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Old 01-04-2012, 08:29 AM
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NovemberRain NovemberRain is offline
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Default my journey into radical self-love

hi y'all,



So, it looks like I've given myself a good case of the crazies. You people don't seem crazy to me; and pretty accepting. I think it might help to write this out. And it wouldn't hurt if it happens to get read.

I wrote an intro in that section. Re-cap:

I am female, barely into my fifties, bi, and til now, have been pretty much a serial monogamist. Though this forum has reminded me of long-forgotten dalliances with poly (and it wasn't the sex).

I met first boyfriend in 2003 [on st patrick's day, at a group dinner at a hof brau. I told him every awful irish joke I know. he traded numbers with two guys at that dinner and didn't seem the slightest interested in me. I had previously crushed on two men who turned out to be gay (and dated each other) so I was becoming convinced that my gaydar was broken]. I crushed on him, hard. We took up more seriously after I asked him to 'babysit' me the day my mom died. About two years (hmm, I kept thinking three ~ I don't tell time well) we were together.

He is an intensely private person, an extreme introvert, maybe slightly Asperger's and brilliant (seriously, I might know one person with a higher IQ and they're actually probably on the same level). He started wandering his attentions, and mostly lied by omission. He was wanting to move and not wanting to take me; and had in fact, stated that he never wanted to live with anyone again. Until his early thirties, he had never lived alone. I was pretty sure that wouldn't work for me. Oh, and he's 13 years younger than I.

Early in our relationship, he hired current boyfriend to work for him. Eventually they got to be good friends and he brought him home and we were often 'the three musketeers.' Current bf is 15.5 years my junior (I have issues about their ages from time to time)(!). When he heard first bf was planning to move he started thinking on being with me.

And he was. He was very charming, very funny, it was so lovely to have attention after first bf. Current bf and I are like glue ~ we can't be in the same room without touching each other somehow.
Six years later, I finally 'broke up' with current bf in March-ish, but he didn't move out til May-ish. It took him a long time to get all the way out. He only moved into the next building over.

I didn't break up 'clean.' It has been my practice to be in a complete no-contact for 40 days after a break-up. This has been most successful and I'm friends with almost all my ex-es with whom I have done this. I didn't do this completely. We saw each other a few times, and eventually had sex again. In October, we attended a friend's wedding. (got the invite and I realized we had forgotten to tell them we broke up) It was mushy and romantic (1930's style to it), and we had some deep emotional conversation. A rarity for us. Then we spent two nights at a bed & breakfast. It was a gift cert that hadn't been used, and he suggested it, and I had never done such a thing and very much wanted to so there ya go.

So, after some lovely sex, he says, 'am I your boyfriend again?' Which pissed me off, and I really didn't want a fight right at that moment, so I didn't address it then. But on the way home (stuck in the car) I did. I asked why, and mentioned that nothing had changed since the breakup. He muttered a small amount of nothing. We had no resolution, but have been behaving much like our former coupled selves.

During the time we were more apart, I did everything but attack first bf. He knew I was out, he knew I wanted him; nothing. (kinda like in the beginning) So a few weeks ago he came for a visit. In past, he's stayed at current bf's, because he got the long couch. This time, I had cleaned up my den/library/guest room to the point where an air mattress could go on the floor. He's pretty uncomfy on the couch. Current bf had to go to work, so he went home early. There was a lot of liquor (all around, but most of it into first bf). He turned it loose, and said a lot that he might not have if it weren't for the liquor. I feel like I can't write more without revealing too much without his permission. One thing we did talk about was first bf's love for current bf, and how much it upsets him that current bf sabotages himself (more below).

Anyhow, I did tell him that current bf and I had discussed on many occasions the possibility of me 'snogging on' first bf.

After weekend, I was fairly freaked out, and totally full of NRE (or something). I made arrangements to talk to local friends who are poly. Never discussed with them, but they'd been to dinner, and talked a small amount about poly on fb. So, I was pretty sure they could help. She got sick that night, but he came up and was totally awesome. Kinda thrilled to hear my story and to know a live, thinking, good-hearted person also into poly. He encouraged me to be myself and that was exactly the right thing; and it did give me courage.

Had good conversation with current bf, and felt like I had real 'permission' (for lack of better vocabulary just now), rather than theoretical. Said, 'could you call first bf and tell him that? because he's not gonna believe me' Said he would, but they are the kind of guys that talk when they get around to it.


So, here I am a week or two after that convo. The holidays were so sweet, I love current bf's family and spent a lot of time there. I applied all that NRE to him, and was so happy to love him more for the freedom to continue loving first bf.

Yah. then there's the crap. Current bf is an alcoholic. [I've pretty much figured out that if I'm attracted to someone, they're an alcoholic. knowing this does not help me in the least.] Also a fairly non-stop gamer. Both those things are higher on his priority/motivation list than I am. I have known both of these things since before I moved in with him. I believe people vote with their feet, and when his feet have a choice, it seems to me that it's never in my direction. If I'm around, great. If I invite myself in, terrific. There's no pursuing, there's no seduction, there's no invitation, there's no evidence that my pleasure is necessary, or hell, even has an effect on, his own.

