Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > Life stories and blogs

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #371  
Old 01-30-2012, 03:25 AM
Arrowbound's Avatar
Arrowbound Arrowbound is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tri-State
Posts: 272
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carma View Post
Sundance has no interest in growing up. He has no interest in (or capablility of) being honest. He won't try anything wholeheartedly. He'd rather throw our marriage away than try. And here I thought it was all because of my love for Butch! NO -- he was willing to accept that! What he can't accept is that I want a one-on-one relationship with a mature adult. He would rather give up, than become a mature adult!

I am grieving this. I am having a hard time that while all the time I blamed myself for the problems in the marriage (the ONLY problem was my love for Butch) the problem really is something out of my power to do anything about. All those self-help books I read!!!!! If I could just fix ME, my marriage could be happy.......

I only did my own inventory. I never did an inventory of the relationship. It takes two to make a thing go right......

I am so sad that Sundance will not stand up and be a partner to me. I am so sad he won't/can't. I am so sad he would rather try to lie and bluff and cheat, than just do the work to BE that man. But he has proven, time and time again, that he is not interested in that, at all. I have to do what's best for me. Sadly, it will not be so great on our kids. But anything is better than the warfare that is going on in our home. And the tension, and the mixed messages, when we actually do get along. What a mess. It has to stop!
These particulars are important, for your sanity and for any calm you can get out of the situation.

It's apparent that wanting Sundance to tell the truth, even if you beg for it, hasn't worked, isn't working, and more than likely won't happen. That's something I personally would let go of mentally. He's unwilling. If you can't reason with him, then don't. Just stop. It sounds like it is literally wearing you down.

And remind yourself that your mental health, and that of your children, are priority right now.
Reply With Quote
  #372  
Old 01-30-2012, 12:42 PM
Magdlyn's Avatar
Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Metro West Massachusetts
Posts: 3,472
Default

Congrats on being 7 months sober, Carma.

I can't believe Sundance is 60. Sigh... some boys never grow up.

Keep working on disengaging from his bullshit. Stop wondering what his gf sees in him and vice versa. It's their business.

Move on and be good to yourself!
__________________
Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

me: Mags, 58, living with:
miss pixi, 37, who is dating (NRE):
Master, 32
my bf: Ginger, 61, married to:
Robin, 60 (mono)
and dating (NRE): Carla and David, married couple, early 40s
Reply With Quote
  #373  
Old 01-30-2012, 01:24 PM
Carma's Avatar
Carma Carma is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 477
Default

Thanks, Arrow. (And Phy ). It helps to have someone to share this stuff with. I have talked with many people about what is happening, but no one understands the poly dimension of it all. They think he is a cheater, plain and simple. Well, that's what he has become, with all the lying and sneaking, and me begging him to break it off with her to give our marriage a chance. But many can't understand that I feel I "brought this all on myself" by encouraging him, so I could carry on with Butch. I just couldn't figure out what to do with those feelings I had for Butch. I suppose I should have (Ew, I hate woulda, coulda, shoulda) turned that back on the marriage and said, "What is it I am seeking elsewhere that is missing in my relationship with my husband?"

It took this journey of pain and betrayal to figure it out. What was missing was something I could never make right. My husband is immature. And I don't want to be his mother. Ironically, sometimes he convinced me that I was helpless, and needed him to be MY parent! It kept me from growing, too.

Last night, I told our 12-year old that he should sleep in his own bed. Sundance has been in the habit of having the boys take turns sleeping with dad. I think they are getting well old enough to learn some independence, to sleep on their own. They are 10 and 12! Well, Sun totally did and override to our son. He went right into his room and said, "You can sleep with Dad if you want to." If it is our SON pushing it, it's one thing. But it's my husband! It feels like he is using our son as a little teddy bear. Our son was FINE with it. Or, you know, he's a kid, he might have a little bit of an adjustment, but he does adjust. One night, the two boys each wanted to snuggle with me at night. They started fighting over it, and the older one was pushing his brother, "Go sleep with Dad, or I'm going to have to! I feel SORRY for him!" Do you see where I'm coming from with this? Kids need parents. Parents don't "need" kids!

