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  #11  
Old 11-23-2009, 04:55 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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LR,

Thanks for sharing all that !
See you've stimulated some insightful comments illustrating the different "takes" people may have.
I especially agree that these quandrys bring to light the reason that a lot of Vs and triads fail (maybe "dissolve" might be a better term?). Unfortunately I think it also contributes to negative images many have of a poly lifestyle. Most just call it "drama" ! Who needs it !
Bust just as important, I think it illustrates why some bright, thoughtful person initially coined the phrases "primary" and "secondary" as parts of the lifestyle.
I would think it would be true that most poly relationships started out - at least in some form - as a binary relationship. In most cases this "couple" (married or not - gay or bi or straight etc or not) made a decision to open that binary up.
Is there any other term - or role - for this new entry other than "secondary"? Would many of the binaries (assuming a tight bond) risk destroying that by the entry of the other ? I don't know. But I suspect not.
The quest for "equality" - while being a beautiful and lofty ideal - would seem to require extensive effort & time in MOST cases. Life is short.
In our experience, especially if the "reality" is laid on the table and discussed openly & honestly from day 1, the new "secondary" understands that despite theoretical dreams for any of us, the present is what it is and the future is yet to be determined. We've found easy acceptance of this and actually feel it helps the bonds grow. Maybe it lessens pressures on everyone because everyone understands what his/her role/place is and understands that ALL of that is subject to change & growth.
So in your particular situation (hope I have the order right here?) how do you think GG sees his "role" - where is his comfort zone - if you and Maca were in a position to have make a call on adding to the family in some way ?
Would he be hurt if you two - as the "primaries" felt you needed to make that call ?
Obviously I don't know GG at all, but if I had to guess - although there might be some "hurt" at first - it would be tempered by understanding of the roles you all play in each others life ? That "hurt" wouldn't be from you and Maca really - so much as it would be from the reality of life - that despite our loftiest dreams - things are seldom perfect and aligned with our deepest desires.
Again - hope I didn't get the roles reversed here - don't have the original within reach here to verify.
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  #12  
Old 11-23-2009, 08:16 PM
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I really shouldbe working right now.But LR put all this time and effort into starting this post, Its only fair that I read it and then I felt a need to respond...

I respect LR's and GG relationship and In all areas Im willing to consider BOTH of there opinions first and formost. That being said Im still the head of MY household and as such if I feel that there is a need I will address that need and make it a reality.Im not any more important then ither of the two of them and I believe that WE ALL will do the right thing when it comes down to it.I have to trust both of them.

There have been times when each of us has turned a blind eye to reality and refused to accept what was nessecary.When those times arise again( and Im sure they will) . We will guide each other with open and honest communication. Feelings may get hurt but the Love wont die.

Ok have to try to get some work done now
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  #13  
Old 11-24-2009, 12:34 AM
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Quote:
so, this propostioning that is going on, are they tangible people to have in your lives or are the questions and statements raised about preparing for the future of your "V?"
I'm not sure what you mean by tangible. The proposition to me-absolutely NOT happening. I don't feel that this is the time to even CONSIDER adding anyone new to the dynamic-at least on my end. I won't even CONSIDER any propositions for ANYTHING more than STRICTLY friendship from ANYONE as I've made clear to EVERYONE except Mono (j/k). Seriously though- I just think that would be f'd up.

I feel that we've changed a MAJOR dynamic in our lives by transitioning the relationship and don't feel that bringing in another person would honor the significance of that change or the importance of the time needed to process, institute and "perfect" (for lack of a better word) that change requires.


As for Maca. Honestly-I don't know. If you want more details-pm me.

Quote:
Mono's situation is indeed different. I have wanted more of what you have LR in terms of approach and living situation, but it's not the right time and I am in no rush to push anything. There is still TONS to work on. The whole dynamic is in no way settled for us. I know it seems like it on here, but it isn't in real life. You are all coming from a far better position to create complete equality.
Believe me-I know all about the major difference between reality and the small piece of a picture one can see online. I completely understand what you are saying RP. I hope we are coming from a better position period-equality-inequality. There's a lot going on and to be perfectly frank I really think TOO MUCH is going on.

