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  #11  
Old 06-25-2012, 08:45 PM
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lovefromgirl lovefromgirl is offline
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Originally Posted by WonderingSue View Post
Still feeling a little slighted, I am wondering, do most poly folks feel the same about someone like me? That we can't change? Have you always felt "poly", even when you didn't have the word for it? Thanks.
I don't. There was a time when I didn't have "poly" to describe myself, and then there was a time when I had "poly" but didn't think to apply it. If it's what you want, it's what you want (and if it's not, that's awesome too).

I sometimes wonder how other poly people feel about someone who is vanilla and still poly. I can't meet kinky needs, either. Your crush certainly reinforces the whole "poly must be kinky too" paradigm. What if I'm just wired to want multiple people in my life, no whips or chains attached? /perturbed
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  #12  
Old 06-25-2012, 09:02 PM
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I felt poly when I was a kid, but due to romantic notions and society, I did not think my wants were realistic, and I thought I could be happy with mono. Now I don't want mono.
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  #13  
Old 06-25-2012, 09:25 PM
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CielDuMatin CielDuMatin is offline
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Originally Posted by WonderingSue View Post
Still feeling a little slighted, I am wondering, do most poly folks feel the same about someone like me? That we can't change? Have you always felt "poly", even when you didn't have the word for it? Thanks.
Hmm, see, I think that there are different groups of folks.

Some are monogamous, through and through. No matter how much they pretend to be poly (often to try to make their partner happy), they will never succeed.

Then there are the poly, through and through, that have known it all their lives. No matter how much they try, in order to make their partner happy, eventually they are going to feel closed in.

The middle class are those who have been brought up monogamous, and have managed to suppress the poly urges to convince themselves and others that they are monogamous. The question is, are they willing and able to deprogram themselves from what society has brought them up to think is right?

There have been a few One True Wayers who have maintained that there is no such thing as the first class, and that everyone is poly, it's just that some are hiding it better than others. I don't buy into that at all.

So for me, I didn't feel "poly", I felt unethical, immoral, untrustworthy and a whole bunch of other negative emotions because I didn't seem capable of "staying faithful", no matter how much I loved someone. I had no clue that poly existed.

As for the kink side of things, I have written elsewhere that sometimes the non-kink (vanilla) poly folks feel a bit left out because so many poly folk are also into kink. Kink changes the whole dynamic or relationships and sometimes to the point where "does not compute" starts flashing in the head when you try to grasp the concepts. We talk about how the old Mormon polygamy was bad because of how it was always one man, many women and how women need to have the right to have multiple partners too, and yet the d/s 24/7 TPE relationship is often structured exactly that way, OPP and all. That, somehow is ok, whereas the LDS version isn't. I'm not saying it's wrong, just cannot reconcile the two in my head.

We are talking in other threads on here about how bad it is to be a doormat in a relationship - to stand up for what we need, etc. And yet when it comes to kink, it's just fine to be a doormat and let your "master" dictate everything to you. I struggle to help folks in that sort of dynamic for that reason, I guess.

There is no question, though, that these folks make it work well for themselves, and that it is fully consensual. So it's not that I have a problem with it, just can't comprehend why someone would want that, and thus find it hard to contribute to discussions about it.
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  #14  
Old 06-25-2012, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by lovefromgirl View Post
I sometimes wonder how other poly people feel about someone who is vanilla and still poly. I can't meet kinky needs, either. Your crush certainly reinforces the whole "poly must be kinky too" paradigm. What if I'm just wired to want multiple people in my life, no whips or chains attached? /perturbed
*putting hands up* Here, pick me, pick me! Totally vanilla and never interested in any kink as far as I know it, aside from the 'normal' stuff. Does this really seclude itself this much? I never noted such a strong connection between those areas.
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  #15  
Old 06-26-2012, 12:40 AM
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nycindie nycindie is offline
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Originally Posted by lovefromgirl View Post
I sometimes wonder how other poly people feel about someone who is vanilla and still poly.
I find this such a strange statement. I don't quite understand it. What do you mean by "vanilla and still poly?" Still? Like how is that possible? As if one automatically correlates with the other? It doesn't for me. To me, the practice of kinky or non-kinky sexual activities is completely separate from the practice of structuring one's relationships to be polyamorous, monogamous, etc. Sure, people can take part in both, and have them entwined in their lives, but I object to the idea that poly itself is a kink, which some kinksters seem to be saying sometimes. That always bugs me.
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  #16  
Old 06-26-2012, 04:40 AM
Tonberry Tonberry is offline
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Ciel, a D/s relationship isn't about the sub being a "doormat" They are still equal in respect and human rights, and have the right to tell their Dom(me) if they did something wrong, although depending on the relationship they might have to do it in a very roundabout way.
The point for the sub is to give up all responsibilities, having to make decisions, etc, and letting someone you trust completely, and who knows you better than you know yourself, make these decisions for you. It takes a lot of stress off, stress that the person still has in the rest of their life even if at home they're a 24/7 sub.
Mind you, being a switch I have no direct experience with people who are in 24/7 relationships, or even relationships where the dynamics extent much beyond sex. But the idea that you need to stand up for yourself is still present, it's not about doing what the Dom wants as much as it's about letting the Dom ask you to do what you want.
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  #17  
Old 06-26-2012, 04:57 AM
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CielDuMatin CielDuMatin is offline
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OK, well my lack of experience and interest in kink is showing, quite obviously Thanks for the correction.