Well, anyway, it kicked off a spat, which the boys picked up on, and I ended up just letting him sleep with his dad, afterall. I know when he is in there, his dad talks weird confusing things, like, "I don't know why we're fighting, I guess your mom just doesn't like me" and "I don't WANT a divorce either...." (insinuating "It's your MOM who wants this, not me").

The other thing was, when I came into the room at first, Sun was on his laptop. He looks at porn every day (I used to have to clear the history on our PC DAILY so the kids wouldn't see it -- once I called him out for possibly having a problem with this, he stopped using the PC. So naturally I suspect he is in his room, on the laptop, looking at the same sites he has for years. What would make me think otherwise??? He has "changed?") I don't want my son in there when he is looking at that stuff.

About a month ago, the 12-year old, "A" and I had a conversation:

A- "Mom, my friend looks at 'bad things' on the computer."
M- "Oh yeah? What kinds of 'bad things'?"
A- "Well..... like...."
M- "What -- like naked pictures or something?"
A- "Yeah. It's called porn, Mom. It's disgusting."
M- "Oh. Well, A, at some point it is natural to be curious about what girls' bodies look like. That's not disgusting. But porn makes women's bodies look like objects. Women have a lot more to them than just their bodies. It's not good to look at that stuff too much."
A- "Well, Dad looks at it. He looks all the time."
M- "Yeah, A. Well, I think guys should focus on girls' minds and feelings, than just their body parts. But when you get a little older, you will have some curiosity. I hope you will remember that girls have feelings, too."

I know that there are a lot of ideas on this forum about porn. I'm not a prude. But this is a little boy! He has not hit puberty yet. He deserved his innocence. BOTH of my sons have found porn in their dad's closet, since they were toddlers. DVD's and the cases with pictures on them, and magazines. They have always known where penises fit and what they "do", let me put it that way! There was no mystery about the birds and the bees, except that maybe babies actually come from that, and it is supposed to be an expression of love between a man and a woman..... yeah, RIGHT.

Anyway.......

This morning Sun looked at me all forlorn and sad and dejected and SINCERE, and said, "I'm sorry for all the pain...." I said, "We'll talk after the kids leave for school" but he said, "No, I'm leaving now."

His apologies are so vague, and we don't talk, ever. When we do, the kids are here, and it turns into a fight, or there is tension. Or occasionally, we get to a place where we're getting along, but that's not right for the kids either. It gives them false hope. It gives US false hope! We can't be "friends" til we're divorced. Period. I wish the kids could see that a divorce doesn't have to be a terrible thing. I am trying to reassure them, it will be ok, we'll get through it, etc. But Sun acting all gloomy about not wanting a divorce, either, puts both him and A in victim mode, and me as the perpetrator!!

Wow, I'm going on and on here, sorry! If anyone is reading, hey, I really appreciate it. REALLY.
__________________
Married to Sundance
Boyfriend -- Butch Cassidy
Reply With Quote
  #374  
Old 01-30-2012, 01:25 PM
Carma's Avatar
Carma Carma is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 477
Default

Thanks, Mag. You always cut right through all the crap.
__________________
Married to Sundance
Boyfriend -- Butch Cassidy
Reply With Quote
  #375  
Old 01-31-2012, 01:49 AM
Arrowbound's Avatar
Arrowbound Arrowbound is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Tri-State
Posts: 272
Default

Oh Carm, my son just turned 2 and I couldn't imagine having to extract him from me and his dad's bed 10 years from now!!! My jaw is literally to the floor. He likes having his own space so I'm glad about that. I'm happy you're putting your foot down. You don't wanna be struggling to get him into his own space by the time he's entering high school and all that.

Ignore Sun's half-assed whispered apologies. They're useful to no one but maybe his conscience.

