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  #21  
Old 11-30-2011, 05:27 AM
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Originally Posted by AnnabelMore View Post
I talk sometimes about the vee of me, Gia, and Eric ...
Are you really in a Vee with Eric and Gia? I thought all three of you were sexually involved with each other. And you do love him, so there is emotional involvement with you and both of them. I've just been thinking of your tangle with them as a Triad.

But I like your term "squiggle!"
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  #22  
Old 11-30-2011, 05:42 AM
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Thanks for the clarification there! I wonder why triads don't have much of a success record? I guess it's hard for all three people to stay in love with each other.

Annabel, I do get what you're saying, it's still all a bit confusing to me to keep it all in order and remember all the terms. I had read the glossary of terms before but there is just so much I keep confusing some of them.
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  #23  
Old 11-30-2011, 05:50 AM
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Tough call, I think it's really a semantic thing. I checked the glossary after seeing your post and it didn't clear it up, could go either way.

If Eric and I never slept together again I would have lost a connection with a lover who I care about, so that would be lame as heck, but I wouldn't be losing a relationship, it'd be no tragedy -- we'd still just be close friends. And there's no romance there to begin with. Whereas with Gia, if we never regained the physical/romantic aspect of our relationship and became just friends I would feel a great sense of loss. So, while our times together have largely been three-person times, if we're a triangle-shape we're not at all an equilateral one.

To me, the vee-ness of the situation feels very clear because I feel the "line" of the relationship attaching me at the wing to Gia at the hinge, and I see the line between Gia and Eric burning brightly, whereas there's not a corresponding "line" attaching me and Eric that would close the shape and make it a triangle/triad. The feeling of vee-ness was all the stronger for me when I was letting my unrequited feelings for Eric bum me out, because the absence of that line was what was making me sad (lately I've felt that much less keenly, I think I'm getting over wanting something I don't have with him).

I think to me it comes down to one thing. Are Eric and I bf and gf? No? Then no triad, all appearances to the contrary notwithstanding. I find the distinction important when dealing with friends, because it's uncomfortable to have people assume things that are wrong about your relationship with someone, and it's very easy for people to assume I'm dating both of them. Which, again, when I was more focused on pining, just made me sad.

Maybe we're a vee with a dotted line between the two wings.
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.
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  #24  
Old 11-30-2011, 06:01 AM
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Originally Posted by AnnabelMore View Post
Maybe we're a vee with a dotted line between the two wings.
Wow, a dotted vee, a squiggle - you're on a roll coming up withnew terminology... LOL!

Eh, maybe this is just a case where labels don't matter at all.
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  #25  
Old 11-30-2011, 06:19 AM
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Thanks for the clarification there! I wonder why triads don't have much of a success record? I guess it's hard for all three people to stay in love with each other.
I think of it this way. Love is an amazing, unlikely thing. I mean, what are the chances that you're going to really, truly love any given person enough to want to trust them with your heart and soul, and care for them enough to accept the huge responsibility of safeguarding their heart and soul in return? Pretty dang low. Love is a surprise every time.

Let's say you find it with someone. Incredible, wonderful! Let's say, being poly, you're lucky enough to find another, simultaneous love that's so deep and real that it also pulls you in and owns your deepest parts! Now, what are the chances that of all the people in the world you could find a second magical, mystical, stars-aligned, cosmic-vibrations-attuned connection with, that it should happen to be with the partner of the first person? What are the chances that lightning will not only strike twice but will also strike just a hands-breadth away from where it struck the first time?

Now, clearly I'm being over dramatic to make my point, but in essence I think that captures my take on it. Threeway sex, easy as pie. Threeway affection and compatibility, totally doable. Threeway deep love that's passionate, romantic, and companionate all around, muuuuch much harder to find.

It happens, but as Nyc mentioned it seems to happen serendipitously. When a triad is the goal I think it puts a lot of pressure on any situation that's close to that ideal to mould itself into that, and then *someone* is generally stretching to make that happen and in time that can cause cracks. Staying relaxed and flexible seems to be much safer and more successful. As you can see in my explanation of my own situation above, there's a lot of gray area when it comes to three-person relationships, a lot of wiggle room for the people involved to follow their feelings and find a shape that fits them best and that they can define however feels right.

