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  #21  
Old 05-03-2012, 06:08 AM
AnotherConfused AnotherConfused is offline
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I'm reminded of a cute little story about a newlywed couple. The man tells his new bride, "I expect dinner on the table at 6pm every night, whether I'm home or not, " and she says, "I expect sex in our bedroom at 10pm every night, whether you're home or not."

At this point I would be awfully tempted just to say, "Listen, if you're not going to give me what I need, someone else can!" (I don't think this is necessarily a wise course of action -certainly counseling is a better first step -but really, you deserve to get what you need!)
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  #22  
Old 05-03-2012, 06:57 AM
dragonflysky dragonflysky is offline
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Unhappy

Outside of the whole poly issue, your relationship with Y has many of the dynamics my relationship with my first husband had. And I blamed myself....and talked...and talked...and begged...and pleaded for him to go to counseling with me after it all had gone on for a long time. I acknowledged to him that I was the one who had changed in our relationship as I was coming to finally value and acknowledge my emotional needs but that I was no longer willing to settle for the relatively logical, rational, intellectually compatible relationship/marriage that we had.

What it ultimately came down to was that he had problems with true emotional intimacy/connectivity. Obviously I did, too, when we first met and eventually married. I had a very angry, emotionally abusive father, so when I met my first husband his calm, rational approach to everything seemed so "loving" or at least emotionally "safe". It wasn't until I went into individual therapy that I started to acknowledge and treasure my emotions. Prior to this I often felt I must be "too emotionally needy" and would periodically back off from expressing my wants/needs to my husband out of guilt. My husband had a severe emotional wounding as a child related to a birth defect that led peers to teasing him alot. At some point rather than go into a rage, he shut down most of the "feelings" part of his personality. He ultimately refused to go to counseling with me.

Along the way I met a guy through a business relationship who was emotionally expressive, complementary towards me, etc. I didn't consciously go looking for it...but we ended up having an affair. It solved NOTHING. Only made my life more complicated and miserable. My husband found out. I didn't deny it. THEN he wanted to go to counseling. We did, but he still NEVER changed in terms of becoming more emotionally vulnerable, open and sharing. We had two children and I felt guilty that I would even consider divorce because he really was a "good" man and father, and how could I be "selfish" and "wreck everyone else's life" because of my "neediness"??!! I subsequently starting "shutting down", developed chronic fatigue syndrome, and became very depressed, with suicidal thoughts/intent, ending up in me choosing to hospitalize myself before I acted on my plans to kill myself with the handgun I had bought.

After this I developed the courage to divorce him because my very survival depended on it. "Right" or "Wrong", "Good" or "Bad" I was who I was and needed and deserved to have my emotional needs met. It was one of the hardest things I've ever done because I hated hurting my husband and our children. But I could no longer afford to hurt myself or I would be there for NO one.

Sounds to me that Y may have some problems with true intimacy...deep from the heart connectivity. He obviously doesn't lack sexual desire because he certainly directs it multiple times per week towards his porn habit. Sexual release with no need to connect emotionally.

I can only speak from my experience....but I strongly support you on your journey of giving yourself permission to have your feelings, wants, needs honored and met by your husband. If he can't do it, then yes....he may end up hurt if you decide to divorce him. But, you have given him many opportunities to make other choices, and he hasn't. This has hurt you. (I do think the book on Love Languages can be helpful, but I'm not hearing that Y is very committed to learning to meet your wants/needs on anything other than his terms and definition of such.) Please take good care of yourself through this process whatever your choices and decisions. (And having an affair with E or anyone is only a temporary "fix" which creates more pain in the long run....She says from experience! )

Last edited by dragonflysky; 05-03-2012 at 06:59 AM.
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  #23  
Old 05-07-2012, 03:18 AM
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PhilosophicallyLost PhilosophicallyLost is offline
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Had a talk with hubby. Didn't cover every little aspect, but the focus was primarily on improving sexual and emotional connectivity. Y heavily suspects something is up with me regarding E, but he chose not to push it, and I guess I chose not to bring it up. I wonder if that was right or not, but I'm still trying to determine what place E should have in my life.