You sound like a really open, honest parent. That's awesome.
Reply With Quote
  #376  
Old 01-31-2012, 01:28 PM
Magdlyn's Avatar
Magdlyn Magdlyn is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Metro West Massachusetts
Posts: 3,472
Default

I can't believe he watches porn on his laptop with his preteen sons in bed next to him. That borders on sexual abuse, imo.
__________________
Love withers under constraint; its very essence is liberty. It is compatible neither with envy, jealousy or fear. It is there most pure, perfect and unlimited when its votaries live in confidence, equality and unreserve. -- Shelley

me: Mags, 58, living with:
miss pixi, 37, who is dating (NRE):
Master, 32
my bf: Ginger, 61, married to:
Robin, 60 (mono)
and dating (NRE): Carla and David, married couple, early 40s
Reply With Quote
  #377  
Old 01-31-2012, 04:21 PM
Vinccenzo Vinccenzo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 284
Default

It doesn't sound like Sun is a person you can trust to be ethical in a divorce. He can't be ethical to you, his other partner, not even his children in everyday life. How do you think he will be when it comes to legally ending this mess and settling custody of the kids?
If any of what he says about his new partner is true, do you want her influencing your kids? Do you want to deal with establishing a new set of standards in your home only to have it made twice as hard because he has some warped way of parenting where they feel forced to sleep in his bed and overly aware that he is rubbing one out to porn right there near the bed he insists they sleep in?

I've read that you intend this relationship to end and I see nothing that should make that intention a bad one; quite the opposite. As a mother, I'd be compiling evidence to use because 1. he has threatened to do so himself 2. he already sounds mentally abusive to you AND the kids now and who knows what level that will ramp up to without you around. 3. He works away from home right? How is a shared custody situation going to work if he settles near his job? 4. How much do you want your children to be exposed to someone who carries a flask all day and drives drunk?

I really feel for you and your situation. But now is not the time to get overwhelmed with grief. Sure divorce will end the daily misery for you, the daily arguments the kids are witnessing, but the aftermath HAS to be in the kids' best interests and ask yourself honestly, do you think he can manage that during the divorce process?
Reply With Quote
  #378  
Old 01-31-2012, 04:59 PM
dingedheart dingedheart is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,257
Default

I think Vinnccenzo makes some great points the cure for you may have disastrous effects/affects on the kids. You might want to find a very stylish kevlar yoga outfit and gut some of this out while building a case....be methodical....all the time giving the boys time and space to grow up. Given that the hostility in the house gets dialed way back. 6 months or a yr with the right prep could make a huge difference. Consult a therapist and your lawyer on the this stuff.... he's in no hurry to divorce you... so use it to your advantage.
Reply With Quote
  #379  
Old 01-31-2012, 05:17 PM
Vinccenzo Vinccenzo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 284
Default

Thanks Dinged Heart, I've got some experience in this under my belt. And as the more ethical out of me and my ex, I hoped for the best but prepared for the worst. I can't stress enough how glad I am that I did. When my son's father did seem to clean up after it was all settled, I relaxed about visitations from what was court mandated. But when he went back to the same destructive patterns, I had the legal ability to keep my son from harm during that time. As well, because my ex is so petty when he is on a destructive spiral, I had it arranged so that all visitation travel is his responsibility. I knew that he would use it to jerk me around with scheduling and location arrangements if he had the ability.
If Sun ends up getting his head together afterwards, Carma can always conduct things ethically in light of it. But it would probably be best with so much at stake to not count on that or believe it will be a permanent change if he does. Seek at least a custody specific contingency plan that will work if he just gets worse or vengeful.
Reply With Quote
  #380  
Old 02-01-2012, 12:04 PM
Carma's Avatar
Carma Carma is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 477
Default

I don't expect him to be ethical at all in a divorce or in any situation! He already told me to expect Armegeddon! While that could be a bluff, another of his bullying techniques, judging from past behaviors I'd say it's going to be ugly. He is so immature. But he is so good at smoothing everything over and making me think he's the nice guy I used to believe he was! He was nice to me last night and I just get sucked right back in to thinking, "Wow, he really is reasonable!" Sure he is. WHEN HE IS GETTING HIS WAY.

I don't think prolonging this any longer is going to do any good. He's going to be an asshole regardless of what I do. At least I'll have peace under my own roof without him in it.

Would you believe one of his "threats" to me is that he printed this whole blog and gave it to his attorney?!?!
__________________
Married to Sundance
Boyfriend -- Butch Cassidy
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
dishonesty, negotiations

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:05 PM.