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  #31  
Old 01-03-2012, 09:09 PM
km34 km34 is offline
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So... I feel like I was doing pretty well for a while and now all of the sudden I am back to square one feeling like it's not worth it. I was so excited for New Year's weekend and then pretty much nothing went as I thought it would.

NYE was pretty good while my family gathering was going on. Keith and Mario were in the basement playing board games (strategy games that no one else likes - lol) with a couple of other people who they regularly hang out with anyway. I was upstairs helping cook the bagna caulda (family tradition for NYE) and chatting with various cousins and aunts and such. Fiona tended to stay close to me or watching her son depending on whether he was with the rest of the kids where the older kids would be paying attention or wandering around. That part was great.

As it got later, 6 of us (me, Keith, Fiona, Mario, my sis, and her husband) started drinking a bit. Not too much since most of my family disapproves, but just a little. Still, all fine. We get the boys to come upstairs and play regular group games and I end up sitting between Fiona and Mario. Mario is flirting really heavily with me, and Fiona and I have had banter going on all evening - nothing most people would notice as unusual since she didn't know many people there. Keith says he notices my cousin giving him odd looks and looking kind of pointedly in our direction once in a while, but I didn't notice anything. Fiona at one point had to stop herself because our knees were really close and she had automatically started touching my leg with part of her hand. At midnight we all had champagne/sparkling wine. Still good. After everyone left, the 6 of us plus my parents sat down to play Apples to Apples. Still drinking (my parents joined in at that point). Finally we all decide it's bed time at like 3:30. Fiona, Mario, Keith, and I head downstairs. My parents go to bed. My sis and her husband go to bed.

As soon as we get down there, Mario is all over me. Not necessarily unusual as we have random days where we are VERY physically into each other. I made a joke to kind of get him to slow down for a bit so EVERYONE could have fun and Keith and Fiona join us on the bed. Fiona and Mario both focus on me for a minute and then Keith starts playing with Fiona and it was like she forgot I existed. The ONLY time she even touched me after that was when I apparently started getting to loud and she slapped her hand over my mouth. That's fine, I needed to be quiet with my family upstairs, she was having fun too... No big deal, but I'm suddenly not feeling as great about the whole night at that point. She hadn't kissed me at all even when it was just she and I were the only ones around and I tried to get close.

After we were all done playing, we were obviously exhausted. I was about to get out from under the covers of the bed to let Fiona and Mario have it when Mario got comfy on the air mattress instead. I told them I was going to sleep on the air mattress or on the couch since they'd only had 3 nights of a real bed since their trip. Mario says he isn't moving but Fiona should sleep with me in the bed. Then Fiona says she's sleeping with him. On the air mattress. Forget the fact that I'd been insisting ALL WEEK that Keith and I take the air mattress. I would have been fine with sleeping in the bed with Fiona. I would have been fine sleeping on the air mattress with Keith. I was NOT fine sleeping in the bed with Keith. lol Weird, I know, but it's the way I am. She physically held me down when I tried to get up. Didn't listen to my opinion at all. I just felt like I meant nothing. She hadn't kissed me since midnight (and shut down any attempt I made), she barely touched me in bed (I did try to play with her, too, but there wasn't much room to maneuver so after Keith came over all I could do was fondle - she didn't return the favor at all), she didn't want to sleep with me OR let me sleep where I wanted to sleep.

I was upset, couldn't go to sleep, so I went upstairs to read for a while in the office. Keith tells me the next day that he noticed me leaving but decided not to check on me because he thought I needed space - fair enough, but I would have liked him to since I slipped out when he was asleep. It would have been nice to know I was missed, I guess. Fiona came upstairs, knew I was up there, and didn't come into the room. I didn't realize it was her that was in the bathroom so I didn't go out. Once again, would have been nice of her to check on me to see WHY I wasn't downstairs sleeping (or sleeping at all), but ok then.

So, I was feeling pretty disappointed about the entire situation at that point. I felt physically rejected by Fiona. Emotionally rejected that my views didn't seem to matter and that the one night that we have a chance to sleep together she opts not to (even after multiple entreaties by her husband that she should and me reminding her how nice it was last time).