As you can also see from my story above, I have my own experiences which almost certainly form certain biases. Perhaps I'm hard on the concept of the triad because I envy it and it's not what I ended up with. But I'm really, really glad there was no expectation for a triad ideal put on any of us when we started out, because that would have made it so much worse when it didn't happen. If we had felt like Eric was supposed to be my boyfriend, and maybe even called him that because we did have great sex and did care for each other, then I think the fact that we didn't form a bond of mutual love the way Gia and I did would have been a much bigger sore spot for me. I would have felt like my boyfriend didn't love me back, because, well, he didn't, and how freaking painful is that? Instead, all I had to deal with was that my friend didn't love me back and, hey, that wasn't *fun* but it's also something I could deal with, unrequited crushes on friends being something within my realm of experience.
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.
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  #26  
Old 11-30-2011, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnabelMore View Post
Threeway sex, easy as pie.
Mmm, pie......
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.
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  #27  
Old 11-30-2011, 06:51 AM
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I understand what you're saying and it makes a lot of sense. I guess the problem with a vee or N is that we'd be concerned about the other one being jealous or insecure. Honestly, something like that already happened to us. The situation I explained at the start of this thread. V fell in love with me, but not with Rain and Rain could not deal with it. She wanted V to love her too because she loved V and me and I loved her and V, but V only loved me, though she did consider Rain her best friend as well. But there was no romantic love feelings there on her part. This made Rain feel pushed aside, insecure, jealous and generally like shit. We don't want that to happen again.

Of course the past situation was never discussed enough. We both hid things from each other until it was too late and V hid things from us. V was also not Poly, but cheating on her boyfriend and ended up just wanting to me with me which was not going to happen because I wasn't going to leave Rain. So yeah, it was generally a huge fuck up all round and we just don't want to repeat that situation. I can not take Rain hurting like that again or my own heart breaking again as it did when V went psycho on us (very long story).
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  #28  
Old 11-30-2011, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnabelMore View Post
Threeway sex, easy as pie.
That's what I thought. Threeway sex is what caused the situation I just described. We thought it was only be sex... how wrong we all were.
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  #29  
Old 11-30-2011, 07:15 AM
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Honestly, I strongly believe that the way to beat jealousy and insecurity is NOT by insisting that everyone must love each other equally, which isn't generally how people work and is unpredictable at best, but rather by working on becoming more secure and better at identifying and dealing with jealousy. That brequires a ton of communication, introspection, more communication, trust-building, etc. It's hard work, but shortcuts will just backfire (as in "why am I *still* miserable and freaking out when we set this up so that we could avoid ever feeling these things??").

Great resources here: http://www.morethantwo.com/jealousy-insecurity.html
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The major players. Me, 30ish bi female. Gia, girlfriend of 4+ years. Clay, boyfriend/dom. Davis, ex/friend/"it's complicated." Eddie, roommate & fwb.
The supporting cast. Eric, Gia's husband. Bee, Gia and Eric's toddler. Dexter, Gia's lover. Helen, Eric's lover. Izzy and Nikki, Clay's partners. Liam, Eddie's husband.
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  #30  
Old 11-30-2011, 07:20 AM
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I read part of that but not sure I got to that area and Rain will definitely need to read it. And I agree with you. I do think it is unrealistic to expect whoever the person is to love us both equally or even love us both at all. Though ideally it is what we want.

Whatever happens down the line I will go at the pace of Rain as I think that is what will need to happen. Also at the time Rain thought I didn't love her as much or at all anymore if I loved V. It took me quite a while to explain to her that my feelings for her hadn't changed, just that I loved V as well. She had a very hard time understanding that, but she does now... though I thought she should have understood it since she also loved V. I don't know, I just think to some degree she has a harder time with it. Yes, I have my insecurities but as long as I can talk them out in an adult way and feel heard I am ok.

Also, in the previous messed up threesome we had I often felt like we were in competition with each other for V's affections. I think this really fucked us up because we should have been joined in it, not feeling like we were competing with each other.
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