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  #21  
Old 08-29-2012, 04:09 PM
snowmelt snowmelt is offline
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Originally Posted by Urvile View Post
What do I walk towards? One thing is, to be happy just to be by myself. To have clear direction, and move towards it. To build my life, not spin and spin and spin.
Ok, I may now have some of your attention. I know this is hard work. Stay with me on this. I know (that you know) when I asked you why you walk towards, I was asking you why you walk towards someone who lies to you and cheats on you. Your answer to me only makes sense if you twist my question first. I'm going to untwist my question and ask it again.


Why do you walk toward someone who lies to you and cheats on you?
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  #22  
Old 08-29-2012, 04:11 PM
Urvile Urvile is offline
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Why do you walk toward someone who lies to you and cheats on you?
I'm not walking towards her, I've been turning, and walking away. It's been hell. And I've tried not to burn the bridge as I've done it. You may ask why worry about burning the bridge? That''s for my sake, not hers.
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  #23  
Old 08-29-2012, 04:16 PM
snowmelt snowmelt is offline
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Originally Posted by Urvile View Post
I've been struggling to wrap my arms around it all, and face her directly.
These are your words from reply #17. If you are not walking toward her, what does this mean? Tell me more about burning the bridge. The more detail you give, the better the chance I will be able to help. Answer both questions. Don't skip the first question and jump to the second question.

Last edited by snowmelt; 08-29-2012 at 04:19 PM.
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  #24  
Old 08-29-2012, 04:33 PM
Urvile Urvile is offline
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Quote:
Why do you walk toward someone who lies to you and cheats on you?

Wanted to reply, with a non-reply. I'll have to answer this later today.
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  #25  
Old 08-29-2012, 04:39 PM
snowmelt snowmelt is offline
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Originally Posted by Urvile View Post
Wanted to reply, with a non-reply. I'll have to answer this later today.
Sounds like you're thinking about actually talking about this. I'll check back later to see if you really are ready to talk.

I have been thinking about our exchange. Just in case you decide not to come back to this thread, I want to point out something I think is interesting. Maybe if I point it out here and now, you will read it.


Among your complaints is your girlfriend lies to you. You and I are not in a relationship. We are just chatting about you on this forum. Even through this chatting, I get a sense of who you are. I pay attention when you write something. I pay attention when you answer a question. In short, I pay attention when we are talking. You backed away from that. You say you want your girlfriend to pay attention to you. The fact is she does not pay attention to you very well.


What does this say about you?
Here is the pattern I see:


You pay very close attention to someone (your girlfriend) who does not pay much attention to you. On the other hand, I pay very close attention to you when we talk on this forum. You backed away from that. That tells me you are uncomfortable talking with someone who pays close attention to what you say and do. I know I am only a stranger on the internet, but our forum chat still requires each of us to pay attention to the chat. I notice the amount of attention you give to our chat. You felt the need to stop when my questions got too close to something in you that you did not want to talk about.


Again, this revels a pattern in you. You say you want others to pay attention to you, but you would rather give your attention to someone who does not reciprocate that attention (your girlfriend), than someone who does (me). You back away from someone like me who is giving you attention, and uses that attention to try to see who you really are. This is a strong pattern in you. It causes you a lot of anguish. It will continue to cause that anguish until you are willing to look directly at whatever is inside of you that is causing it.


The last few things you said to me clearly indicated you were getting uncomfortable. You were starting to dance around the very stuff you did not want to talk about. That stuff is exactly what you will need to talk about (at the very least with yourself) to resolve this within yourself.


Whether we talk again or not, I wish you the best.

Last edited by snowmelt; 08-29-2012 at 07:33 PM.
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  #26  
Old 08-29-2012, 07:19 PM
Anneintherain's Avatar
Anneintherain Anneintherain is offline
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Originally Posted by Urvile View Post
I missed this before, wanted to comment.

Quote:
"when you had an affair, would it have been useful for your gf to contact that person letting them know they were a bad person who was causing problems for you two?"

* It was a moment of impulse, I'm not excusing it, just context.
* The person whom I had a affair with, was her friend first.
* The person whom I had the affair with, knew the situation ( lies / cheating /blaming ) and in her own way was trying to heal me.
* I've lost the friendship of someone I really care about because of this.
* When it came out, ironicaly there was a virtual cat fight between them. They no longer talk.
* I wanted to come out into the open almost immediately. I felt like such a hypocrite.
So...this really makes me see what snowmelt is saying about it taking a bit of work to listen to what someone is telling you. (Perhaps its the written format and not the case via other delivery means?)

None of those things you responded with actually answered the yes/no question I asked, where the only purpose was to illustrate that a 3rd party is irrelevant to issues between you and your partner, confronting the other person involved does not solve anything.

However it looks like the answer to my question was no. Her and the other person interacting about the affair resulted in drama and distraction from the actual issue - the problems between you and your partner. Both of you confronted third parties, and it has not improved your actual dynamic in any way, just given you both more stuff to be pissed about.