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I wonder however if Maca is in fact completely ready to be okay with GG's role being more important? He says he is, but although you have known each other for years, your "outness" about your relationship with him (after cheating with him for so long) is still fresh and could possibly still sting greatly if Maca and he were to disagree with each other.
Frankly-I don't think he is. Fortunately on that note-Greengecko-like Mono-isn't either. He's very conscious of some of the changes. Some things already WERE more equal-like the kids. But some of the other stuff-no way. As I said before on another thread, I spend EVERY night with Maca-never with GG and that includes being alone Friday-not with GG. There are certainly things that aren't equal in REALITY at this point. But for ME I'm seeing the importance and need for that in order to "live with myself" in terms of ANY "third" not just GG. I feel much the same about my sister who isn't sexually involved in anyway.

One of the "potential" people has a spouse that makes my sister uncomfortable. My sister lives here. This may be Maca's house-but it's her HOME and she has a right to be safe, secure and comfortable in her own home. That puts a big huge red flag/deterrant for that "potential" person because her spouse would be less free to socialize here due to the impact on my sister.

Likewise-I don't think any of the four of us should be "dating" or "seeing" anyone who can't accept everyone in our home on friendly terms or who isn't "kid friendly" since our home is ALWAYS full of kids and THEY need to be the top priority-not our freaking sex drives.

Quote:
I guess you'll see

good luck, and slow down girl! It's 1 here and I've spent the whole night catching up with you!
I type fast. I was really only online for a short time, then I logged off and went on with my evening. But I had a lot of thoughts in my head. Actually-MANY more than I started threads on-but wasn't sure about sharing them all in such an open community.
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  #14  
Old 11-24-2009, 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GroundedSpirit View Post
LR,
Bust just as important, I think it illustrates why some bright, thoughtful person initially coined the phrases "primary" and "secondary" as parts of the lifestyle.
I would think it would be true that most poly relationships started out - at least in some form - as a binary relationship. In most cases this "couple" (married or not - gay or bi or straight etc or not) made a decision to open that binary up.
Is there any other term - or role - for this new entry other than "secondary"? Would many of the binaries (assuming a tight bond) risk destroying that by the entry of the other ? I don't know. But I suspect not.
The quest for "equality" - while being a beautiful and lofty ideal - would seem to require extensive effort & time in MOST cases. Life is short.
In our experience, especially if the "reality" is laid on the table and discussed openly & honestly from day 1, the new "secondary" understands that despite theoretical dreams for any of us, the present is what it is and the future is yet to be determined. We've found easy acceptance of this and actually feel it helps the bonds grow. Maybe it lessens pressures on everyone because everyone understands what his/her role/place is and understands that ALL of that is subject to change & growth.
So in your particular situation (hope I have the order right here?) how do you think GG sees his "role" - where is his comfort zone - if you and Maca were in a position to have make a call on adding to the family in some way ?
Would he be hurt if you two - as the "primaries" felt you needed to make that call ?
Obviously I don't know GG at all, but if I had to guess - although there might be some "hurt" at first - it would be tempered by understanding of the roles you all play in each others life ? That "hurt" wouldn't be from you and Maca really - so much as it would be from the reality of life - that despite our loftiest dreams - things are seldom perfect and aligned with our deepest desires.
Again - hope I didn't get the roles reversed here - don't have the original within reach here to verify.
GG would tolerate any choice if he felt it was a choice I needed. It's really that simple to him. BUT that doesn't delete his feelings-he has them. He's been hurt before. It really really depends on the type of choice in question. Deleting him from the picture-not going to happen. Maca and I have had that conversation many times (feel free to go to my first posts or his for details on how this "mess" of ours evolved) and I'm simply not giving up my friends for a man-even the man I married.
A question of another lover? I would never take another lover without both Maca and GG being agreeable-no matter what Maca wanted. I won't do it.
A question of moving/job changes etc, we've been making those decisions as a "family" for years already....


