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  #31  
Old 01-03-2013, 12:39 AM
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AnnabelMore AnnabelMore is offline
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I scrolled through and tried to find whether or not this was addressed. I skimmed in places, so I apologize if it already was, but -- are all parties involved open to the idea of Kensi having another serious partner? Not an anonymous sperm donor, but a real partner who could be her husband and the father to her child if it's a man she gets involved with, or at least a second parent if it's a woman she gets involved with, in addition to her relationship with you and your husband?

If so, if she has that option on the table, then I think this could work out in a reasonable way for all involved. If that is not an option -- if her only choices, in the context of this triad, are to be childless forever or to have a child who does not have the benefit of a second parent (I'm assuming that if she had a child by a sperm donor, you wouldn't be comfortable with your husband acting in a fatherly role, since you've said you wouldn't be ok with her and him having an adoptive child... and I also assume you wouldn't be open to being a second mother to said child?), I can't see how that can work out, it just seems like a cruel position for someone who's stated she wants to be a mother to not get the benefit of a partner in parenting.

Either way, it seems like poly-friendly counseling couldn't hurt. If there's any question in your mind as to why you feel so strongly about this, why not explore that and try to understand it better?
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.
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  #32  
Old 01-03-2013, 01:55 AM
FullofLove1052 FullofLove1052 is offline
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Originally Posted by AnnabelMore View Post
I scrolled through and tried to find whether or not this was addressed. I skimmed in places, so I apologize if it already was, but -- are all parties involved open to the idea of Kensi having another serious partner? Not an anonymous sperm donor, but a real partner who could be her husband and the father to her child if it's a man she gets involved with, or at least a second parent if it's a woman she gets involved with, in addition to her relationship with you and your husband?

If so, if she has that option on the table, then I think this could work out in a reasonable way for all involved. If that is not an option -- if her only choices, in the context of this triad, are to be childless forever or to have a child who does not have the benefit of a second parent (I'm assuming that if she had a child by a sperm donor, you wouldn't be comfortable with your husband acting in a fatherly role, since you've said you wouldn't be ok with her and him having an adoptive child... and I also assume you wouldn't be open to being a second mother to said child?), I can't see how that can work out, it just seems like a cruel position for someone who's stated she wants to be a mother to not get the benefit of a partner in parenting.

Either way, it seems like poly-friendly counseling couldn't hurt. If there's any question in your mind as to why you feel so strongly about this, why not explore that and try to understand it better?
It came up, but right now, we all agreed that would be overkill and too much to balance. This is stressful enough. We are still adjusting to this and trying to reconfigure things. We're in the probationary period, where we are seeing if it will even work. That's how we came to initially and mutually agree to be in polyfidelitous triad. Down the line once the wrinkles have been ironed out? That may change for her. I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not opposed to that.

There is a small likelihood that I would be more inclined to accept a child born via a sperm donor and be semi-supportive of him being in fatherly position. That would probably have some limits. Like instead of being called dad. Maybe uncle or something. I'd have to sit down and think about them, but as long as it didn't take time away from the children we have now or drastically alter our set-up, I could be eased into that.

I think a poly-friendly counselor might be able to help in some type of way. Not entirely sure how, but I'm willing to at least try and maintain an open mind, heart, and ears.
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  #33  
Old 01-03-2013, 02:06 AM
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I was raised from what feels like birth that children outside of a marriage? That's just a hell no on every single front. I can even remember religion classes from my schooling and the topic arising. It's something I've always been strongly against.
So she would need to marry the father of her hypothetical child in order for you to accept it?

Last edited by Emm; 01-03-2013 at 02:09 AM. Reason: To add quote
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  #34  
Old 01-03-2013, 02:29 AM
FullofLove1052 FullofLove1052 is offline
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So she would need to marry the father of her hypothetical child in order for you to accept it?
I meant what I said in the sense that...having a child--extramarital child, if you will--outside of the confines of an already established marriage doesn't appease to my individual set of beliefs. Others are free to do what they want, and I don't believe in passing judgment. Not my place. It's just not something that I would do or believe in for myself, though. I hope I cleared that up.
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  #35  
Old 01-03-2013, 03:40 AM
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I'm not sure I understand -- you'd be ok with her having your husband's biological child, but only if there's an even chance that she'll be carrying your child and not hers? I don't say this to be cruel, I swear, and I apologize if it comes off that way, but how is this not a jealousy issue if all your concerns go out the window as long as you can be equally involved? When the end result might be *exactly* the same as if she and your husband had a child together the traditional way? It seems, then, as if the end result of your husband having a child outside of marriage isn't the problem for you, it's simply whether or not you get to be a part of the biological process... that seems very controlling to me, and quite unfair to her since you might be taking away her opportunity to have a child who is biologically related to her.
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.
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  #36  
Old 01-03-2013, 04:18 AM
FullofLove1052 FullofLove1052 is offline
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You're entitled to your opinion. I respect it but not necessarily agree. Agree to disagree and move forward.