With these feelings all swirling around me, last night on our drive home (we had went to Mario and Fiona's to hand out and to give their son Christmas gifts since we hadn't had a chance yet), Keith tells me that they had hung out with a couple they'd met from a swinger's site last night. Fiona didn't tell me. At all. Still hasn't. So once again, I feel like she doesn't care how I feel about ANYTHING. The last time they met a couple, she was texting me every half hour, offered to not even meet them if I wasn't okay with it, and the next day was cuddly and attentive to make sure that I didn't feel threatened, I guess. Last night, I once again got nothing. She did sit between me and Mario so she could be in physical contact with both of us, but when I would try to hold her hand, rub her arm or leg, or anything like that she didn't really respond in any way. Oh, and she forgot to mention that she could have had sex with other people last night.

I just feel like I'm over it. Whatever I'm feeling for her is NOT worth feeling like shit every time she doesn't think about me in various situations.
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  #32  
Old 01-03-2012, 11:42 PM
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AnnabelMore AnnabelMore is offline
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Wow, so lame. I'm sorry. It sounded before like you guys had strong communication and that whole bracelet present thing was so sweet... I wonder what the heck is happening now??

"Keith tells me the next day that he noticed me leaving but decided not to check on me because he thought I needed space - fair enough, but I would have liked him to since I slipped out when he was asleep. It would have been nice to know I was missed, I guess. Fiona came upstairs, knew I was up there, and didn't come into the room. I didn't realize it was her that was in the bathroom so I didn't go out. Once again, would have been nice of her to check on me to see WHY I wasn't downstairs sleeping (or sleeping at all), but ok then."

Stuff like this speaks to me of needing to feel more comfortable speaking up for your needs. If you go away, of course people are going to assume you want space. For you to want them to know that you in fact want the opposite is to expect your lovers to be mind readers, and trouble lies that way.

Of course, that aside, I would be mightily pissed too in your position

If you love her and want to give her a chance, it's on you to speak up and make it clear that you felt hurt. Revealing a wound and risking a second rejection is terrifying, but brave communication is absolutely necessary in matters of the heart. It may be that something was going on that you just can't guess at that would explain it, like maybe she'd been feeling alienated from Mario for some reason and really needed to be close to him for sleeping purposes... which doesn't explain her not listening to you and not kissing you, but it would at least be interesting to hear what on earth was going on with her that evening.

Or, of course you could just walk away. None of us would blame you, I'm sure. I would imagine though you'll feel more ultimate closure if you at least talk to her about it first.
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  #33  
Old 01-03-2012, 11:50 PM
km34 km34 is offline
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So, I decided that feeling upset over multiple occurrences over 3 (very hectic) days shouldn't cause me to entirely give up. Although one part of me wants to. Our date for Debbie Does Dallas had gotten kind of infringed upon by the boys deciding we all needed to go to this Brazilian restaurant that night since there is a deal going on where it is a whole heck of a lot cheaper. It would still be just her and I going to the play, but instead of a cozy dinner for 2, we will now be having a rowdy dinner for at least 10 (counting kids).

My sister also wants to go to the play, but I have told Fiona I would make up an excuse as to why she couldn't (since Fiona won't let me just come out and say it's a date) if she wants me to, but since the dinner part is already off I didn't know if it mattered -which is the truth since I can't tell what's going on with her the last week or so. I hate to be rude to my sis, but since I can't be honest, rude or completely ruining the date seem to be my only options. I'd be fine planning another evening for the two of us, but I get that it was a great Christmas present that I planned the evening that included a play she is so excited about (Fiona is really into theatre) so I'm not upset if she wants to preserve what she can of the evening.

I'm pretty sure I'm being a bit (or more than a bit) of a bitch in the way I'm presenting the issue to Fiona, though. I sent her a text saying my sis wants to go and said since we were all going to dinner i didn't know if it would be a big deal or not. She just said sure. I told her I accidentally told my bro in law what we were doing so the word spread to my sis and she said it wasn't a big deal and that maybe we could get coffee just the two of us after the play. I told her I could tell my sis that I already got the tickets but just forget to mention that it's general admission if she wanted it to be just the two of us there, but I wasn't sure if it mattered or not. I've heard nothing since.
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  #34  
Old 01-04-2012, 12:03 AM
km34 km34 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnabelMore View Post
Revealing a wound and risking a second rejection is terrifying, but brave communication is absolutely necessary in matters of the heart.
At this point I just feel like I have more invested than she does and asking her to give more than she's willing to doesn't seem fair to either one of us. I went into this relationship knowing we pretty much wanted different things, but hoping that I/we could figure out a way to make it work anyway.