It was based a lot on some of the posts in poly forums where kink was more accepted. Lots of train wrecks where the confusing factor (to my mind, at least) was a highly one-sided relationship dynamic where the "sub" couldn't make their concerns known. Maybe this was folks doing kink badly, in the same way that folks can do poly badly.
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  #18  
Old 06-26-2012, 04:59 AM
GalaGirl GalaGirl is offline
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And yet when it comes to kink, it's just fine to be a doormat and let your "master" dictate everything to you.
Um... no. It's agreed to play. It's not being a doormat without rights or without consent. Playing out a scene is not the same as a 24/7 D/s dealio. Even the dealio gets negotiated! There's kink ethics!

That isn't to say there are no people in the kink community that wear false colors.

Just like in the poly community that are some who wear false colors -- more like "poly" (air quotes!) fuckery than polamory.

Honest folk whatever the flavor -- kink, poly, hard or soft swing -- I think all frown on false colors being flown.

But I suspect that's why a large portion of poly are also into kink sprinkles -- there's a lot of negotiate-y going on in both worlds and the skillsets can easily transfer.

Me? I'm closed at this time with DH. Just not UP for a poly tribe raising kids. Does that make me horrible? No. Just not my scene. I rather close at this parent stage.

Quote:
Your crush certainly reinforces the whole "poly must be kinky too" paradigm. What if I'm just wired to want multiple people in my life, no whips or chains attached? /perturbed
What? Non-kink polys somehow not cool? Of course not. Totally cool! Kink and poly are items on the sexual buffet. They don't have to come as a set! And all people have to find their sexual identity, then sexual preferences, and well... sort themselves out.

I do think people just need to speak up more about their current needs. And check in because - hey! We human! Needs change, evolve, we age.

Disappointing when crushes don't fly and line up but so it goes. Can't force a thing, right?

GalaGirl

Last edited by GalaGirl; 06-26-2012 at 05:03 AM.
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  #19  
Old 06-26-2012, 08:57 PM
AnotherConfused AnotherConfused is offline
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I'm also seeing a distinction between trying out poly by engaging in more than one relationship, and trying out poly by being in a relationship with only one person, who is poly. So if you have someone who has always been in monogamous relationships, they might be single and wondering whether to get involved with someone who's poly (while still being monogamous), or they might be in a relationship already and wondering whether to try adding on a second relationship. Whether an experienced poly person is open to getting involved with someone trying it out for the first time might have a lot to do with which kind of situation it is.
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  #20  
Old 06-29-2012, 12:21 PM
JaneQSmythe JaneQSmythe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nycindie View Post
I find this such a strange statement. I don't quite understand it. What do you mean by "vanilla and still poly?" Still? Like how is that possible? As if one automatically correlates with the other? It doesn't for me. To me, the practice of kinky or non-kinky sexual activities is completely separate from the practice of structuring one's relationships to be polyamorous, monogamous, etc. Sure, people can take part in both, and have them entwined in their lives, but I object to the idea that poly itself is a kink, which some kinksters seem to be saying sometimes. That always bugs me.
I'm loving that this came up in the discussion here! Dude teases me all the time that I am "kinky" when I consider myself as about "vanilla" as they come - to the point where there is some stuff that a lot of people consider "regular" that I am not into/ turns me off.

I like to sleep with men and with women - that doesn't make me kinky that makes me bisexual. I like to be in relationships with more than one person - that doesn't make me kinky, that makes me poly. I like the occasional threesome and I don't think that even THAT makes me particularly kinky - to me I am just having regular vanilla sex with two people at the same time! (If doing the same sex act with one person is NOT kinky, why is doing that same sex act with two people suddenly now kinky?)

So people draw that "kink" line various places depending on their own experiences and comfort levels. Now the standing joke in the house is "THAT'S not kinky, because I'd do THAT."

("Plain")JaneQ("Vanilla")Smythe
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