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  #11  
Old 12-04-2009, 04:19 AM
AutumnalTone AutumnalTone is offline
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Am I self oppressed?
You...you'll go blind doing that.

Didn't your mother warn you?
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  #12  
Old 12-04-2009, 04:22 AM
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MonoVCPHG MonoVCPHG is offline
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You...you'll go blind doing that.

Didn't your mother warn you?
Nope...guess that explains the lasik eye surgery
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  #13  
Old 12-04-2009, 04:55 AM
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I had to laugh at this one, not because I disagree with the basic premise, but because it also perpetuates stereotypes that harm people. The best data we have available on domestic abuse shows that women abuse men more often than men abuse women. The spectacle of the man beating the woman bloody is what gets attention, however, and so many people assume most domestic abuse is aimed at women by men because of that. It's supposedly OK for women to abuse male partners because "she's just a woman" and can't "really" hurt him. A man, I guess, is supposed to suffer the abuse gladly.

It illustrates the point well that a lot of oppression happens because folks don't understand what they're doing.
Most of the anti-oppression work I do is around race and not gender. That particular site was recommended to me by a friend but I have not read it from top to bottom. I definitely agree that domestic abuse is a problem for men as much as it is for women, but I'd love to see the data you're referring to so that I can be better informed when recommending any other sites like that.
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  #14  
Old 12-04-2009, 05:03 AM
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LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
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What does it mean if I draw a blank at this word? I can point to examples of oppression, but don't feel it. I can imagine what it would feel like.

I don't even feel like I am oppressed in my relationship from an external view point...the scary thing is I know why. It's because I feel I chose to live outside the norm so any oppression is brought on by myself. Does this make any sense? Am I so conditioned to be within the norm that I find it my fault if I am judged and therefore I have no right to complain?

Is this why, although I love being open about my relationship with my family and community, I shy away from promoting it even outside my personal concerns of mono/poly couplings?
Am I self oppressed?
I haven't a clue Mono-but I'm struggling to respond to it as well. I know people must be wondering since I started the thread-but that was more for RP then having a clue what to write!
I guess in some way I have lived on the edge of "unacceptable" for so long-I don't notice other people's reactions.
In another way-I also figure if I am going to insist on being "different" from the "norm" in a billion ways-I should expect to be treated as different....

Not sure that's GOOD. Just not sure about how to do something about it either....
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  #15  
Old 12-04-2009, 05:14 AM
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MonoVCPHG MonoVCPHG is offline
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In another way-I also figure if I am going to insist on being "different" from the "norm" in a billion ways-I should expect to be treated as different....

Not sure that's GOOD. Just not sure about how to do something about it either....
Bingo!! That is what I feel as well. Add that to a long history of being deeply entrenched in the "norm" and you end up with someone who points fingers at himself more than others do.
I'm starting to think the "norm" is a huge pile of shit. Nobody is truly "normal"; they just have a way of showing one side. Therefore you end up with a lot of one dimensional people on the surface. I still miss it though.

But is this a form of oppression?
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  #16  
Old 12-04-2009, 07:09 AM
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This whole topic really weighs me down. Do I ever get to feel that I am not oppressive? So what if I am privileged in some areas of my life? I am in that I can buy clothes from Bangledesh at Old Navy for instance. That makes me an oppressor by supporting their store and therefore those that oppress them. If clothing stores such as that only offer clothes from oppressed countries then how and when do I get to not feel like shit for buying them when that is all that is offered. Sure there is so much we can do and I do as much as I can but the burden can be SOooo heavy and it piles guilt and shame onto me that is also oppressive. Much of the way our culture is set up is around oppression in one way or another. What do we do, add everything up and see who comes out as the most oppressed and then sit with that.... what is the point in that? What do we do next?

Is this making sense?

I'm sorry, I don't feel it relates to poly, but I feel as if it needs to just be for me at the moment before I can find the way that it does relate... as I know it does.
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  #17  
Old 12-04-2009, 07:13 AM
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MonoVCPHG MonoVCPHG is offline
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Is this making sense?

