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Old 11-16-2012, 11:42 PM
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garhdo garhdo is offline
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Default Should I let them fluid-bond?

A bit of backstory (this is covered in more detail in my previous post 'My Poly Puzzle'):

Mrs has another partner, A, that she met through a swinging site. They have been seeing each other for about four months now. Feelings have developed between them and they are pretty much exclusive to each other (by which I mean neither are swinging with anyone else).

A while ago though I discovered they had had sex without condoms a few times. This was before they admitted their feelings to each other but things were obviously developing between them. Now this did create some hurt and anger for me as safe sex while swinging is important to me. I also did something similar previously with J, to my regret, which caused similar upset.

Since then though I have learned about fluid-bonding. The idea of it bringing partners closer due to the intimacy of it makes sense to me. Obviously me and Mrs are fluid-bonded, and thinking back it seemed to have positive effects on not just Mrs and A's relationship but also mine and J's, despite the problems caused between me and Mrs.

I'm fairly certain that Mrs would like to fluid-bond with A and stop using condoms. I'm sure if it were possible I would probably do so with J. Both have had negative STI tests and are exclusive so safety isn't a concern, but I still have reservations, perhaps because of what happened in the past.

Am I being hypocritical? Should I let them do it?
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  #2  
Old 11-17-2012, 01:00 AM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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You do not LET anyone do anything.

You choose your behavior. Other people choose their behavior.

So speak to your willingness in your behavior. You do not present this as a threat or ultimatum. Just a simple "I am willing/not willing to go here."
  • I am willing to be fluid bonded with you when you are fluid bonded to me and no other. Condoms on for all others. Testing required.
  • I am willing to be fluid bonded with you and your lover (through you). But no more people than that -- condoms ON the rest of the time and testing.
  • I am willing to be fluid bonded with whoever. No condoms required. Testing required / not required?
  • I am NOT willing to be fluid bonded with more people than just you. You are free to choose, but if you chose this, then with ME there will be (condoms? No more sex?)

Or some other thing not listed in the examples. But you speak to YOUR willingness. You share your body with her when you share sex. You choose HOW you share your body and when. It is your body and your behavior you are in charge of.

YOU choose what you are willing to do and not willing to do. You can share this information calmly.

Then she can choose her next behavior with full information and tell you what her choice is.

Then you can choose what your next behavior will require next.

Everyone is free to choose their next behavior choice. They are not free of the consequences of the chosen behavior.

If you feel reservations? Stop sex. Or stop sex without protection. Just pause it (no fluid bonding between you)... and sort out the emotion/trust stuff in the heart bucket and mind bucket. THEN come back to the body bucket of health and make decisions about physical health with willing mind, willing heart, and willing spirit. Could be a pause of a few days. Could be longer. Could be a new rule. But proceed with all your healths in mind -- mental, emotional, physical, spiritual. You are responsible for the well-being of YOU -- in mind, body, heart, soul.

Galagirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 11-17-2012 at 08:58 AM.
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Old 11-17-2012, 02:01 AM
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I was going to say pretty much the same thing GalaGirl said - it isn't something you "let" your partner do or not. After all, she is the owner and boss of her own body. It is something you agree to or not, something to negotiate, but it isn't up to you to "let them." That is their relationship, not yours. All you can do is state what you are and are not comfortable with and what the consequences would be if it happened (condoms for you and Mrs.? No more sex with Mrs.? Divorce? Seeing the paperwork of regular testing every three months?).

That being said, I think four months is wa-a-a-ay too soon for fluid bonding. It is a pretty serious step and, as I understand things, you all need clean test results not once but twice at least, six months apart, to get a true picture of the situation.

I think what's more important is to deal with the betrayal of trust. It was NOT cool that unprotected sex happened and you were informed afterward. You say there was "some hurt and anger" but I think that was a huge transgression and should not be overlooked. Can you really trust them to honor any request or boundary you have? And what have you done to rebuild the trust she had in you before you did something similar with J? I wonder if this was about getting you back for that.
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Old 11-17-2012, 04:33 AM
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There are some amazingly smart people on here. I agree on both counts.

Also, not taking sides here at all, but just curious - what about pregnancy?
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Old 11-17-2012, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nycindie View Post
I was going to say pretty much the same thing GalaGirl said - it isn't something you "let" your partner do or not. After all, she is the owner and boss of her own body. It is something you agree to or not, something to negotiate, but it isn't up to you to "let them." That is their relationship, not yours. All you can do is state what you are and are not comfortable with and what the consequences would be if it happened (condoms for you and Mrs.? No more sex with Mrs.? Divorce? Seeing the paperwork of regular testing every three months?).

That being said, I think four months is wa-a-a-ay too soon for fluid bonding. It is a pretty serious step and, as I understand things, you all need clean test results not once but twice at least, six months apart, to get a true picture of the situation.

