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  #251  
Old 10-28-2011, 12:23 PM
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. . . often I tell Alex beforehand "I won't see Sam for such-and-such amount of time after this" but then I find it REALLY hard to stick to that.
Why, when saying you want to spend time with Sam, do you add in the idea that you will go a certain amount of time before you see her again? That sounds like you feel really guilty about what you're doing. You know, like when Lucy wants Ricky to put her in his show, she says, "I promise I won't ask you again." It's a childish way of asking for what you want.

I think that, instead of requesting permission from Alex as if she's your mother, figure out how often you want to see Sam, and stick to it. Then just set up an agreement that you will plan ahead, put it on the calendar, etc., so that Alex is aware of when you'll be with Sam. Set up a Google calendar. So, let's say that you and Sam want three nights a week together, or two nights and one full day on the weekend, or an overnight somewhere in there, whatever. You can designate specific nights for that or play it by ear, but Alex will know she agreed to that amount. This way you don't feel like you're this bad girl begging for a little fun. Then, if there is something Alex wants to do and it happens to be a night you have scheduled to see Sam, you can negotiate: "Well, that is my night to see Sam, but I'll see if she'd be okay with switching it because I'd really like to do this with you."

Just approach it like adults who are making their own choices, since that's what you are, not like you're doing this terrible thing and are hoping to get away with it. Ultimately, if you are acting ethically, honestly, and without hiding anything, the only thing left is for Alex to forgive you fully and completely -- and that's up to her -- so you can both move on.
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"Oh, oh, can't you see? Love is the drug for me." ~Bryan Ferry
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An excellent blog post on hierarchy in polyamory:
solopoly.net/2014/10/31/why-im-not-a-secondary-partner-the-short-version/

Last edited by nycindie; 10-28-2011 at 12:27 PM.
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  #252  
Old 10-28-2011, 07:24 PM
AutumnalTone AutumnalTone is offline
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...i read another thread about how its not really possible to feel NRE for more than one person at a time....

That notion is pure bullshit. It may be true for some individuals--it certainly isn't true universally.
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  #253  
Old 10-28-2011, 07:32 PM
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It sounds to me like the three of you are just about at the point where sitting down and hashing out times to see each other on a regular basis is in order. No one has the right to give the other permission, but its time to get real here and come forward with what you all want to see happen. Each person will have to be willing to make themselves vulnerable about their feelings and needs in this in order to go beyond compromise into agreements about time and boundaries.

It does sound lilke you feel guilty. I suggest dumping that feeling if you can and be empathetic instead. It isn't useful in negotiating to feel guilty because people who feel guilty usually make promises and agreements they can't keep. It pepetuates guilt when they find themselves unable to keep them.

The best one can do with that, I have found, if you can't drop the guilt, is to agree as you see fit and if it doesn't work then say so and change it again. Make sure that everyone knows that negotiations are fluid and everything is on trial for now so that there is room to come back to the drawing board and so everyone knows that it is expected.

There should be room for "mistakes" and trying stuff out as long as it doesn't get to a place where someone becomes resentful because they have neglected to speak up when its not working for them. They are responsible for that. No one else is. Good luck hard work ahead
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  #254  
Old 10-28-2011, 09:30 PM
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Wow. This is really super helpful and I am SO glad I found this forum. Nothing has been more helpful to me in this process so far than reading your words here and on other threads. Thanks again.

I really appreciate how you all are able to call me (and other people on this forum) out on stuff, in a straightforward yet supportive way. I DO feel guilty about what I am doing, and I DO end up asking Alex for things like a bad girl asking for permission to be naughty. It's true, it doesn't feel good to anyone. I suppose this may be left over from old ways of being (i.e. lying and cheating) and also from the sense that Alex is agreeing to things because she is afraid of losing me rather than really truly being invested in poly. But the reality is she probably would lose me if she were to insist on being mono, so I guess she is also choosing what she feels is best for her in this situation.

