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  #31  
Old 01-14-2013, 12:01 AM
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SweetSensations SweetSensations is offline
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Default I didn't rape him -

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchrodingersCat View Post
Silence is not consent.



Well, I honestly cannot say whether you raped your husband or not. I was not there. So I cannot say "you didn't rape your husband." Maybe you did.



"I have been doing this for years; he is used to it" is not consent now; he has told you he is not interested in sex. Until he explicitly says he is interested in sex or that he likes it when you touch his penis, then there is no consent. Not saying "no" is not saying "yes" either.



"I put my penis in her but I didn't thrust back and forth." Really? Friction is the difference between rape and consensual sex??



Because he didn't ask you to start. By modern definitions, any sexual act without explicit consent (e.g. "I like it when you cup my balls and penis. Can you do that tonight?") is considered sexual assault. The fact that your husband doesn't object does not constitute consent.

You've told us that your husband is not sexual and does not want to be sexual. I can't speak to why he has not asked you to stop. Perhaps he is afraid of upsetting you. But have you asked him if it's ok for you to do that? If he's told you that he's not interested in sex, and then you touch his penis (whether you rub it or not) when he has not asked you to touch his penis, then girl, that's an unwanted sexual act. So no, I will not tell you that you have not raped him.

It makes me sad that I have to explain all of this. Do you think it's somehow different than if he were a 16 year old girl and you were her 19 year old boyfriend? Your husband's right to not be sexual is no less valid than a 16 year old girl's.
Yu are using really preposterous analogies. Nice try though.
My H is can somehow be assertive and tell me he does not want to make love but he is completely powerless when it comes to asking me not to spoon him and cup his testicles? He can tell me no babe I don't want a massage because why? Because I used to give him a massage after sex...and he just may have to give in. If he was powerless to say no to me wouldn't he be giving me sympathy sex/duty sex?

Why hasn't H rolled over when I cup him to go to sleep? Because he knows it is just loving touch. I was sick before Christmas, I chose to sleep in another room for 3 nights in a row. He came in and said babe you are better, come and sleep with me. I used to ride him for a few strokes then settle in and let him get flaccid and try to stay connected until we got hot. Did he perceive it to be that I wanted sex? NO why not? I had been doing it for many years and it had nothing to do with sex. I was just was just expressing my love for him. Do I do it anymore NO. When he couldn't sleep I would say love let's have a quickie then you will be able to sleep. He won't anymore? why? cuz he was using me to just go to sleep. I put my foot on top of his and he presses up...just a loving act.

If you want his phone number you can coach him.

You may be like some men I hug tightly. Then they think oh my, she hugged me I bet she wants me. NO, put YOUR ego back in your pocket. It is just a loving/thankful hug. Cupping his nuts is just a loving act. Knocking on the headboard means I want sex. Is there a chance he knows the difference between the two? YES

Sorry but nothing irritates me more than ppl making stuff up in threads.
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  #32  
Old 01-17-2013, 01:31 PM
MzWiz MzWiz is offline
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Default My perspective

A friend pointed me to your thread as your situation is similar to my own
20+ years together, but we've been in different beds/bedrooms for well over 10 years now, my quarterly "bonus" became a yearly thing, and a few years back, I too was "authorized" to seek release elsewhere (DADT which eventually kicked me in the behind as emotions got involved so we stopped)

I must admit I laughed when I read you actually bought a f-ing machine, I tried to get mine to build one with me (as we're both technically inclined, thought I'd get his interest.... he looked at me like I was nuts)
I've been in & out of therapy several times (him saying he would join yet every time we had a session, something came up and he was unable to attend)
We've talked and talked, I've cried a river of tears, begged on bended knee more times than I can count... and yes, I've even felt like a rapist (and told him such, many times)
I too can get him hard easily enough yet he has no interest in finishing
I've taken homeopathic anaphrodisiacs to kill my mojo (useless), spoken with traditional Drs about chemical castration (for myself - strongly discouraged and if taken long term: permanent as it kills brain receptors which never recoup), I've even considered physical castration and even suicide.... yes, sorry, I have... the pain being more than I can take...
Fortunately, I'm a AA member and if I got through that, I know I can get through this
All of the above took place over a 3-5 year period…. Many-many conversations through-out, many promises on his side to see Drs, get his T checked, move mountains if required… but nothing was ever done

