so I hope she isn't crazy enough to try anything shady.

I'm very patient and giving her the benefit of the doubt. She's changed some, but those old habits are still hanging on. 13 years is a long time, so I didn't expect changes overnight. It's going to take awhile to break them, and I call her out when I see her falling into them.

Our new therapist is going to get an earful when we settle on one. A month of going it alone with no help and more secrets are coming out by the day. This is why trust isn't being built very fast. For every one good deed to boost trust, she'll reveal or do five things that prove why she doesn't deserve my trust.

I actually didn't care about the living arrangements. They've been changed again as of this afternoon. Her ex is going to be living elsewhere. I don't have any opinion on that one way or another. Not a big deal to me. We can cut her a cheque or send a transfer for the amount she put up towards the renovations and live separately. Works for me. My life will still go on.

Snowflake and I are still going to therapy. Our friendship isn't going to heal itself. I can be cordial towards her out of respect now, but there's a lot of work to be done. I'm still not sure of what her role is in my kids lives. Yeah, she's there to love them, but that doesn't mean much to me. I'm not calling her a parent at this point. She's who and what she is...whatever that may be. The Mrs. and I are still going to marriage counselling. We took a break, but we're going back next month. There's no way we can fix all of this without the guidance of a pro.

We have many problems. It's not hopeless. Most of our problems are exacerbated by the lack of trust and old habits. I'm a firm believer in full disclosure. I tell my wife everything these days. She tells me about 60%, but the 40% left is usually a doozy and is revealed over time or by playing 20 questions. Case and point. She told me that Snowflake had been distant, but left out the part where calls had been ignored and she made no attempts to contact our kids. To me that's important. All I wanted to know was if there was anything I needed to know that might make me reconsider letting her be in our kids lives. I expected the full truth, but she omitted half the story and told me just enough to get me to take the bait.

She's not home yet, but this will be discussed when she walks in. We talked over the phone, and I said the same things. I've already dropped a line to her ex and let her know that she needs to come over, so this can be discussed. We're not waiting and putting it off. This was just brought up this afternoon, and we're taking care of it tonight. I'd rather be proactive than sit around and wait for something to happen.

Last edited by Matt; 05-13-2013 at 07:03 PM.
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  #43  
Old 05-13-2013, 07:48 PM
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Good luck on your talk, I hope things are able to be worked out to everyone's satisfaction.
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  #44  
Old 05-13-2013, 07:50 PM
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Re:
Quote:
"This was just brought up this afternoon, and we're taking care of it tonight. I'd rather be proactive than sit around and wait for something to happen."
That's what I like to hear. Nip this problem in the bud. Make it well, openly, officially known that you are totally against the signing of this kind of legal document, and get solemn promises from both Ry and Si that such will not happen.
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  #45  
Old 05-13-2013, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt View Post
I tell my wife everything these days. She tells me about 60%, but the 40% left is usually a doozy and is revealed over time or by playing 20 questions.
What the person keeping secrets doesn't seem to get is how badly it tears your heart out every time a secret is revealed by force (even if it was something they completely forgot about until you brought it up). They seem to treat it as "Oh well, I forgot about that. What's the big deal?", while your dying inside. You have my sympathy on this.

I wonder if they have already filed this document, hopefully not. I wish you luck with your meeting.
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  #46  
Old 05-13-2013, 08:27 PM
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Re:
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"I wonder if they have already filed this document, hopefully not."
You might want to come out and ask them if they have ...
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  #47  
Old 05-13-2013, 08:50 PM
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Talk it out.

Including if moving to a country where laws like this could affect you means you don't move after all because you do not want to be held accountable to laws like that.

Sigh.

Hang in there.
GG
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  #48  
Old 05-13-2013, 09:21 PM
Matt Matt is offline
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Originally Posted by GalaGirl View Post
Talk it out.

Including if moving to a country where laws like this could affect you means you don't move after all because you do not want to be held accountable to laws like that.

Sigh.

Hang in there.
GG
This shouldn't even be an issue or a worry. Just the fact that she even consulted with her ex about this and made no mention to me is almost enough for me to leave. If I find out that she/they did and just lied to me again, I'm out. They claimed they haven't done anything. Whether or not I believe that is up for debate. My wife knows divorce is still a real possibility, and if she wants to keep playing with me, she's going to lose. I offered to divorce her once. The next time there will be no stopping it.

I shouldn't have to watch my wife like a bird in the sky. In a normal marriage, you don't usually have to worry about your spouse doing this kind of stuff. She wants to attribute everything to my lack of trust. That's not true. It's not that hard. All she has to do is stop doing stuff she knows good and well she wouldn't do in front of my face and stop with all the secrets. If it has to be done in secrecy or behind my back, it obviously isn't right or ethical. It's not that I'm not wanting to trust her. She just keeps reminding why I can't trust her.

