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  #11  
Old 07-13-2012, 03:42 PM
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CielDuMatin CielDuMatin is offline
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I've been telling him this. That with any relationship you have no guarantees someone will stay with you - you can't control that, it's their choice whether you are in poly or monogamy.
OK, a good point, and the common response to that from the more monogamous-thinking folks is - "But that's what commitment should be all about - knowing that you're not going to leave me" - the implication is, therefore that poly implies a lack of commitment to romantic relationships.

When my counsellor friend, who had not heard of poly, and I chatted about this, and I explained how I felt about relationships, she observed that I am, in fact, MORE committed to my partners than a lot of monogamous folks are...

So... and this is what comes up - how do we define commitment? Is commitment to a relationship really saying "I will stick by you through thick and thin, even if we don't love each other any more?" Is it really intended to be a lifetime promise that bypasses any sort of choice? I think that the divorce rate shows that this isn't the case (unless all those folks never really had a committed relationship).

No, it really should involve choice - a relationship should last as long as you really want to be with a person. If it really isn't working, then why stick in it and make everyone unhappy?

Commitment, to me, means a promise to stick with things and work through issues, rather than turning tail and running at the first sight of trouble, or on a whim. If a relationship comes to an end it's because all possibilities to try to make it work have failed - there can be no positive outcome. The commitment is to try all those possibilities and to really work at it.

Others may have other definitions, but that is what my partners and I have agreed.
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Last edited by CielDuMatin; 07-13-2012 at 03:53 PM.
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Old 07-13-2012, 03:47 PM
Petunia Petunia is offline
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CielDuMatin, I am going to share this with him. I wonder if that's the difference in our viewpoints on marriage. I never felt the need to get married, but he's always wanted to, so I finally said yes. I have always been perplexed as to the "why." It's not like we're going to start a family together, so really, why?

Thanks.
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Old 07-13-2012, 03:54 PM
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CielDuMatin, I am going to share this with him. I wonder if that's the difference in our viewpoints on marriage. I never felt the need to get married, but he's always wanted to, so I finally said yes. I have always been perplexed as to the "why." It's not like we're going to start a family together, so really, why?
I think that every couple on this planet should have a frank, open and honest discussion about what their relationship means to each of them, including expectations, boundaries, and what constitutes "cheating" on that relationship. So many people make assumptions (often based on cultural norms) and are shocked when their partner doesn't share their opinions...
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Old 07-13-2012, 04:08 PM
Petunia Petunia is offline
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We've spent a lot of time talking this past year, but it seems there is always more to discuss - and sometimes it's the same old ground, but in a different light.
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  #15  
Old 07-13-2012, 05:22 PM
KyleKat KyleKat is offline
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I don't like that people confuse committed with monogamous. Monogamy is a form of committing. You are committing to only be with one person. I am wholly committed to my wife. Anything she needs, I want to be there for her. I am committing my time and energy to her. My love. Devotion. Everything. That isn't the same as agreeing to be monogamous.

Read the ethical slut. Then have your significant other read it. It's not about more or less. It's about differences. You love a because of one thing and b because of another. You aren't going to leave a for b or vice versa but you may leave a and stay with b and vice versa. It's not a pool of love that you divvy out until you're dry. It's a wealth that gets larger the more people you can share it with.
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  #16  
Old 07-13-2012, 05:48 PM
Chimera Chimera is offline
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Petunia - you sound amazingly grounded, and from what you've written, it seems like you and you SO have decent communication.

People have made excellent points. One for your SO to remember is that all relationships change continually. I think some folks just fear change, and overlook that it's already going on all around them. It's better to face it and try to influence the outcome positively. He needs to think deeply about what his fears are and create strategies for overcoming or at least managing them. "Being less cool" is often code for getting older, being more stable, not having fulfilled his desires yet for career, hobby, not being content with appearance, etc. In the end, we may all leave relationships for a variety of reasons. No amount of worrying is going to change that.
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  #17  
Old 07-13-2012, 07:04 PM
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Am I intimidated? Maybe on some small level, but I rarely examine that, because hey, who would give up me doing their laundry?! Or me in bed? Or me making them laugh? Or me making them laugh in bed about their laundry? I can only be me. He can find that enough or not. I am going to do my damdest to be the best me I can be! Just sayin'.
LOVE this. You sound awesome! lol.
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  #18  
Old 07-13-2012, 08:53 PM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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You're still with him after 13 years. Obviously you think he's cool enough. If you didn't leave him for someone cooler when you could only get him or someone else, why would you leave him for someone cooler now that you could have both? That would end up in a loss, the loss of him, and no gain, since you can already be with the other guy anyway. That would be counter-productive.