By the way, I hear that a number of you are objecting to the idea that someone cannot feel NRE for more than one person at a time. That is not my personal thought or opinion, just something I heard on a clip of a researcher speaking about different types of love (there's a link to it on this forum somewhere), so it was just something that had just stuck in my mind. I get that people have had experiences that contradict this idea. I am just so IN IT with Sam and I was fantasizing that maybe she only has NRE for me, but that is not very mature of me and totally contradicts what poly is about, I get that. She is so super hot and amazing and we have INCREDIBLE sex, and its okay that other people find her hot and amazing, and maybe even have incredible sex with her too.
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  #255  
Old 10-28-2011, 10:15 PM
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As an aside, this morning when Alex was feeling testy about me making requests to spend more time with Sam, she said she thinks I might be a "sex and love addict". I did a serach for this term on the forums but had a hard time finding anything specific. Maybe this is another thread, but what do folks here generally think about that concept. It seems to have such a negative connotation but I wonder if anyone thinks there is merit to the concept?
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  #256  
Old 10-28-2011, 10:26 PM
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AnnabelMore AnnabelMore is offline
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Originally Posted by beginninglove View Post
As an aside, this morning when Alex was feeling testy about me making requests to spend more time with Sam, she said she thinks I might be a "sex and love addict". I did a serach for this term on the forums but had a hard time finding anything specific. Maybe this is another thread, but what do folks here generally think about that concept. It seems to have such a negative connotation but I wonder if anyone thinks there is merit to the concept?
*rolls eyes* Yes, sex addiction is a real thing. You can look it up. No, you're not an addict for falling in love and enjoying sex with your gf. Unless the whole human race is, in which case it's meaningless. That was either dumb, silly, or just mean of her to say.
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  #257  
Old 10-28-2011, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by beginninglove View Post
As an aside, this morning when Alex was feeling testy about me making requests to spend more time with Sam, she said she thinks I might be a "sex and love addict".
Wow, that's such a passive-aggressive remark to make. Sounds like she didn't really want to discuss it and so she took a potshot at you - an easy way to plant a seed of insecurity or self-doubt in you. Not nice at all.
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The world opens up... when you do.

"Oh, oh, can't you see? Love is the drug for me." ~Bryan Ferry
"Love and the self are one . . ." ~Leo Buscaglia "

An excellent blog post on hierarchy in polyamory:
solopoly.net/2014/10/31/why-im-not-a-secondary-partner-the-short-version/
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  #258  
Old 10-28-2011, 10:32 PM
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thanks, i thought that's what folks would generally say. i'm just gonna ignore Alex's comment as her trying to get a rise out of me and move on. i'm pretty sure i'm not a sex addict, i just happen to be having a lot of great sex with Sam right now...and that's a FABULOUS thing.
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  #259  
Old 10-28-2011, 10:36 PM
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i'm just gonna ignore Alex's comment as her trying to get a rise out of me and move on.
Why ignore it? Why not tell her you don't appreciate such remarks and ask that if she has a problem with you to verbalize what it is directly? You sweep little shit like that under the rug and, believe me, it will build up! Then someday you'll regret never having put the kabosh on it sooner. You won't do either one of you any good by allowing stuff like that.
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The world opens up... when you do.

"Oh, oh, can't you see? Love is the drug for me." ~Bryan Ferry
"Love and the self are one . . ." ~Leo Buscaglia "

An excellent blog post on hierarchy in polyamory:
solopoly.net/2014/10/31/why-im-not-a-secondary-partner-the-short-version/

Last edited by nycindie; 10-28-2011 at 10:38 PM.
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  #260  
Old 10-29-2011, 12:15 AM
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damn, you are so right. thank you for calling me out!

i'm realizing through this feedback that i need to get a LOT clearer in my communication with Alex and let go of guilt and also not allow her to jab at me or use my guilt to try and make me feel bad. i have noticed that i have had quite a bit of self-doubt come up around this stuff (i.e. am i just being selfish? am i a good enough communicator to make this happen in a healthy way? am i too used to getting what i want and am thus being a brat for asking for it when it hurts her? etc). Alex has been talking to MANY of her friends about what has gone on between us as we have been exploring non-monogamy, and i think its easy for a lot of our mono friends to say judgmental things and help her feel like she's really going way out on a limb here in accommodating my needs. i've noticed myself avoiding particular friends (mostly HER friends) as a result.
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