Last October, I had a "final" discussion with him - a "shit or get off the pot" talk which I thought sunk in, finally...... but it didn't
A week or so ago, his hugs started feeling very uncomfortable (we always hugged goodnight) and he was upset, so we talked again…
He got very frustrated with me, saying I’m the one pulling back, that it was my fault…. (please note: throughout he’s stated it was my fault, I’m too horny, I am never satisfied, I’m a “pig”)
We then had a conversation which left him speechless several times as I rattled off all the tricks and ploys I’ve used over the years to get his attention, how I felt it was such a miracle, such a blessing, to finally have access to his form in a way which connected us “inside”, of having him finally “with” me, deeply…
Did/has that had any effect? Has he called anyone, done any research, made any move….
Kinda, I got flowers and roast beef dinner the next day (his idea of showing me love), I accepted, gratefully, acknowledging his effort… then next day, another conversation
From his perspective, flowers & dinner makes everything OK again…. But not from mine…
He said he’s feeling rejected, me, in another one of my don’t-piss-me-off-moods as I realize he really doesn’t get it, I told him point blank: Let me know how it feels after 10+ years then you’ll know what it’s like to be in my skin (said calmly while looking straight into his eyes – He looked away in pain)

I don’t want to hurt him…. But neither of us is “living” at this point
We’re living in the same building, work very well together as a team, don’t argue/fight on anything really, all in all a very comfortable lifestyle, no drama, steady-as-she-goes life…..
And while there is still desire within me for him, it’s easier now to quiet that voice as I know with 100% certainty that if I allow closeness of that nature, we’re only going to back to the same place again in a few months

I explained it to him this way:
Years ago, he was a welder, hated the job but had to pay the bills…..
Then he got into IT and loves it
From my perspective, our relationship has gone this path but inverse whereas it was joy, now it’s work/uncomfortable
And yes, now our conversations, all our conversations, are work/filled with tension/unilateral(his way 99% of the time with me assisting, to which I balk and causes additional friction)…..

My hopes for me is that I am able to keep the house (mine legally) with him, and we can live together as family till one of us moves on
Neither of us has someone waiting in the wings (not on my side, and I’m assuming on his either as he does say he loves me and it shows in his eyes)
We started as friends for 2 years before becoming intimate, so I’d like us to remain friends (at a minimum), and, if possible, remain family
His perspective is: all or nothing
Unfortunately his definition of “all” isn’t the same as mine… and he still hasn’t researched anything or spoke with anyone for help/guidance

I have learnt, at best, I control only myself (my actions/responses/perspectives)
That I can influence the area within 10 feet of me (co-workers, project directions, action plans… my energy overall be it positive or negative will “feed” my 10 feet)
And beyond 10 feet, I have no influence (politics, corporate direction, traffic  )
So If I can only control myself, my actions… and from my perspective, I’ve tried everything I could……
And if I only influence with 10 feet of me, and I’ve communicated over an extended period my needs….
The ball is in his court… yet it’s not….
I know the price of getting his attentions, it’s tears, frustration, loneliness, feelings of abandonment…
And it’s my choice if I want to go there (not!)
But I can focus on me… try to use “I” more instead of “we”… he’s noticed, and he’s scared… yet somehow not scared enough to action

As stands, I’m slowly cleaning the house, throwing out the clutter, knowing I’m doing so because the house will eventually be sold (I’m not keeping it alone, not walking/living with his ghost once we part)
He knows this, he isn’t helping but he isn’t stopping me either

My hopes for you is you focus on yourself & your 10 feet
Find as much pleasure you can within that space of 10 feet, no matter where you are or who you are with
And most of all, remember, you are a valuable person just as you are
There is nothing wrong with you, you exist for a purpose, a good purpose, deserve to love & be loved as you understand love
Your definition of self is based on what’s in you, not what’s external, his views/needs/perspective of you or your couple
It’s hard, I know, yet I truly believe I have been given this challenge as so I will grow stronger
As to why I need to be SuperMan emotionally, I don’t know, but that’s OK
Just be careful of negative thinking, of feeling lessor-than because one person isn’t loving you as you need/want/desire
You are beautiful just as you are, many people in your life love you just as you are
Yes, this isn’t easy…..
No, unfortunately, no one has your answer for you….
But there are others, like myself, in similar situations, so you’re not alone
And for me, knowing I’m not alone, knowing I am not some kind of extraterrestrial making unreasonable demands…
It gives me strength, helps me face the day, helps me have those uncomfortable conversations

Sorry for the long post, not sure if it helps you… but knowing you too are going through this kind of mess helps me
So thank you for posting and letting me air out a few things
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  #33  
Old 01-17-2013, 03:41 PM
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Good post. It describes well the frustration and heartache of that type of situation.
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  #34  
Old 01-17-2013, 10:26 PM
bassman bassman is offline
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Not sure where I read it, but I think here in the UK, a "sexless marriage" is considered that, where it happens less than once a month. About 10 years of my now annulled marriage, I realise now, could be considered sexless. Very early, she drew a line down the bed and said "this side is mine, this side is yours, dont think of crossing it!".