Of course, that kind of thinking probably doesn't help his insecurities. But the bottom line is, it's toxic thinking to think in term of "who is better". People are different, and you like different things about different people. They're unique, and special, and you don't want to replace him with someone else. You have 13 years of positive history, and he needs to dig into that to trust you. It seems that he thinks you only stays with him because you didn't realise other people were better, and the second you're made aware of it you'll go. This is BS.
You stayed with him because you love him and you want to be with him, and he's the best at being him. And all of these things are going to remain true even if you're with somebody else. That somebody else might be "better" in a bunch of things, but he'll never be "better" at being the man you've been with for 13 years, the man who's helped raise your kids.
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  #19  
Old 07-13-2012, 10:13 PM
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LovingRadiance LovingRadiance is offline
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To answer the question you asked (all of the above was great info I agree with);

I love two men. They are each "cooler" than the other in one way or another. Which is precisely why I love them.
One is my perfect match in the bedroom. He's a Dom, I'm a sub-in bed. He's the most awesome sex partner you can imagine (lol-if you want to imagine). He's also a great partner when it comes to planning financial endeavors.
He's also my husband.

However, he loathes "hanging out to talk".
My boyfriend is comfortable with hanging out and just talking. So he is PERFECT when I want to do that and he's comfortable doing that with our friends.
He's also a very giving lover. He's willing to take as long as is needed to get me to orgasm, without ever caring if he gets to. Which makes him great at certain times of the month when I'm so frustrated I could scream and I just can't GET there.
But, he's submissive, so he sucks at doing the Dominant things I need at other times.

Maca (dh) is great with taking the kids 4-wheeling, fishing, camping, hunting. He likes to work in the garden, but he hates to eat veggies. He's a total romantic, loves to buy me sexy clothes, dress me up and take me out to expensive dinners and dancing. But, he hates working out. He's great with maintenance on the house and cars as well as construction stuff. He loves upbeat "fuck me" dance music like me. He's great at taking charge and giving direction so we can get stuff done. He's great at taking charge if I'm hurting or having medical issues, ensuring that what I need from the Dr's is expressed so that they can get me what I need. He's possessive and insecure, but he stands by me anyway. He loves to spend money and do expensive stuff with me. He's short, muscular, red-headed and sexy as fuck. He's a "go go go" guy who always has an exciting plan. He's very sexual and likes to touch and feel all of the time. He dresses for work as an electrician-but he loves to dress to the 9's when we go out. He likes to see me in dresses with no panties.

GG (bf) is great teaching the kid abcs, riding their bikes, going for walks, volunteer work (like trash cleaning in parks and roads), he LOVES veggies, but doesn't enjoy gardening. He loves to read and he reads to the kids every night before bed. He loves taking walks with me and he has long legs, so a relaxing walk for him is a workout for me. He's awesome at cleaning and detail work. He writes me poetry and saves special mementos of time spent together. He loves finding me romantic lovey dovey music. He follows directions and works well under someone else's instruction. He's great at sitting by my side, holding my hand and just being a strong, reassuring presence in medical crisis's. He's not possessive and rarely insecure. But he stands by me and is accepting and understanding of my need to reassure Maca more frequently. He loves to go do things like sit at the park, browse the bookstore or library and we rarely spend much money together. He's tall, thin and bald. He dresses like a skater and tends to be very mellow. He's extraordinarily affectionate and considerate. He loves me in jeans with a white t-shirt.

They both love movies, they both love me, they both love our kids. They both love to make out in the car. They both love waterfalls and they both love taking vacations with me. They both love to take pictures of me and of the kids and the family. They both think I'm sexy and beautiful and tell me all of the time. They both open doors for women and they are both flirtatious, though very differently. They both have blue eyes and they both have goatees. They both like to cuddle on the couch. They are both protective of me and of our kids. They both stand by me when the going gets tough and they work as a team very well together because they are so different. Even though-they don't consider each other friends!

They're very different. They could compete endlessly-but it would get them nowhere, because they are each 'best' at such completely different things. Specifically, GG is best at being GG and Maca is best at being Maca.

There was a time when Maca tried to be more like GG. It fell flat. I was devastated. The things I love about Maca, GG isn't and can't do/be. There is no replacing that for me and vice versa. Even those things that they have in common, are different.

So, in my experience, no what your fiance is worried about isn't a real risk in a poly dynamic. However, in a mono dynamic-it would be a huge risk. Because at that point, I'd have to decide which one had the things I needed MOST-then choose one over the other.
In fact, that was precisely the problem that ended up leading to me having an affair and subsequently realizing that mono just won't work for me. Because, I couldn't choose.