Y's agreed to read the Love Languages book with me, and also was much more open to marriage counseling than I expected. He's also tried very hard since that talk to be receptive in his own way. Not necessarily in every way I need, but it is a positive step. We are also taking steps to try to spend more time together away from home where the distractions like TV and video games happen. We're hoping this will make us feel less like strangers.

Y is definitely making huge strides to communicate with me, so at least he is trying very hard, and the best he knows how.

It's been so good to see your guys' stories. I've seen reasons for hope as well as caution about my situation. Dragonflysky, thank you for your story....time will tell how much Y can meet my needs, but I feel he at least deserves more of a shot. And I'm not ready to let him go yet. Staring around this place imagining what it would be like to move out if we divorced was by far one of the most lonely thoughts I've had in a while.

Still....if it turns out that he can't fulfill those needs, then I will need the strength to tell him so. Or if I decide I need to be more open sexually and emotionally, then I will have to find the strength to tell him that...whichever comes first.

I thank you all for your support so far. I definitely hope to roam the community a bit more, as this seems like a pretty great place.
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  #24  
Old 05-11-2012, 12:48 AM
veronique veronique is offline
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Default doctor workup?

Your husband sounds like he could have a chemical imbalance affecting his libido. My boyfriend had a huge drop in libido about five months after we started dating. It was horrible. I cried, I begged. I got rejected for sex over and over and over. I finally put my foot down and demanded he go to the doctor. It turned out that one of his vitamins and testosterone are both so low they're almost non-existent. Within a month of starting a vit regimen (prescription), his libido was back to normal. We never did the testosterone (dr suggested skipping it if vit therapy helped).

So, please consider getting your husband tested for anything that might hamper his libido - there might be some medicine that would restore your sex life!
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  #25  
Old 05-11-2012, 03:31 AM
JaneQSmythe JaneQSmythe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veronique View Post
It turned out that one of his vitamins and testosterone are both so low they're almost non-existent. Within a month of starting a vit regimen (prescription), his libido was back to normal. We never did the testosterone (dr suggested skipping it if vit therapy helped).
If you don't mind my asking, which vitamins did the doc test for?
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  #26  
Old 05-11-2012, 05:10 PM
veronique veronique is offline
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I'm not sure what all they tested for. His deficiency is vitamin D. But I think maybe there are multiple kinds of D? His is a prescription, and I don't think it's the same kind you buy over the counter(ie, a dr definitely needs to be involved). I would stress that I've known people with low libidos who are keenly aware of their lack of interest; my bf was NOT like that. Until his vit level got boosted, he rather happily (well, except for my complaints) had no interest in sex.
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  #27  
Old 05-13-2012, 02:23 PM
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PhilosophicallyLost PhilosophicallyLost is offline
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Wow....so much has happened now. Where to start....?

Two nights ago I pretty much told Y a decent summary of everything I told you guys. I initially was trying to separate because I was going bonkers and had convinced myself that Y probably would not let me be with E. My close-mindedness to bringing up the topic is partly my fault, but I have been emotionally absolutely sapped and I made a decision for the sake of feeling like I was finally doing something for myself.

A few days ago I told E I had feelings for him. I couldn't contain it anymore. He told me that while he sometimes wished things were different and that he and I could be together, he loved his friendship with both Y and myself and he sincerely wanted Y and I to work out. We talked for hours, because he was trying to reassure me that he cared about me no matter what and I was very upset. I briefly mentioned to him that I wish I could have both of them. He told me he really was very attracted to me but his own morals were very important to him and he did not want to start anything. He wasn't sure how he felt about the polyamory option, though it seemed like something in him wished Y could let me be with him too. I start losing sleep like crazy and feeling unable to eat much.