As she was less experienced than me, I thought it was a sign to let things go at her pace. So I never asked for, or suggested sex, or made any moves. So it was once a month, or even less for 10 years.
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  #35  
Old 01-18-2013, 04:56 PM
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Holiday Holiday is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MzWiz View Post
spoken with traditional Drs about chemical castration (for myself - strongly discouraged and if taken long term: permanent as it kills brain receptors which never recoup),
OMG I thought I was the only one... I didn't know they do this for women, too?
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  #36  
Old 01-18-2013, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bassman View Post
Not sure where I read it, but I think here in the UK, a "sexless marriage" is considered that, where it happens less than once a month.
Is that a typo?
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  #37  
Old 01-18-2013, 11:44 PM
bassman bassman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday View Post
Is that a typo?
This article says that less than 10 times a year, - allright, mine wasnt that infrequent, but almost.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/ar...racey-Cox.html


Oh and Ive read her book, rather traditional advice im afraid.
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  #38  
Old 01-18-2013, 11:52 PM
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SweetSensations SweetSensations is offline
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MzWiz View Post
A friend pointed me to your thread as your situation is similar to my own
20+ years together, but we've been in different beds/bedrooms for well over 10 years now, my quarterly "bonus" became a yearly thing, and a few years back, I too was "authorized" to seek release elsewhere (DADT which eventually kicked me in the behind as emotions got involved so we stopped)

I must admit I laughed when I read you actually bought a f-ing machine, I tried to get mine to build one with me (as we're both technically inclined, thought I'd get his interest.... he looked at me like I was nuts)
I've been in & out of therapy several times (him saying he would join yet every time we had a session, something came up and he was unable to attend)
We've talked and talked, I've cried a river of tears, begged on bended knee more times than I can count... and yes, I've even felt like a rapist (and told him such, many times)
I too can get him hard easily enough yet he has no interest in finishing
I've taken homeopathic anaphrodisiacs to kill my mojo (useless), spoken with traditional Drs about chemical castration (for myself - strongly discouraged and if taken long term: permanent as it kills brain receptors which never recoup), I've even considered physical castration and even suicide.... yes, sorry, I have... the pain being more than I can take...
Fortunately, I'm a AA member and if I got through that, I know I can get through this
All of the above took place over a 3-5 year period…. Many-many conversations through-out, many promises on his side to see Drs, get his T checked, move mountains if required… but nothing was ever done

Last October, I had a "final" discussion with him - a "shit or get off the pot" talk which I thought sunk in, finally...... but it didn't
A week or so ago, his hugs started feeling very uncomfortable (we always hugged goodnight) and he was upset, so we talked again…
He got very frustrated with me, saying I’m the one pulling back, that it was my fault…. (please note: throughout he’s stated it was my fault, I’m too horny, I am never satisfied, I’m a “pig”)
We then had a conversation which left him speechless several times as I rattled off all the tricks and ploys I’ve used over the years to get his attention, how I felt it was such a miracle, such a blessing, to finally have access to his form in a way which connected us “inside”, of having him finally “with” me, deeply…
Did/has that had any effect? Has he called anyone, done any research, made any move….
Kinda, I got flowers and roast beef dinner the next day (his idea of showing me love), I accepted, gratefully, acknowledging his effort… then next day, another conversation
From his perspective, flowers & dinner makes everything OK again…. But not from mine…
He said he’s feeling rejected, me, in another one of my don’t-piss-me-off-moods as I realize he really doesn’t get it, I told him point blank: Let me know how it feels after 10+ years then you’ll know what it’s like to be in my skin (said calmly while looking straight into his eyes – He looked away in pain)

I don’t want to hurt him…. But neither of us is “living” at this point
We’re living in the same building, work very well together as a team, don’t argue/fight on anything really, all in all a very comfortable lifestyle, no drama, steady-as-she-goes life…..
And while there is still desire within me for him, it’s easier now to quiet that voice as I know with 100% certainty that if I allow closeness of that nature, we’re only going to back to the same place again in a few months

I explained it to him this way:
Years ago, he was a welder, hated the job but had to pay the bills…..
Then he got into IT and loves it
From my perspective, our relationship has gone this path but inverse whereas it was joy, now it’s work/uncomfortable
And yes, now our conversations, all our conversations, are work/filled with tension/unilateral(his way 99% of the time with me assisting, to which I balk and causes additional friction)…..