I think what's more important is to deal with the betrayal of trust. It was NOT cool that unprotected sex happened and you were informed afterward. You say there was "some hurt and anger" but I think that was a huge transgression and should not be overlooked. Can you really trust them to honor any request or boundary you have? And what have you done to rebuild the trust she had in you before you did something similar with J? I wonder if this was about getting you back for that.


hi there I thought as the Mrs, I would put my side on, since me and A doesn't use a condom and G found out we haven't done it since, I have spoken to A and G about fluid bonding and I have said I would like to do but I haven't and won't do it 1. till he is ready, 2. if at all, I won't ever do it unless he is happy with me to do so. I feel we have built the trust back as he knows we are using condoms but G would have to answer that himself. I wasn't getting back at him, we both sadly have betrayed trust in the relationship and we have worked on it and I feel it is good now and I know if him and J or with someone else, we would talk about it, the reason why it hurt with him and J was because she could have got pregnant and we had to lie to her partner B which I wasn't happy about.

with our relationship, it wouldn't change i am on the pill so I understand of course there is always a risk of getting pregnant but there is always a risk with condoms.

i am sure G will be on later to reply himself i just wanted to explain my side.

thanks xx
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Old 11-17-2012, 04:57 PM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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Jones -- thanks for chiming in! That's always a good thing.

Basically I am hearing your willingness is somewhere around here:
WANT: I would like you to know my willingness to fluid bond with A is at this point at this time.

NEED: I do not NEED to be fluid bonded to A. I am willing to be, and would like to be, and just want you to know where you come down on things so I can have your information. My need is FEEDBACK.

LIMIT: I acknowledge previous trust problem. On my end I feel healed from it.

LIMIT: I am on BCP, so I feel that addresses the pregnancy potential. If that should fail for some reason and I end up pregnant we all agree it would be handled by __________. (You don't have to share the trio decision. Just make sure the trio does talk about it!)

REQUEST: I need information. Where are you at with it? Where is your willingness? Are you willing to entertain the possibility or too early for you to entertain comfortably yet? I am willing to respect your wants, needs, limits but I want to know where you willingness is at -- at THIS point in time. I need feedback. Thank you.
Something like that? Or am I missing the ball park?

If that IS the correct ball park?

Well... where DOES G's willingness lie at this point in time? Only he can answer that. He could say "I am willing to ____. I am NOT willing to _____. " And whatever the blanks get filled in with is cool. But speak up. Fill them in so other people can know where you are at. They cannot mind reader. G-- someone in your polyship is asking you for feedback. And your readiness/willingness is only something you can discern.

If you (G) are struggling... How can others help you to discern it? What feedback do YOU need to help you sort? Before feedback can be given, what ARE the reservations you feel? It sounds like you could be at the "identify and articulate" part of the "sorting stuff" out process.

I salute you BOTH for trying to approach this calmly and reasonably. That's always a good thing. Way to go!

Namaste.
Galagirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 11-17-2012 at 05:05 PM.
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Old 11-17-2012, 07:42 PM
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Hi galagirl,

Quote:
WANT: I would like you to know my willingness to fluid bond with A is at this point at this time.

NEED: I do not NEED to be fluid bonded to A. I am willing to be, and would like to be, and just want you to know where you come down on things so I can have your information. My need is FEEDBACK.

LIMIT: I acknowledge previous trust problem. On my end I feel healed from it.

LIMIT: I am on BCP, so I feel that addresses the pregnancy potential. If that should fail for some reason and I end up pregnant we all agree it would be handled by __________. (You don't have to share the trio decision. Just make sure the trio does talk about it!)


I would love to fluid bond with A because of many reasons, I love him dearly, I only feel I don't need to fluid bond with him because I don't want to upset G. with the pregnancy I know we would find a way to be happy with it with time but it would be hard on all four of us including his gf and I only can see me wanting children with my G but I always thought I only wanted G as my only partner till we started poly

Quote:
REQUEST: I need information. Where are you at with it? Where is your willingness? Are you willing to entertain the possibility or too early for you to entertain comfortably yet? I am willing to respect your wants, needs, limits but I want to know where you willingness is at -- at THIS point in time. I need feedback. Thank you.
We have discussed it this afternoon and he has said we would have to all have STI tests and if he does sleep with someone new we would use condoms till he gets tested again. which is fair and right for us, its the smart solution for us.

Quote:
I salute you BOTH for trying to approach this calmly and reasonably. That's always a good thing. Way to go!
thanks galagirl, we have spoke about it before and we spoke about it today and I feel we have come to a good healthy agreement
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Last edited by jones; 11-17-2012 at 07:44 PM.
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Old 11-17-2012, 09:27 PM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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Quote:
thanks galagirl, we have spoke about it before and we spoke about it today and I feel we have come to a good healthy agreement
Great to hear! Glad you have come to agreement that works for you both at this time.

GG
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