At this point, Y can see something is up with me because I'm distant and emotionally a wreck. I finally opened up to him then about everything. First how emotionally starved I've been, then when it was clear in my mind that him simply working on our marriage is not enough to make me happy, I told him that I want to be able to share my body with others. He figured out pretty quickly I wanted to be with E, and I finally admitted it.

First off, Y feels he let me down. He told me how I've been such a good wife, and he now realizes he really dropped the ball and will do everything he can to make it up to me.

Second, he is open to letting me be with E, because Y knows I've always been a bit more on the open-minded side sensually and he wants me to be happy. We talk a long time about how this may work. Y feels scared about things, like what if E moves away and I chose to be with E and not Y, what happens if I get pregnant with E's kid, etc. I'm sure you guys can imagine the variety of things we discussed. We end up broaching the subject to E yesterday, and he seems open to it too. We had a very honest conversation, which is great. So everything should be a super awesome happy ending, right?

Well, we are definitely encountering a great deal of awkwardness for all three parties. Which I guess is to be expected. I want this to work so badly I'm freaking out a little bit about one of them wanting to back out.

Y warned me up front that he feels that he wants to be very restrictive on this arrangement and feels a bit possessive. E has told me he just feels "weird" with this, even though he definitely is excited about the prospects of being with me. While we agreed not to have me act physically with E until we get some boundaries set, E hovered around me quite a bit yesterday which made Y very uncomfortable. I have been trying desperately to show Y I love him and that I'm very happy for this new step in our lives, but last night he seemed to already be showing doubts about how this will work in the long run. At times we seemed natural about it, the three of us, but there were a lot of awkward moments too. I feel very self-conscious about how we should act because I don't want to upset either one of them. E seems to be pretty okay with me still hugging and kissing Y because that's been the norm, but Y is still feeling very threatened. Y even said that if he was home, he'd rather I choose to have sex with him instead of E. I tried to explain that I should be able to fulfill both their needs and that we should be able to compromise on that, because let's face it, Y is home while E is five days of the week. Which gives me a little window for time with E. Logically Y seems to understand this could be very unfair to E somehow, but his emotions seem to be hard for him in this.

More than anything I think boundaries desperately need to be established, but it's freaking me out that Y and/or E may back out before we get the chance to really give this a good shot. Do you guys have relevant experience on how to get past these first few issues? Should I pester Y (and maybe E?) into come onto this forum and this topic and getting your guys' advice? I feel like I really want Y to have some more information about the benefits of polyamory and see other couples who are making it work in their lives. I keep telling him I want this to work so badly....which I do. If both Y and E could grow into this position, I think I'd be the happiest woman alive.
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  #28  
Old 05-13-2012, 06:41 PM
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NovemberRain NovemberRain is offline
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Reading your last post reminds me so much of me when I started this with my two men last December. My situation is fairly different, I don't live with either of them, but I had really worked myself up about the prospect of having both of them.

Now that I have the benefit of time, I can see that I was crazed and didn't need to be. Not everything has to be settled, or known, or worked out right this minute. I know it feels that way; I know you feel like you'll shatter if you have to spend one more uncertain moment.

Mostly, my men were not crazed in the least, and didn't feel the need to be nuts about it like I did. Because they move glacially, all I could do was sit and be nutted up. And I found this place, which is awesome for helping me process.

I encourage you to find a deep, knowing, certain place inside yourself, for what YOU want. I'm hearing that you do know what you want, and I'm hearing your fears that they might not want what you want. If they decide that they don't, it doesn't mean anything about what you want ~ you have to know they are free to choose for themselves. As are you. I didn't really know this was what I wanted, I didn't admit it to myself. But I'd been behaving in a consistent and loving way towards what I wanted for at least five years.

I know it feels like it's all right now. Remember to breathe, and to feed yourself, and try to say really really nice things to yourself.
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