I'm not mad about people not checking on me when I went upstairs. I honestly thought they would all sleep through until morning and wouldn't even know I was gone. The fact that Keith noticed and Fiona was 10 feet away and neither one thought that they would see if I was ok is what upsets me. I had gotten physically ill earlier in the evening (I have stomach ulcers so eating poorly, stressful situations, overheating, etc. can make me get sick) so I was surprised that neither one looked in although both noticed my absence.
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  #35  
Old 01-04-2012, 05:54 PM
km34 km34 is offline
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Ok... So I ended up talking to Fiona. Because I knew I'd never really be 'over it' unless I had closure (thanks for reiterating, AnnabelMore - and Keith). After the discussion about the play, I finally told her that I just felt like we hadn't had much time for the two of us with the holidays going on, but that I didn't want to say anything because she hadn't shown any signs of feeling the same way. I then told her that I'd been feeling like this and then Keith told me they'd hung out with another couple and she hadn't told me which kind of shocked me. Apparently she thought she told me (not the first time she has completely spaced telling me something - New Year's plans were crazy stressful before my family situation decided them since she forgot to tell me when they had officially decided to stay in Indiana). She sent me this long thing apologizing and saying she just wanted to give me space to make sure I was comfortable with everything (since she was the first one to make a big deal of our feelings) and that instead she made me feel like she didn't want to spend time with me.

Pretty much we've both been trying to read the other one, and we suck at it. I told her we REALLY need to stop doing that, and we just need to TALK. I asked her what she wanted both from me and from the relationship, and she just doesn't know, apparently. She knows I'm special, knows I make her feel special, and she can't imagine her life without me, but she doesn't know what she wants in the future. From me, she just asks that I speak up sooner if something bothers me. More than a fair request.

The only thing that I don't feel like she really responded to enough for my liking is the whole not listening to what I wanted thing. At one point she said something about my opinions being important but didn't really say WHY she ignored my very insistent request that she and Mario take the bed. I suppose it doesn't really matter as long as we've both learned from the whole experience, but I'm still interested.

@AnnabelMore - I kind of ignored the bit about Fiona and Mario possibly needing that closeness in my whole emotional blindness. I did notice it, though, and I'm sure you are partly right. Mario has been VERY supportive of this whole shift in the dynamic of our little group, but at times I can tell that he kind of misses being the direct center of Fiona's attention (minus her son, of course). I didn't think of it this way, but sometimes he does act a little put out when she will choose to sit next to me to cuddle with me instead of sitting next to him to cuddle with him. Normally she'll sit in the middle of us so she can be touching both of us, but not always. Keith suggested (after me telling him about this ) that he thought she may have been just trying to make sure none of us spent the first night of the new year sleeping alone, too. Either way, if she wanted to sleep with her husband, fine, but why not sleep in the bed where I wanted them to be? lol Sounds petty even to me, but I suppose I am too used to getting my way and this is bugging me.
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  #36  
Old 01-04-2012, 06:03 PM
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Any person giving good relationship advice will eventually emphasize the same thing -- comunication, communication, communication. In poly, where the potential factors influencing people's behaviors and needs are exponential, it's absolutely indispensable. Clear, frequent, and direct. No guessing games allowed.

Very glad it went well.
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  #37  
Old 01-04-2012, 06:27 PM
km34 km34 is offline
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I feel bad always being the one to initiate these heart to hearts. lol As I told Fiona last night, I feel like she has so much going on already that I feel selfish demanding more. I think it would make me feel better if she DID require some other effort from me. Oh, well. I just need to embrace my status as high maintenance, I suppose.

Keith is wanting to go to the swing club this weekend, though, so I suppose I am making sacrifices there. As much as not having sex with other women is a sacrifice. Some people don't have sex with anyone besides their spouse, I'm not going to complain about a temporary limitation on my play.
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  #38  
Old 01-04-2012, 07:14 PM
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It's funny, I think it can be easier to accept our partners having different needs/desires from our own in opposite gender relationships. Like, if my bf doesn't want to talk about stuff I may be annoyed but I can think "Oh, he's a dude and that's just how they are, they hate talking about feelings." Whereas if my gf doesn't want to talk I can't soothe myself with that line.
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  #39  
Old 01-06-2012, 05:26 AM
km34 km34 is offline
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So, Keith and I are NOT going to be going to the club anytime soon it looks like unless I decide to just go ahead and do it even though I know Fiona isn't really comfortable with it. She kept saying it was fine when I told her Keith wanted to go, but she wouldn't look at me and she wouldn't elaborate. I told her we didn't plan to play and even if we did I would NOT do anything with another women (per her request earlier). Still nothing but a quick change of the subject.

