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  #11  
Old 10-27-2009, 08:54 PM
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Fidelia-

I agree with you 100%.
It was only out of a desire to be sure that people know that we ALL CAN change if we choose.

I suppose had I really been thinking in full about my reply (which I was not, I was contemplating how to word my new thread ) I would have included this:

Steps to moving past an Affair-(for the one who cheated):

1. Full acknowledgement (this means no "but they..") of responsibility for your actions and choices.

2. Willingness and determination to put forth a full accounting of your needs (to yourself and everyone else) in life and full accounting of what you can give another in a relationship. (because you may be truly incompatible and this needs addressed ASAP)

3. Willingness and determination to re-EARN trust (not to be mistaken for regain, because trust must be earned with actions).

4. Willingness and determination to correct within yourself (through introspection, therapy, medication etc) that which allowed you to believe there was purpose or benefit in a life and relationship created on lies.

5. Willingness and determination to NOT rebuild your old life (becuase it's all a lie now) but to create a NEW self that is worthy of a true and happy life.

6. At some point after holding yourself accountable you also must forgive yourself for your transgressions and move on as the new and improved you.


I'm sure there are others-but those are off the top of my head!

And in case you (general) are a cheater and fear that this list is too daunting a task-I can tell you from experience. I've tried the "just shove it under the carpet" method and then I tried this-this has been MUCH more rewarding, healing and much less painful! Well worth the effort to work on oneself.

OP- If your wife isn't willing to do this-it's a lost cause at this point. Not to say it always will be. I know I was a lost cause for a long time. But for now it is. And poly is not a solution to lying. Honesty is.
For me being poly in an unaccepting world was part of the problem that led to me feeling I should live a lie-I was living a lie in hiding who I was already-so it just seemed to go along the same lines.
But honesty has to be a way of life in order for relationships to flourish.
Good luck!
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  #12  
Old 10-27-2009, 11:35 PM
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ok
wow. did not expect to be seeing this when i logged on tonight,
First off, the girl he is talking about is me,
2nd, i am actually really glad that you where able to be honest and get your point accross i know its not easy for you.

Ok now my point of view,

I made a very big mistake with M first time around,
even though we where discusssing polyamoury and openning our relationship because i let myself be intamite with him before we made an agreement i accept that i cheated and that i was wrong, i regret this more than anything i have ever done,

it has been well over a year since things ended with M, and we are now sucessfully polyamorous. I feel i have learned a lot from my mistake, and i know that there is a need for radical honesty if we are to be sucessful in making this work

I did not expect to meet and fall in love with R, and seeing that you have accepted him and like him means a great deal to me,

I have spent the past year and 5 months (the time since i split with M) trying to move on from him. But i realised that i was unhappy, that no matter how much i wanted to do this for you because i knew that you really did not want him to ever be a part of my life again i felt like there was something missing,
i truely regret how we went about things the first time around, and i regret that i hurt you, i am always grateful that you where able to forgive me for this,

Before i started to speak to M again (as a friend) i asked you if that was ok and if you had any issues at all with it, you told me that you did not and so i went ahead and i contacted M once more,

it was then that we realised that you still had some very serious feelings about M,
and i can understand that, and am willing to take things slowly and work on those feelings in the hope that one day you might be able to let go of your hate and allow us to try again and do things right this time

YES I KNOW IM ASKING A LOT


it is not something i have decided easily. Its not a case of me giving you an ultamatum, i want things to work out with you more than anything but i know that if i give up my love for M in order to make you happy that would not make me happy, and i know some people will say thats selfish but i honestly can't do it, becuase it hurts me too much.

I am willing and able to be honest with you,
we have moved on so much in our relationship since the initial betrayal with M that was over 2 years ago now and we have come so far,

i have and continue to be honest with you and R about M, and I am trying to take things at a pace that is comfortable for everyone

i am guessing i am going to get mega bashed for this, because i know that i sound like a horrible person and i did do a horrible thing to someone who loves me and who i love, if i could go back in time and do it all diffrent i would but now all i can do is be true to myself and honest with my partners

Jools
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  #13  
Old 10-27-2009, 11:43 PM
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jools-I haven't even read your whole post-but I have to say I KNEW someone on the board had posted this story to some degree from another point of view!!