I said I could live with that. Not accept it. Not support it with all of my heart and all of my soul. Just live with it. I'm trying my best to come up with a solution that doesn't end with my marriage in divorce and a 12 year relationship going down the drain. Realistically, that's where I'm at if this happens and praying that it doesn't have to be like that. Everybody seems to want me to suck it up and deal with it. It's all about what's unfair to her. What about what's emotionally unreasonable and unfair to me?

If I have to deal with this something has to give. If it means sacrificing my own happiness, I guess I'll have to do it or admit defeat. I'm tired of people telling me I'm being unfair, hypocritical, and everything else. I'm drowning and struggling to find a solution. Nothing is gelling over too well. My feelings aren't going to change. I'm not some na´ve, impressionable child who changes with the direction of the wind.

I'm not happy with any suggested solutions. Perhaps we just need to break this up now, and she and I can part on good terms, too. Maybe this triad thing isn't going to work and monogamous is how I need to live from this moment forward. I just don't know. I guess I'm wired differently or maybe poly and being religious don't work well together.

How I intially felt: I would rather have gotten a divorce, be involved in a custody battle, and been single than ever be alright with another woman on this earth having my husband's child. I told them exactly how I felt in a tasteful but blunt manner. Not a guilt trip. Not intended to make anyone feel bad. It's what I felt. Don't ask me to be honest and not be prepared for the venom I shoot out.

See the difference? At least, I'm trying to find a solution that I can at least live with every day. However it's blowing up because it's only a matter of time before I blow and don't hold back what I genuinely feel and think. I've been biting my tongue to protect her feelings. The minute I do that? Somebody's world is going to shatter and there will be tears shed. I'm steps away from my breaking point, and it's killing me. I want to scream and cry, but for the sake of sanity, I have to keep it together.
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  #37  
Old 01-03-2013, 04:47 AM
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She was your gf first, right? Then she got involved with your husband, and she hadn't ever mentioned wanting to be a mother until now. So you are freaking out and say you will divorce him if she bears his child. I guess you didn't think of that before they got involved? Anyway, at first you mentioned your reasoning as tied to the fact that you hated the way your mother's half-siblings were treated and ostracized in your family, but then you state you will shun a child of your husband's born to anyone else but you in exactly the same cruel way.

However, no one is actually saying they want to go ahead and plan on getting pregnant, and your husband and she can use several precautions to make sure it doesn't happen. I know everyone says nothing is fool-proof, but people have successfully avoided pregnancy for centuries. There are herbs, barriers, hormones, surgeries for him or her, termination, etc. And if she wants to be a mother, she could look for another man to father a child with her, either as a donor or as a partner. So, why keep freaking out?

If the slim possibility that your hubs is the father is such a horrible thing to you (which I personally find rather puzzling, given that you acknowledge it is just something that was taught you from a religious perspective that you have chosen to align yourself with - and the whole implantation scheme you wrote about makes very little sense to me, but that is neither here nor there), then perhaps they should simply abstain from PIV sex OR shouldn't be involved sexually at all anymore. If she wants to have a baby, she can find another bf or husband for herself, and if your husband wants a gf, he can look elsewhere. You and she can still be in relationship, if she can forgive you. But maybe she doesn't even want your husband to be the father anyway. You are winding yourself up in knots over speculations.
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Last edited by nycindie; 01-03-2013 at 04:49 AM.
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  #38  
Old 01-03-2013, 05:01 AM
FullofLove1052 FullofLove1052 is offline
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She was your gf first, right? Then she got involved with your husband, and she hadn't ever mentioned wanting to be a mother until now. So you are freaking out and say you will divorce him if she bears his child. I guess you didn't think of that before they got involved? Anyway, at first you mentioned your reasoning as tied to the fact that you hated the way your mother's half-siblings were treated and ostracized in your family, but then you state you will shun a child of your husband's born to anyone else but you in exactly the same cruel way.