Being the worrier I am, I talked to Mario today and he pretty much confirmed what I assumed was going on: she isn't comfortable with me going but doesn't want Keith to resent her and doesn't feel like she has the right to tell me not to do something. So, Keith being the wonderful husband he is, agreed that we would find other plans even though I can't even offer an idea as to WHEN we will be able to do what he wants to do. Fiona (and Mario, actually) would like us all to go back to the club together one more time, but Mario doesn't really have the urge to return AND they apparently are unable to find reliable childcare for the crazy late night that it would be.

I asked Mario if they'd be able to get a sitter so the four of us could go out for a nice dinner and maybe out for a few drinks, and he said it was too late to do it for this week (not necessarily true, I babysit and people ask for a few days away all the time... He refused to even try). Keith and I are going out just the two of us, which will be great and I am really looking forward to it, but I would still like for us all to spend some time together as adults, without anyone having to worry about a kid. AKA without me and Fiona having to worry about a kid. lol Hopefully one day soon...
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  #40  
Old 01-09-2012, 05:52 PM
km34 km34 is offline
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Keith and I had all day Saturday to ourselves (which was great). We went to a hockey game and downtown to a place that's kind of like Hooters, but the girls wear even more revealing clothes. lol It was fun, but crazy busy because of all the sports fans there. Great food, actually. Then Sunday we hung out with Mario, Fiona, my sis, and her husband for lunch. We're taking a financial class with my sister and brother in law so we went to that, and then had a fun evening of Fox cartoons and Jeopardy at Mario and Fiona's.

I made a joke at one point about Keith needing a girlfriend, and he said that since I had one it's only fair since I have one (once again, joking - he doesn't really believe that if one of us has another relationship the other one deserves one). Mario then said he agreed, Fiona laughed along (which is impressive given her previous issues with letting him do things alone), so he looked at me, took my hand, and asked me to be his girlfriend. It was a joke, I think, but it got me thinking. I wouldn't say I have feelings for Mario, but I almost think of myself as closer to him than I am to Fiona. I can talk to him better (he and I were up until 3am the other night talking), we have so much in common, and our personalities are so similar we get along amazingly. Granted, the similar personalities also cause us to clash now and then, but it is surprisingly rare. Lately I've noticed him and I become closer physically, too, when it comes to lying on the couch watching tv, we'll kind of cuddle now sometimes or even just hold hands. I don't really know if it's something I should be paying attention to or not. It's nice, but I don't really think of him romantically so I hope he doesn't think more of it than I do. Fiona seems to fluctuate between loving seeing the two of us interact so well and being kind of envious that we are able to connect on a more intellectual level. She doesn't necessarily have the same interests we do there.

Anyway, Fiona totally screwed up Saturday and ordered tickets for some kids' show (Disney related, I think, I don't know) for the same day we are supposed to see Debbie Does Dallas. She called me crying, I just kind of shut down because I could hear Mario in the background already acting upset at her so I didn't want to compound on that. I was pretty cold, though, Keith says in my lack of real reaction. She fixed it, though, and I told her it really was fine since she realized her mistake immediately and was willing to do whatever (even giving the tickets to someone else) to fix it.

So, it was kind of a weirdly stressful and not stressful weekend all in one. Next weekend, however, will be AWESOME. Hopefully. Mario is trying to find a babysitter so we can ALL go out for a while! They always tell Keith and me not to let them stop us from doing what we want to do, so we finally decided we are going to start going out at least once a month. This month two, because of some stuff going on that we are interested in. Mario and Fiona took the hint and have decided that doing fun out-of-the-house stuff is worth making a little effort and paying for a sitter. Yay! I get to act like a normal 22 year old every once in a while and go out on the town!

Fiona and I may also be getting some extra alone time coming up because Mario is going to have to work late. It will be nice since we have both realized we need to focus on 'us' more than we realized until we get this communication thing down. Right now I am cautiously optimistic. Those emotional swings caused by me overreacting are something I am going to try to work on...
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