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  #31  
Old 10-27-2012, 01:16 AM
BoringGuy BoringGuy is offline
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In my opinion, there is nothing else you need our help with. It seems that you know what you need to do, but the thing is you can only control what YOU do. The other people need to work together WITH you, not AGAINST you or SEPARATELY from you, if they also want this to work for everyone.

It is my suggestion that you switch to a blog thread, because it seems to me that now you are more in talking-to-yourself "journal" mode, rather than seeking advice/discussion mode. For the past few posts you've been see-sawing between "i'm sure monogamy is the only thing for me" and "i think I'm down for a poly relationship between John and Sarah as long as they don't kiss on the lips in public."

It's starting to give me a headache, so my usefulness is at an end in this thread (if it ever began in the first place).
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  #32  
Old 10-27-2012, 01:43 AM
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Anneintherain Anneintherain is offline
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I might second the blog idea I don't think Sarah has done anything wrong, though I think she could helping out more with negotiating something that works for everybody, but she's kinda in the middle of a bunch of crazy turmoil herself, I'm sure its overwhelming.
I don't think John is a bad person, though I think he isn't acting nice right now because he is very focused on what he wants.
But I did ask about them taking a romantic (not friendship) break while everybody figures out what they want or need, and you don't want to address it (or address it here), so I'm not really sure that you are looking for input or advice, but more to talk things through and see if you can get any more clear about perhaps, what it is that you want to do about it all.

I wish you all luck though!
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  #33  
Old 10-27-2012, 01:45 AM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is online now
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Quote:
You are very stuck on the kissing hello/goodbye. I see that you value that. I also see you fear being outed.

But John is bugging you on it without offering anything.
Sorry about that. I meant it like this...

"You two (the couple) are very stuck on the kissing hello/goodbye. I see you (Lydia) value that. I also see you (Lydia) fear being outed. But John is bugging you on it (ex: "WHY do you value that?") without offering any explanation on why this bugs him so. (ex: "I need to know why you value that so I can _____.")
I mean, you just DO value that. How can you (the couple) move on to talking about other things if you (the couple) are stuck on this one thing like a broken record?

If you (the couple) are stuck on that one, in negotiation talks could you (the couple) just "bookmark" that place and go "Alright, that place is a sticky place. Let's just note it and come back to that one on the repass. Move it forward to ID other weak points first."

Quote:
John has agreed to stop questioning the validity of my need for exclusivity. That is a step forward. He's apologized for the first two instances of breaking my trust, and said those types of things wouldn't happen again. I think at the point what we need is simply time to build back the trust. These things don't get fixed overnight.
Thank goodness! Got UNSTUCK on that point. Whew!

As you continue to talk and try to problem solve, maybe you can try agreeing on the purpose of the talking session and time limit it so people do not emotional flood or you go round in circles endlessly? (Could google "emotional flooding" if you do not know what that is.)

Like...
"Ok. 1 hour meeting. Fridays at 9 PM. The purpose of THIS particular session is just to ID weak places and problem areas. Not to SOLVE them. Just to ID them. If we run out of time, we can set new appointment to ID. Repeat until all we can ID has been identified on Friday nights. Rest of the time? We try to live like normal people so we can have SOME normal back even as we deal with this elephant in the room and breaking it down."
Otherwise you keep getting stuck in places, keep living daily drama. These things really do NOT get solved over night. It helps to have SOME normal life in there somewhere.

Daily drama makes it feel all "ugh" for everyone like "Are we EVER going to get there?!" Exhausting.

I agree that you seem to need mostly a safe venting space -- so start a fresh blog thread. Or ask here in a post with a link to this thread to have a moderator move THIS tread to the blog area.

Hang in there.

Galagirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 10-27-2012 at 01:50 AM.
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  #34  
Old 10-27-2012, 01:54 AM
BoringGuy BoringGuy is offline
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Maybe this is just me - but when I had another partner and my Spouse didn't, I went out of my way to make sure I gave my Spouse extra attention and regularly checked to make sure there was anything I could do to make things "better" for them.

It continually amazes me to see so many people who don't do that. I seems so obvious that if someone is "really poly", meaning they ARE in love with both of these people, they should be ALREADY appreciative of what the established partner may be going through.
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  #35  
Old 10-27-2012, 01:58 AM
Lydia1 Lydia1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoringGuy View Post
For the past few posts you've been see-sawing between "i'm sure monogamy is the only thing for me"
Actually, I've never said that. I've said that full out polyamory, where all relationships are independent and equal and sexually active is absolutely not an option. But I have not said that strict monogamy, with no other loves or relationships, is an absolute need. Of course it's a want (we had a happy monogamous relationship before this, and it would be such a relief to have the simplicity and peace of that back), and I also want a million dollars and a lifetime supply of chocolate, but I can live without them.