However, no one is actually saying they want to go ahead and plan on getting pregnant, and your husband and she can use several precautions to make sure it doesn't happen. I know everyone says nothing is fool-proof, but people have successfully avoided pregnancy for centuries. There are herbs, barriers, hormones, surgeries for him or her, termination, etc. And if she wants to be a mother, she could look for another man to father a child with her, either as a donor or as a partner. So, why keep freaking out?

If the slim possibility that your hubs is the father is such a horrible thing to you (which I personally find rather puzzling, given that you acknowledge it is just something that was taught you from a religious perspective that you have chosen to align yourself with - and the whole implantation scheme you wrote about makes very little sense to me, but that is neither here nor there), then perhaps they should simply abstain from PIV sex OR shouldn't be involved sexually at all anymore. If she wants to have a baby, she can find another bf or husband for herself, and if your husband wants a gf, he can look elsewhere. You and she can still be in relationship, if she can forgive you. But maybe she doesn't even want your husband to be the father anyway. You are winding yourself up in knots over speculations.
At this point, I'm conceding. I know my emotional limits, and I've surpassed them. I have to take a step back. I don't want to think about it at all. If I do, somebody's going to get their feelings hurt. For the best interest of all parties, I'm steering clear of this until I can sort out whatever internal and religious issues I'm dealing with.

It may come down to realizing that maybe poly no longer fits the mold of my life, and that I am just not cut out for this and everything it entails anymore. I appreciate all of the advice from each and every one of you. Thank you tremendously. For the time being...this is a dead issue, as it is like beating a dead horse.
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  #39  
Old 01-03-2013, 05:23 AM
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If it helps, I feel same. I love kids, but I feel strongly about wanting my kids to be in wedlock. Divorce, accidents leaving people widowed -- LIFE happens. So it doesn't always end up that way of course, but that is what I hoped and wanted for ME. Parenting = just me and DH.

Solution? Closed through Active Parenting. Don't need oopsie babies, don't need drama over reproductive desires not lining up with romantic desires of other partners. Don't want other people's wants, needs, and limits to have to consider in baby makin'. Don't want to deal in weird custody things. Don't want to deal in co-parenting with anyone but him.

I know some friends who do the poly-parenting tribe thing and that works for them. I think it is great - for them. More than happy to be supportive.
But I don't want that parenting option for myself. My willingness is not there for parenting in that style. DH is also not willing.

It's hard to be in the Limbo place while still discussing it with them. But keep talking, hang in there. You will get there. To the place where "There! All is settled! One way or another!"

You do not have to explain why you feel how you do. You just report willingness. You are willing to do X at this time. You are not willing to do Y at this time. You are willing to alert if your willingness should change. But the forecast for changing-ness on that is NO. Looking like hard limit. Are they willing to live with that or not to be in triad-ship with you?

So you could just be ok with this is just how you feel about it. It is a HARD LIMIT thing for you. There it is. There's no need to bang your head on the wall here. You are not a horrible person to have a hard limit. Everyone has something somewhere. They don't all have to be the same kinds of hard limits.

If they can agree to respect the limit, great. If not able to agree? Everyone will deal with it not being a runner. Disappointing, but Life is Life.

If it's a runner for a time, it is a runner for a time. If that time ends or wants and needs change and updates are needed to agreements? Could renegotiate. If not possible? Could know that it could include breaking up. Keep it real over there. It will be ok however it plays out.

People don't polyship for it to be a piece of cake all the time. People do it because they want to love their people, and love them hard.

And that includes loving yourself. However it is you happen to be. Even with whatever soft/hard limits you happen to come with! Be kinder to you being your honest, authentic self.

Remember to BREATHE.

Galagirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 01-03-2013 at 08:43 AM.
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  #40  
Old 01-03-2013, 07:21 AM
Lucinda Lucinda is offline
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I'm coming out of lurkdom to suggest that, while hurting people's feelings is not something anybody wants to do, being honest is really important. And being honest is probably kinder in the long run.

You strongly feel that marriages are more sacred and special than other relationships. And that feeling isn't right or wrong. It just is. And you feel (if I've understood it right) that you can only be married to one person. Again, there's no wrong or right about it. It's just how you feel.

But it's fair to be honest about this with your girlfriend, so that she may seek out a primary relationship of her own. She can seek out somebody who will be able to share that sacred bond with her and can co-parent with her. And she can still be in a relationship with you and your husband. Being poly means you don't have to pick one over the other.
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