I'm not saying those details don't make your story more lurid and drama filled, but they don't really have much relevance in giving objective relationship advice, other than to back up neither of you seem to have great boundaries or a huge desire to be happy in a relationship.
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  #27  
Old 08-29-2012, 08:09 PM
Urvile Urvile is offline
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Originally Posted by Anneintherain View Post
So...this really makes me see what snowmelt is saying about it taking a bit of work to listen to what someone is telling you. (Perhaps its the written format and not the case via other delivery means?)
No; I get written form. I'll try to be more direct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anneintherain View Post
None of those things you responded with actually answered the yes/no question I asked, where the only purpose was to illustrate that a 3rd party is irrelevant to issues between you and your partner, confronting the other person involved does not solve anything.
It may be more of my inability to just say yes or no.
Yes, the problem lies with her and I.
Yes, and this lesson was one of the most difficult, I can't blame him for what happened.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anneintherain View Post
However it looks like the answer to my question was no. Her and the other person interacting about the affair resulted in drama and distraction from the actual issue - the problems between you and your partner. Both of you confronted third parties, and it has not improved your actual dynamic in any way, just given you both more stuff to be pissed about.
Yes I agree with this statement, 100%.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anneintherain View Post
I'm not saying those details don't make your story more lurid and drama filled, but they don't really have much relevance in giving objective relationship advice, other than to back up neither of you seem to have great boundaries or a huge desire to be happy in a relationship.
I agree with this, with one exception, I'm here, I'm asking for help; and this for me is difficult. I want to be happy, I want to be a good person.

Last edited by Urvile; 08-29-2012 at 08:11 PM.
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  #28  
Old 08-29-2012, 08:40 PM
Urvile Urvile is offline
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Originally Posted by snowmelt View Post
Sounds like you're thinking about actually talking about this. I'll check back later to see if you really are ready to talk.

I have been thinking about our exchange. Just in case you decide not to come back to this thread, I want to point out something I think is interesting. Maybe if I point it out here and now, you will read it.
I'm back. And I'll be direct while answering your questions.

Quote:
Among your complaints is your girlfriend lies to you. You and I are not in a relationship. We are just chatting about you on this forum. Even through this chatting, I get a sense of who you are. I pay attention when you write something. I pay attention when you answer a question. In short, I pay attention when we are talking.
I've been surprised by the directness. I like it.

Quote:
You backed away from that. You say you want your girlfriend to pay attention to you. The fact is she does not pay attention to you very well.
Yes, this has been true, and I've seen it, in both small, and large ways.


Quote:
What does this say about you?
Here is the pattern I see:


You pay very close attention to someone (your girlfriend) who does not pay much attention to you. On the other hand, I pay very close attention to you when we talk on this forum. You backed away from that. That tells me you are uncomfortable talking with someone who pays close attention to what you say and do.
I'm not uncomfortable, I would say, I'm learning how to communicate both to you, and within this forum. You may have seen uncertainty, mostly it's not what I say, and mean, but how I say it. Never the less, my goal is to communicate clearly, and without ambiguity.

Quote:
I know I am only a stranger on the internet, but our forum chat still requires each of us to pay attention to the chat. I notice the amount of attention you give to our chat. You felt the need to stop when my questions got too close to something in you that you did not want to talk about.
The need to stop was because I was late to work, work has been stressful.
I could have said nothing and then waited to respond. I was trying to be respectful of your time.

Quote:
Again, this revels a pattern in you. You say you want others to pay attention to you, but you would rather give your attention to someone who does not reciprocate that attention (your girlfriend), than someone who does (me). You back away from someone like me who is giving you attention, and uses that attention to try to see who you really are. This is a strong pattern in you. It causes you a lot of anguish. It will continue to cause that anguish until you are willing to look directly at whatever is inside of you that is causing it.
See above.

Quote:
The last few things you said to me clearly indicated you were getting uncomfortable. You were starting to dance around the very stuff you did not want to talk about. That stuff is exactly what you will need to talk about (at the very least with yourself) to resolve this within yourself.
I'm here, I'm willing to both talk and listen.


Quote:
Whether we talk again or not, I wish you the best.
Thank you.

Last edited by Urvile; 08-29-2012 at 08:45 PM.
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  #29  
Old 08-29-2012, 08:47 PM
snowmelt snowmelt is offline
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Go back and read replies 21 - 24. Answer those questions directly and honestly. Then tell me what "Wanted to reply with a non reply" is all about.
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  #30  
Old 08-29-2012, 08:57 PM
Urvile Urvile is offline
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You say you want your girlfriend to pay attention to you. The fact is she does not pay attention to you very well.
I thought about this, and it resonated. I've said this to her more than once.

One of my needs, was to be with someone who listens.

When I've been most unhappy in the relationship, has been when she did not listen, or cherry picked one thing out of a conversation.
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