My hopes for me is that I am able to keep the house (mine legally) with him, and we can live together as family till one of us moves on
Neither of us has someone waiting in the wings (not on my side, and I’m assuming on his either as he does say he loves me and it shows in his eyes)
We started as friends for 2 years before becoming intimate, so I’d like us to remain friends (at a minimum), and, if possible, remain family
His perspective is: all or nothing
Unfortunately his definition of “all” isn’t the same as mine… and he still hasn’t researched anything or spoke with anyone for help/guidance

I have learnt, at best, I control only myself (my actions/responses/perspectives)
That I can influence the area within 10 feet of me (co-workers, project directions, action plans… my energy overall be it positive or negative will “feed” my 10 feet)
And beyond 10 feet, I have no influence (politics, corporate direction, traffic  )
So If I can only control myself, my actions… and from my perspective, I’ve tried everything I could……
And if I only influence with 10 feet of me, and I’ve communicated over an extended period my needs….
The ball is in his court… yet it’s not….
I know the price of getting his attentions, it’s tears, frustration, loneliness, feelings of abandonment…
And it’s my choice if I want to go there (not!)
But I can focus on me… try to use “I” more instead of “we”… he’s noticed, and he’s scared… yet somehow not scared enough to action

As stands, I’m slowly cleaning the house, throwing out the clutter, knowing I’m doing so because the house will eventually be sold (I’m not keeping it alone, not walking/living with his ghost once we part)
He knows this, he isn’t helping but he isn’t stopping me either

My hopes for you is you focus on yourself & your 10 feet
Find as much pleasure you can within that space of 10 feet, no matter where you are or who you are with
And most of all, remember, you are a valuable person just as you are
There is nothing wrong with you, you exist for a purpose, a good purpose, deserve to love & be loved as you understand love
Your definition of self is based on what’s in you, not what’s external, his views/needs/perspective of you or your couple
It’s hard, I know, yet I truly believe I have been given this challenge as so I will grow stronger
As to why I need to be SuperMan emotionally, I don’t know, but that’s OK
Just be careful of negative thinking, of feeling lessor-than because one person isn’t loving you as you need/want/desire
You are beautiful just as you are, many people in your life love you just as you are
Yes, this isn’t easy…..
No, unfortunately, no one has your answer for you….
But there are others, like myself, in similar situations, so you’re not alone
And for me, knowing I’m not alone, knowing I am not some kind of extraterrestrial making unreasonable demands…
It gives me strength, helps me face the day, helps me have those uncomfortable conversations

Sorry for the long post, not sure if it helps you… but knowing you too are going through this kind of mess helps me
So thank you for posting and letting me air out a few things
I was elated that there is someone that mirrors my actions. Who loves you baby!! I must admit I had to compose myself first! Laughs nervously we are more alike than you think. I will respond to this later.
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  #39  
Old 01-21-2013, 11:34 AM
wildflowers wildflowers is offline
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Very well put, MzWiz, and moving. I am glad you've found a way to respond to your situation that feels productive and validating for you.
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  #40  
Old 01-21-2013, 01:51 PM
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Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
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Location: Metro West Massachusetts
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In long marriages, sex frequency can wax and wane. Certain things can interfere with one's sex drive: kids, health, losing a job, grief over loss of a parent or beloved sibling, etc.

But a partner who starts off sexual and becomes sexless, and refuses treatment (medical), or psychological, sees their partner horny and won't help in any way, for years on end... That person can be dumped, or offered an ultimatum. Willingly open the marriage so I can have sex/intimacy with others, or I am out of here.

No one should be called a pig for having a sex drive. Having a sex drive, even a strong one, is NORMAL. Some will argue it is a need like a need for water, food and shelter. Certainly it is a strong drive that can make you almost crazy (distracted, extremely irritable, losing confidence in oneself as a person...) if unfulfilled.

Personally, I am polyamorous. I have a gf who can be quite sexually fulfilling, but she does go through asexual periods. Luckily my bf is always horny, hard, touchy feely, so I don't have to walk around distracted and throbbing when my gf sits around naked, cuddles and kisses me, dresses sexy, even tells me I am sexy! but won't follow through.

Good luck asserting your needs and desires! You deserve better. Everyone does.
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me: Mags, 58, living with:
miss pixi, 37, who is dating (NRE):
Master, 32
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