.
Yup! And I think the key is to find one way to alleviate the feeling of oppression as you see it and then move on to the next. Otherwise it will likely more than weigh you down; it might crush you. Focus and take action
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  #18  
Old 12-04-2009, 01:50 PM
Ceoli Ceoli is offline
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This whole topic really weighs me down. Do I ever get to feel that I am not oppressive? So what if I am privileged in some areas of my life? I am in that I can buy clothes from Bangledesh at Old Navy for instance. That makes me an oppressor by supporting their store and therefore those that oppress them. If clothing stores such as that only offer clothes from oppressed countries then how and when do I get to not feel like shit for buying them when that is all that is offered. Sure there is so much we can do and I do as much as I can but the burden can be SOooo heavy and it piles guilt and shame onto me that is also oppressive. Much of the way our culture is set up is around oppression in one way or another. What do we do, add everything up and see who comes out as the most oppressed and then sit with that.... what is the point in that? What do we do next?

Is this making sense?

I'm sorry, I don't feel it relates to poly, but I feel as if it needs to just be for me at the moment before I can find the way that it does relate... as I know it does.

This is always a tough one. And the answers are certainly not easy.

Ok, the next thing I'm about to say will often raise people's hackles so please be aware that there is no intent to attack or put anyone down as I go into this. But this is a common issue for many many people. The answer is a hard and difficult answer to live with.

How do you deal with all the weight of this? By realizing that it's not about you.

It's about developing an understanding of the world that has more truth than shelter in it and learning to redefine what choices are right and wrong in the context of that understanding. Its about understanding my role in the oppressive systems we live in. I'm not responsible for those systems, but I am responsible for my choices that I make within those systems.

Yes, each of us can only do so much. But that "so much" isn't about making a list of things you can't do because they're oppressive. The more you keep the awareness of that oppression in you, the more your choices will be informed by that understanding. I make my choices based on honoring that understanding, not based on alleviating my guilt, because those choices aren't about me, they're about trying to be a good human being.

If I were to take the approach of choosing one thing or "cause" to alleviate the oppression and move on, I'm only making choices to alleviate my guilt, and in many ways is a very privileged way to approach the situation.

I firmly believe that people in the world are basically of good conscience. The more people understand about the realities of others created by the privileges we have (even though we didn't create that situation), the more people will make choices that help to undue it.
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  #19  
Old 12-04-2009, 03:23 PM
Quath Quath is offline
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Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
This whole topic really weighs me down. Do I ever get to feel that I am not oppressive? So what if I am privileged in some areas of my life? I am in that I can buy clothes from Bangledesh at Old Navy for instance. That makes me an oppressor by supporting their store and therefore those that oppress them. If clothing stores such as that only offer clothes from oppressed countries then how and when do I get to not feel like shit for buying them when that is all that is offered. Sure there is so much we can do and I do as much as I can but the burden can be SOooo heavy and it piles guilt and shame onto me that is also oppressive. Much of the way our culture is set up is around oppression in one way or another. What do we do, add everything up and see who comes out as the most oppressed and then sit with that.... what is the point in that? What do we do next?
You could be helping those oppressed countries by buying stuff from them.

One sad example is that people felt bad about buying good produced by child labor. So they passed a law that forbid people to buy them. They figured the children would no longer be forced to work. But the end effect is that the children needed the money. From Wikipedia: "In Bangladesh, there was a closure of several sweatshops which had been run by a German company, and as a result, thousands of Bangladeshi children who had been working in those sweatshops ended up working as prostitutes, turning to crime, or starving to death."

Our good intentions made it worse for them.
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  #20  
Old 12-04-2009, 04:09 PM
Ceoli Ceoli is offline
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You could be helping those oppressed countries by buying stuff from them.

One sad example is that people felt bad about buying good produced by child labor. So they passed a law that forbid people to buy them. They figured the children would no longer be forced to work. But the end effect is that the children needed the money. From Wikipedia: "In Bangladesh, there was a closure of several sweatshops which had been run by a German company, and as a result, thousands of Bangladeshi children who had been working in those sweatshops ended up working as prostitutes, turning to crime, or starving to death."

Our good intentions made it worse for them.
I agree that good intentions don't always have good consequences. I also agree that boycotting sweatshop clothes may not necessarily improve things for the laborers. But I wouldn't go so far as to say that it "helps" them to continue feeding the system that keeps them in sweatshops. It merely maintains the status quo which is a pretty sucky status quo for them and a really good one for us. The hard part is to take that awareness and find a new solution with it.
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