Quote:
It's starting to give me a headache, so my usefulness is at an end in this thread (if it ever began in the first place).
Hey, I'm sorry if my backstory is long. There are a lot of complexities to this whole thing, and when people asked for clarification, or an aspect seemed like it hadn't really been explained, i filled in the blank spots. I appreciate the help that everyone has given me with their feedback. There are lots of great resources, points, advice, and suggestions in all the responses. If you don't want to continue reading this thread or responding, I won't take it personally. It's all good. ;-) Thank you for the help you've already given me.
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  #36  
Old 10-27-2012, 02:03 AM
BoringGuy BoringGuy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lydia1 View Post

Hey, I'm sorry if my backstory is long. There are a lot of complexities to this whole thing, and when people asked for clarification, or an aspect seemed like it hadn't really been explained, i filled in the blank spots. I appreciate the help that everyone has given me with their feedback. There are lots of great resources, points, advice, and suggestions in all the responses. If you don't want to continue reading this thread or responding, I won't take it personally. It's all good. ;-) Thank you for the help you've already given me.
Oh no need to be sorry - but at this point I'm just like "whatever". You seemed like you were really upset and in crisis at first and now you're just all, "we'll make it work, we're all human". So, like, grooovy. Peace out.
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  #37  
Old 10-27-2012, 02:23 AM
Lydia1 Lydia1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoringGuy View Post
Oh no need to be sorry - but at this point I'm just like "whatever". You seemed like you were really upset and in crisis at first and now you're just all, "we'll make it work, we're all human". So, like, grooovy. Peace out.
I think that's because people have helped me, especially GalaGirl. When I started I felt incredibly alone, because I was. The two people in the world I'm closest to are John and Sarah, so I had no one outside the situation to talk to, and I was incredibly upset, and feeling hopeless. Now I feel like there's a plan, or at least structure to how to move forward.

The catharsis of getting it all out has also helped me a lot. I think it helps to talk the whole story out, so it's not just living in a pit in my stomache.
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  #38  
Old 10-27-2012, 03:36 AM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is online now
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Quote:
It continually amazes me to see so many people who don't do that. I seems so obvious that if someone is "really poly", meaning they ARE in love with both of these people, they should be ALREADY appreciative of what the established partner may be going through.
I see that too. But I'm not especially amazed. People are people. *shrug*

The people may feel love for their partners. Merely being in love means nothing in their other skill buckets. All it shows is that they can feel "being in love" -ness.

They may not all have other interpersonal skills to the same degree as all other polyship partners. For all the polyship people to be able to
  • "put myself in the other guy's shoes" to be able to just "guess" what may be needed by the established partner
  • have the courage to just ASK what the partner may need or want right now. Some people have weak communication skills (articulating or listening) or weak conflict resolution skills. (willingness to not blame but take responsibility for moving it forward)
  • may not have fully developed in all 6 of their maturity types to the same degree as their poly partners -- chronological, physical, intellectual, emotional, social, philosophical. That can throw another monkey wrench in coming to compromise.

People in first polyships are also floundering a bit. You can read all the recipes you want for how to bake a loaf of bread. But til you actually try to bake a loaf of bread? You have only have some knowledge. You have no direct experience. That can be a monkey wrench.

I wonder if Sarah and John are emotionally flooded. That's something else to contend with too -- another monkey wrench.

BREATHE. Take it slow. Have faith that one way or another it will all come out in the wash.

It may not be especially FUN to feel right now sorting out possible monkey wrenches in this situation, but planet will still keep on spinning. Time WILL pass.

Something else will emerge -- a new outlook, a new perspective, a change in willingness in one of the players, a change in emotional volume. Something.

No amount of pushing on the floor will make the Earth spin faster than it does: 24 hrs in a day only, 7 days a week.

So keep talking by appointment, and the rest of the time try to have some NORMAL life somewhere in there.

Galagirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 10-27-2012 at 04:33 AM.
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  #39  
Old 10-27-2012, 04:10 AM
Lydia1 Lydia1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anneintherain View Post
But I did ask about them taking a romantic (not friendship) break while everybody figures out what they want or need, and you don't want to address it (or address it here), so I'm not really sure that you are looking for input or advice, but more to talk things through and see if you can get any more clear about perhaps, what it is that you want to do about it all.
I'm pretty sure I mentioned in another post that John and Sarah are talking about taking a break after November 4th.

I have talked to them about a lot of the things on this thread, but results make not percolate at Internet forum thread speed. Lol
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  #40  
Old 10-27-2012, 04:17 AM
Lydia1 Lydia1 is offline
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Oh! When you guys mentioned a blog post I at first didn't know what you meant. I thought you were saying something like - tell your story to livejournal. I didn't realize that was a whole category here on the Forum. If you guys think this definitely fits better there, I'll ask the moderators to move it.
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