But, when pushed to the edge, most people do choose and then someone loses. Where as-in poly, there's no need to choose.
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  #20  
Old 07-14-2012, 10:06 AM
sparklepop sparklepop is offline
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Hi

Great post!

Alright, let's add my waffly contribution... haha...

Your husband is just scared that after finally achieving wow status, the addition of more 'wow' people is going to make things ho-hum between you again.

As someone early in the posts said - it's important at this stage that you do put things in place to make sure that you don't forget each other. I'll be completely honest - my GF neglects her husband. I've said this to her before. They have some great moments, but she could do more. They don't really go on dates, she spends a lot of her evening time talking to sub boys online. They've been married for over 11 years and have had many problems. Ho hum territory and hell territory. Poly has really helped their relationship, compared to what it was. But she really could make more time for him. If she did, she'd probably find that he was less insecure and less jealous... i.e. everyone's happier! So I hope you two can still make time for each other.

Anyway, you sound like you've got your head screwed on... so hopefully you've already thought of that!

My next question is, what kind of poly do you think suits you? Polyamorous, where you are open to loving others? Polysexual, where you only want to have extra sexual partners? Do you believe in husband as your primary and others as secondaries? Would you ever consider three or four of you living together? These are useful things to think about and to see where your husband stands on it.

Onto the coolness factor!

I am in agreement with the other posts here.

1. There are no guarantees that you will stay together, even in monogamy
2. Cheating happens because we want others. If we leave the old person for the new person, it's often because we think we have to choose
3. Promoting each others freedom can equal more respect, which can equal stronger bond with each other, more appreciation, more love, more happiness
4. In poly, the concept is that you don't have to leave, because you can have plural! The new person is exciting - but exciting doesn't mean stronger, better, more important.

Maybe some personal experiences will help your husband?

I can tell you some of mine, if you're dying for more babble.

a) When I have a date with, or sleep with, someone else, the first thing I want to do afterwards is hear my girlfriend's voice on the phone, be with her, hold her, even have sex with her. My desire, commitment, love, energy, doesn't fade because of others. It actually increases. We both report these strong feelings of overwhelming love for each other after being with other partners. It's amazing. I value her so much.

b) I was in a mono/poly relationship a few years ago. 5 years of mono with my boyfriend. I adored him. But I met a girl that I had an extreme sexual attraction to. He ended up giving me the green light and I dated both for about 6 months. If I could have had him and her, I would have stayed with both. I loved him in a way that I didn't love her. I wanted her in a way that I didn't want him. I was so torn. But, I had to pick one, so I picked her. Yes, because she was new, because I didn't foresee the hellish relationship to come (haha). BUT if I could have had both, I would!

c) I do not believe you can get everything you need from one person. It was quite funny the other night, actually. My GF has an online submissive she's been involved with for about 1.5yrs. She loves him to death. It's always caused insecurity in me, because he's so placid and sweet. She always goes to him with her problems, she thinks he's wonderful. In contrast, her and I fight like two wild cats. Until a few months ago, I've always thought that given the chance, she'd be better off with him and she'd choose him over me. Then suddenly a few things have changed. She said to me a month ago that our passion is not a bad thing - e.g. her online sex with him is sweet; whereas our sex is wild and fun. Then a couple of nights ago, she was having an issue with a friend. His response was very placid, very peacekeeping, and she was enraged at his response. I laughed and said... "but this is what you love him for!"

So if she wants a warrior, wild sex, long deep conversations and a thrift store buddy, she has me. If she wants to feel a peaceful, calming influence, she goes to him. If she wants a Domme woman, she comes to me. If she wants a sub boy, she goes to him. If she wants an argument, she goes to her husband. Haha

Me personally? If I want to go on a night out, I take my secondary. My GF hates bars. If I want affection and love, I go to my GF. If I want long, soft, spiritual sex, I go to my secondary. If I want hot and wild and fun and fast, I go to my GF. I can honestly say that currently, I want my girlfriend above all others, for the rest of my life. I do not feel that way about my secondary, even though I care for her greatly and want to rip her clothes off. My girlfriend is the one I'm committed to; monogamous or not. In fact, scratch that, I'm more committed to her because she lets me be me! She laughs when I flirt with women in bars; she doesn't restrict me. I wouldn't swap her for anyone.

The most important thing, in all seriousness, is that if you are committed to each other, you have to be kind to each other. That might mean making compromises when you really don't want to... it might mean that he seems to have more issues than you do. Hopefully you two will communicate and work together as a team to keep a lovely and solid relationship thriving. Good luck!
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