In addition, I am physically challenged. I have a ridiculous genetic condition that causes my joints to come unglued, at random. All my joints. Fortunately, not all the time. But, my muscles have to work harder to hold the joints (it's my ligaments mostly that are defective) so I have chronic pain also. I've had this forever (it's genetic) but I've had the pain since about 28 years of age. I've kinda learned how to manage it.

Current bf doesn't understand it (don't really blame him for that), doesn't really want to (hate him for that), doesn't believe me (yes, I could walk around the city for some hours, but it cost me tons of pain and energy and lots of meds the days after)(yes, sometimes sex hurts, but the endorphins, not to mention closeness, love, all that, are totally worth the small pains it costs), and he has said he would be embarrassed to go out with me if I were in an chair.

All of these are really awesome reasons not to be in relationship with him, I think. Reading here has made me think so even more.

New Year's I nutted myself up good and crazy. I'd been trying to get together with him all week prior. I was totally amped from Christmas. Alcohol got the date, and I didn't. Thursday, he was all there, but I had massage, and told him that I didn't just pay $100 to get put back together so he could fuck it apart. New Year's Eve we shared with a couple we know, was nice. He didn't want to stay because he didn't want to wake up with me with a hangover. Fine. Call me when you get up, we'll have breakfast or whatever. No call. Seriously. All day.
Monday morning, I got a voicemail from 6:30 previous evening. 'uh, you wanna do dinner or something?' Literally. I came unglued.

I started crying at one point and it occurred to me that my reaction could be detox (my diet was crap through the holidays, and I've been getting back on track over the weekend). Some friends have said, 'well, his behaviour was pretty bad.' ME: yah, but it's been bad for 6 years. this is ALL on me. He's been, actually, pretty damn consistent about who he is.

So, I rail at myself. I've been in and out of therapy since I was 8. I live in freaking California, I've done almost every weird therapy there is. And a whole bunch of mainstream as well. 12-step, hypnosis, rolfing, massage, rebirthing, EFT, yada-endless-fucking-BLAH. And here I am, doing *this* to myself.

So the only thing I can come up with is that I don't love myself enough to stop it. (and many thanks to nycindie, magdlyn, redpepper, and a BUNCH of others for helping with this) I have a great group on fb, I took it to them. They are the life-long sister-friends I have searched for all my life. Smart, wicked funny, no holds barred. One of them pointed me to a website with a list of 100 Ways To Start Loving Yourself RIght Now. It was actually quite encouraging.
She has a course, but at one point in my therapy, it became therapy to stop. I think I have to take it up again. I'm starting by engaging in radical self-love. Because it doesn't really matter what happens with my boyfriends if I don't love me first.

(and I'm not doing very well at putting myself to bed early, but I really needed to do this here)
thanks
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Love is that condition in which the happiness of another person is essential to your own...
Robert A. Heinlein

Me: female, bi, (formerly hinge of a vee)
with FirstBoyFriend (FBF)(moderately long-distance)
and no longer with CurrentBoyFriend (CBF)(who lives in the apartment building next door)
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  #2  
Old 01-04-2012, 05:25 PM
km34 km34 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NovemberRain View Post
Because it doesn't really matter what happens with my boyfriends if I don't love me first.
I love this. I should do this. I think it is great that you found a group that is going to support you.

The thing that stuck out to me the most about your boyfriends, though, is that you keep repeating that men you are physically attracted to tend to have some sort of deficiency (alcoholism, homosexuality - in itself not bad, but not really healthy for you to focus your love on, etc). Is the physical aspect (which is what immediately grabs your attention even if it isn't the entire basis) of that potential relationship really worth the emotional pain that you can pretty much be guaranteed is following? Wouldn't it be better to pursue someone that you may not feel as passionately towards in the beginning but who would make a great partner? Granted, if the passion doesn't follow suit it probably isn't good in the long term, but isn't it possible to work up to the point where you can't keep your hands of one another instead of going for that person who makes you feel like that immediately but is also going to be neglectful or inconsiderate? Just what went through my head. It may have no actual importance in your situation.

Once again, good luck. I think everyone should learn to depend on themselves first and their significant others/family/friends second. Something I am also working on.
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:00 AM
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NovemberRain NovemberRain is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by km34 View Post
The thing that stuck out to me the most about your boyfriends, though, is that you keep repeating that men you are physically attracted to tend to have some sort of deficiency (alcoholism, homosexuality - in itself not bad, but not really healthy for you to focus your love on, etc). Is the physical aspect (which is what immediately grabs your attention even if it isn't the entire basis) of that potential relationship really worth the emotional pain that you can pretty much be guaranteed is following? Wouldn't it be better to pursue someone that you may not feel as passionately towards in the beginning but who would make a great partner? Granted, if the passion doesn't follow suit it probably isn't good in the long term, but isn't it possible to work up to the point where you can't keep your hands of one another instead of going for that person who makes you feel like that immediately but is also going to be neglectful or inconsiderate? Just what went through my head. It may have no actual importance in your situation.
First, thanks for reading (I know it was long), thanks for liking the concept, and many thanks for the luck.