So I guess really to answer your question more fully I would need more details.
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Old 11-24-2009, 05:32 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
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Thanks LR,
I think that clarified your particular relationship perfectly and it's beautiful that it's evolved to that stage for all of you. Awesome !
And doesn't it kind of point out something else important that we maybe don't talk much about ?
Let's call it "fullness"
I think there may come a point in everyone's life that we become "full". All our physical & emotional needs really seem to be met, our time seems to be all spoken for, and we tend put away the "looking glass". We're happy, content. I think this is just as true for conventional mono relationships as poly.
At this point, "more" could actually prove a complication & burden we just don't need. And at that point the rules seem to change.
I think it's a good place to "be" - maybe even what everyone longs for. And maybe you are there. For now
Wouldn't it be wonderful if everyone was ? And I guess that is the quest - and acknowledgment - of poly lifestyles. That it's maybe not realistic for many of us to get to that point with a single individual without infringing on THEIR individuality and needs.

Enjoy..........
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  #16  
Old 11-25-2009, 04:52 AM
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yes GS-
fullness well describes how I feel. I hope and pray that both Maca and GG can find that feeling too!

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Old 11-25-2009, 03:45 PM
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Fullness, totally get the fullness.... I am full like I've had a big meal. I find it interesting that I am more "fit" than I ever have been in my whole life, yet feel so full. Might I suggest that I have replaced the need to be physically full with the need to be emotionally full. Perhaps I was replacing food for love of others and myself?

My co-worker told me the other day that she thinks I now have an eating disorder because I chose to feel hungry sometimes (she is a woman that enjoys her food). She was angry that I have made huge changes and shifts in my relationship to food in the last two years and thinks I have a problem. I find it interesting that we both would eat together and both talked about our feelings of not being complete back then. Now I don't have that feeling and I assume she still does as her life hasn't changed as drastically as mine has.

I told her that I disagreed and that I am happy, and don't have a need to make myself happy with food anymore. Just a thought ...

Sorry, ...I have gone off on so many tangents this morning!!!! you'll all just have to put up with me.... I feel chatty and not into talking so much about poly. Perhaps it will all relate at some point.
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  #18  
Old 11-25-2009, 07:10 PM
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Fullness, totally get the fullness.... I am full like I've had a big meal. I find it interesting that I am more "fit" than I ever have been in my whole life, yet feel so full. Might I suggest that I have replaced the need to be physically full with the need to be emotionally full. Perhaps I was replacing food for love of others and myself?

My co-worker told me the other day that she thinks I now have an eating disorder because I chose to feel hungry sometimes (she is a woman that enjoys her food). She was angry that I have made huge changes and shifts in my relationship to food in the last two years and thinks I have a problem. I find it interesting that we both would eat together and both talked about our feelings of not being complete back then. Now I don't have that feeling and I assume she still does as her life hasn't changed as drastically as mine has.

I told her that I disagreed and that I am happy, and don't have a need to make myself happy with food anymore. Just a thought ...

Sorry, ...I have gone off on so many tangents this morning!!!! you'll all just have to put up with me.... I feel chatty and not into talking so much about poly. Perhaps it will all relate at some point.
How can you say that doesn't relate to poly my friend! I was sitting here open mouthed telling GG "OMG I think RP and I might be clones with different body types!"
I've noticed just in the last month that my relationship with food is SO completely different and it freaks me out sometimes-but at the same time, I was 216 lbs at my highest-and heartbroken (when I was younger, prior to marriage I was always in EXCELLENT physical shape) and with a LOT of hard work I got to 180. But that was where I got stuck and there was no doubt it was because I wasn't getting my emotional needs met-so I kept "stuffing food in" to fill that emptiness. Now that so many more of my emotional needs are being met, I don't feel like eating so much. I actually eat an almost exactly perfect diet-without thinking about it at all! I've dropped to 166.

Meeting our emotional needs is a HUGE problem today-at least in the US. AND weight problems are a HUGE HUGE issue today-at least in the US. I think that this MUST relate to how we function in relationships-and I poly is certainly a type of relationship!.

We should make a thread on this!
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  #19  
Old 11-25-2009, 07:32 PM
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A thread indeed. I will work on one. Or you can, which ever. I have a super busy next couple of days and won't get to it soon.

Hosting our monthly poly meeting tomorrow night, wish me luck!
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Old 11-26-2009, 12:49 AM
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A thread indeed. I will work on one. Or you can, which ever. I have a super busy next couple of days and won't get to it soon.

Hosting our monthly poly meeting tomorrow night, wish me luck!
Good luck! Let us know how it goes. We don't have anything like that around here. Maybe eventually. Who knows.

I started the thread-check it out when you have time.
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