For every omission and act that she does, we start over from scratch. She should be tired of starting over.
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  #49  
Old 05-14-2013, 04:07 AM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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Pretty much.

Oy.

GG
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  #50  
Old 05-14-2013, 01:40 PM
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I'm not miserable or unhappy. I'm ace. I take the good and the bad in stride. I'm happy with or without my wife. This chapter in my life is just like the one where I had a five year plan to rid her of her spoiled nature. I broke her of that, and I'm going to aid in the breaking of these habits. Getting called out every time should be a reminder that I'm not standing for her antics. My wife tap dances on my last nerve and seems to get off on testing me. She's met her match in me.

We argued last night. She thinks nothing is a big deal, and just as I had suspected, she contemplated doing it. I know my wife, and I know how she operates. Sweeping things under the rug is her forte. My worries weren't in vain because she admitted to everything. I respect her honesty. For being honest, she earned a little more of my trust back. Tell me the truth, and I'll respect you and trust will be given.

I don't have a problem with Snowflake, but I'm watching her. Last week, I asked them to give me some time to think over a few things before making decisions in the moment. After much consideration and a week to think, I don't feel comfortable with her ex being a third parent. Before I was thinking with a heart full of anger and hatred. I have calmed all the way down, and I level-headed again. I absolutely do have a problem with my kid calling her mummy. I have strong opinions on that.

I know we've made amends, and we're trying to reconcile on a friendship level. Trust and forgiveness aren't where they need to be at this point. I voiced that last night, which jump started another argument. I don't trust her ex completely. We're not that cool or even friends, yet. I'm cordial and respectful, but that's where I draw the line. I'm not ready to face her every day. We talked like adults, but that was step one. There's a lot of pain on both sides that needs to be healed. Rushing into anything would be a foolish choice, and I don't believe in overnight rehabilitation.

She might be sorry. I'm not offering up instant forgiveness because it's expected. I'm not hurting or upset because I've moved past it, but that doesn't mean all is forgiven and done with. Forgiveness is going to have to be earned. Just as trust is. I don't feel at ease with my kids being around her until she proves she's trustworthy to me again. She hasn't been alone with them, yet, and I've been controlling just how much time she spends with them.

For the record, I have every intention of controlling just how involved she is. All decisions will be made by us. We'll take her opinions into consideration just like those from family, close mates, colleagues, etc., but the final decisions regarding our kids will be made by Ry and myself. My Mrs. wants to give her free reign and make her part of everything. Didn't she learn that that wasn't a good idea the first time around? I don't want to make that mistake again. The Mrs. and I can't agree on this, and it causes hell in our house. She's still blinded by love and wanting her to be this equal co-parent, and I'm saying no. Don't ask me how I feel and still continue to go against it. She's still doing that even today. One of her worst old habits is opposition. When I oppose what she wants or if my idea doesn't fit into her frame, I know to expect an argument. That's what I meant by old habits are still around and kicking.

Out of all of our issues, nothing turns the heat up like this disagreement over how much say her ex should have. We have knockdown, drag out arguments over her ex being considered a "parent." There's no compromising with my wife. I offered to let her continue to be in their lives but eradicate the title of mummy and let her love them as friend of the family or aunt. Something along those lines. I don't get why she has to be in the motherly role and nothing else. With my wife and her ex, it's all or nothing as far as her ex being a parent. Her ex wants the same thing, so it ends up with them against me. If they keep pushing me and fighting me, it'll be nothing. I'm tired of fighting over this issue. I can't be the only one making concessions and compromising. Been there. Done that. We're not doing that again.

It's not registering with my wife that we both have the right to say who we do and don't want to help raise our kids. We're their parents, and if we can't make decisions with their best interests at heart, there's a problem. I'm not seeing where the third parental view is needed. I don't care about her loving my kids or wanting to be there for them. Cool, but you don't have to step into the role of a mother to accomplish that.

I don't know if it doesn't matter to my wife, or if she just doesn't care what I want. It's no secret what they want. I've communicated what I will and won't stand for. I've offered compromises that would achieve the ultimate goal: keeping her ex in the kids lives. I've communicated how I feel and what I need in order to let her continue to be in their lives. I'm not being unreasonable. I was backed and forced into shared parenting once, and we see how the outcome ended. I'm not comfortable with the idea of a third parent, but she wants to keep pushing me past my boundary. Respect how I feel and compromise. We've done it her way for five years, and it bombed. Am I being unfair in wanting to try it another way?
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