That's worth noting, and I do. Considering that most of my life has been long, serial monogamy, I have lived a lot and dated a lot. A LOT. I am totally surprised, continuously, at the range of people I find attractive.

I am so very not-butch. But I have tiny moments. I had a huge crush on a boss of mine, I didn't really want (ever) a deep meaningful relationship; but she inspired in me a lust that made want to throw her on a bed and pleasure her. I loved a very lovely man who was none of those things above, shorter than I, and shaven headed (which I had not been previously attracted to, but now makes me swoon), and very, very Jewish. Which turned out to be a lot of why we weren't long-term compatible (also a five year old). My first girlfriend was not an alcoholic, might have been a gamer had there been something more exciting than pong at the time, and is now a man. I went through a 'born-again virgin' phase, where I wasn't going to have sex quickly ~ met a lovely man (who I think remains pissed to this day that I didn't).

I could be a sex & love addict, I have identified as that in the past. I really do believe I could fall in love with, and have sex with, almost anyone. I have preferences, but I have seen them all go out the window. Current bf, I was not only not attracted to, but slightly repulsed by, when we first became friends. And we were friends for a very long time. It seemed like when my ovaries finally lit up, I had waited quite long enough. But, prolly not, especially in hindsight.

I definitely learn from all of it. Sometimes I forget that I have learned. And I have the pit of despair, which is, I think, what happened to me three days ago. Fortunately, I remember faster now, and get back to actually doing the loving things. And I have good people around me elsewhere, who remind me also. that I'm loved, that I'm good, that I deserve all good things.

I kinda hate the way I write (and this is what I want). I hope I'll get better.

In a more practical response (to km34s excellent question), when current bf moved out, I dragged my feet about getting an online profile etc. Finally did it, and had some initial attention, but now, not so much. I have a wild profile. I'm thinking maybe I should change it to a standard one and see if I get more not-so-wild people.
__________________
Love is that condition in which the happiness of another person is essential to your own...
Robert A. Heinlein

Me: female, bi, (formerly hinge of a vee)
with FirstBoyFriend (FBF)(moderately long-distance)
and no longer with CurrentBoyFriend (CBF)(who lives in the apartment building next door)
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:16 AM
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NovemberRain NovemberRain is offline
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Might be moot. Might be over before it even started. He has deleted his email and facebook accounts. Spoke to me last night when I called, but was clearly pickled and lying. He said can I call you back later (why, because I was interrupting something important on netflix?). There has been no call.
__________________
Love is that condition in which the happiness of another person is essential to your own...
Robert A. Heinlein

Me: female, bi, (formerly hinge of a vee)
with FirstBoyFriend (FBF)(moderately long-distance)
and no longer with CurrentBoyFriend (CBF)(who lives in the apartment building next door)
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:52 AM
InfinitePossibility InfinitePossibility is offline
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Not moot at all. Your first post is about self-love and you sure don't need any bfs at all for that!
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Old 01-05-2012, 07:01 AM
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NovemberRain NovemberRain is offline
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Originally Posted by InfinitePossibility View Post
Not moot at all. Your first post is about self-love and you sure don't need any bfs at all for that!
Very true

My act of radical self love today: (okay, it doesn't seem radical, but it was hard to do)
I deleted a ton of email notifications from fb that I'm NEVER going to catch up on. I want to, but it just ain't gonna happen! So instead of looking at them and feeling badly, I deleted 'em.!

GO ME!
__________________
Love is that condition in which the happiness of another person is essential to your own...
Robert A. Heinlein

Me: female, bi, (formerly hinge of a vee)
with FirstBoyFriend (FBF)(moderately long-distance)
and no longer with CurrentBoyFriend (CBF)(who lives in the apartment building next door)
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  #7  
Old 01-05-2012, 07:02 AM
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NovemberRain NovemberRain is offline
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Also, I still have a mini-vacay for me this weekend, and it includes time with first bf and family and therapy (in-person, when I usually do over the phone). I have Friday and Monday off work. I'm really excited about this.
__________________
Love is that condition in which the happiness of another person is essential to your own...
Robert A. Heinlein

Me: female, bi, (formerly hinge of a vee)
with FirstBoyFriend (FBF)(moderately long-distance)
and no longer with CurrentBoyFriend (CBF)(who lives in the apartment building next door)
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Old 01-05-2012, 07:07 AM
ThatGirlInGray ThatGirlInGray is offline
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I'm sorry things are not going the way you'd like with current bf, but yay for having a good long weekend planned!
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Old 01-05-2012, 07:09 AM
InfinitePossibility InfinitePossibility is offline
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Sounds good. I love a trip away for the weekend.
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Old 01-05-2012, 04:59 PM
km34 km34 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NovemberRain View Post
I deleted a ton of email notifications from fb that I'm NEVER going to catch up on. I want to, but it just ain't gonna happen! So instead of looking at them and feeling badly, I deleted 'em.!

GO ME!
I wish I could let my notifications pile up... I'm a bit of a FB addict. lol

I hope you enjoy your weekend!
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