Now-I'll read your post.
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  #14  
Old 10-27-2009, 11:44 PM
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i just hope that the entire forum doesn't hate me now!
i am feeling ever so slightly unpopular lol
but i am actually really glad that montianboy was able to open up in this way when i gave him link to forum i wasn't even sure that he would ever post,
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  #15  
Old 10-27-2009, 11:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ladyjools View Post

i am guessing i am going to get mega bashed for this, because i know that i sound like a horrible person and i did do a horrible thing to someone who loves me and who i love, if i could go back in time and do it all diffrent i would but now all i can do is be true to myself and honest with my partners

Jools
Not by me.

Jools, making a mistake-even a horrible mistake does not make a horrible person.

But it does mean that you have to take the consequences in stride.

I so know what you are going through-and my dear husband knows exactly the other side of that horrible coin.

To make things harder-C was a MAJOR part of our children's lives and it would have DESTROYED them if he insisted on him not being in our life after the affair. (Which he did but saw the damage inside of 2 days to our youngest son and compromised grudgingly because his love for his son was stronger then his love for himself).

This IS a huge request you are making. Far be it from me to tell you that it's possible for you to not make it. Because I tried damn hard to cut C out of my life. I even moved away. It only resulted in me becoming someone no one wanted to be around-including Maca. So I know what you mean when you say it's too much.

If you need to talk-feel free to PM me. And OP if you need to talk-you can PM me or Maca any time. He knows your position personally.

Be patient with one another, try to be calm and try to understand each other's pains. Oh and read my posts about insecurity from earlier today! They are heartfelt and might provoke a helpful conversation between you two on this topic.
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  #16  
Old 10-27-2009, 11:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ladyjools View Post
i just hope that the entire forum doesn't hate me now!
i am feeling ever so slightly unpopular lol
but i am actually really glad that montianboy was able to open up in this way when i gave him link to forum i wasn't even sure that he would ever post,
And so-is he one of the ABC boys? (M, R)
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  #17  
Old 10-28-2009, 12:09 AM
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hes Montianboy is C,
R and M have not joined this forum
was tempted to give R the link but think il deal with this first before i get a whole heap of stuff thrown at me from an even diffrent perspective lol

thankyou so much for your input it helps me a lot, and i hope it will help mountianboy

yes i know i am asking a lot
i cut M out of my life for over a year,
no contact, no phone, msn, meeting in person nothing i cut him out and i tried to forget him, i dated other guys and i tried to move on... i felt like i was losing my mind, i kept telling myself if i kept going ignoring my feelings they would go away and they just didn't

there where nights id cry so hard because i missed him that i was sick

that does not justify my hurting Montianboy though, but that is just my reaons why i can't do it anymore, after over a year and still feeling like im still in love with him and losing my mind i feel like i need to try something diffrent, even if it is a huge risk, its got to be better than how horrible i felt inside having M cut out of my life

at the moment i have not seen M in person, we are only talking over phone and msn, but i already i feel 100 times better and more alive than i did when i was not talking to him at all.

Jools
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  #18  
Old 10-28-2009, 12:19 AM
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I'm glad we got the other side of the story! It sound to me as though you are truly sorry for what happened, and are really trying to make it work. I don't know that my post will help any, but just to give you another perspective:

I mentioned a woman named S on here earlier. She's my fiance's ex. They were together for 5 years, and raised HMA's son together. They were really building a life. A lot of things were wrong with their relationship when I came along - and I was only a friend to him. I was in a bad relationship too, so we were able to commiserate. The mutual like of one another as friends, combined with he and I being one another's "type" eventually, well after S left, got us into a WONDERFUL relationship.

At the beginning, there were a lot of problems. I had to spend time with S. I had to watch HMA - who I was in love with, agonize over her or me, her or me - because she couldn't be in his life if I was there. Not even as a girlfriend - she couldn't handle me as a friend.

Later, there was talk of a three-way relationship. A triad, or a V, depending on where things went. I went along with it for one reason only. Because I knew S would NEVER let it happen. And I'm really glad she didn't - because if HMA had come to me and said, "I know the circumstances surrounding S, and the relationship you may or may not have with her are very negative. You don't like her, she doesn't really like you, whatever. But I can't pick. I'll be with you, and she can tolerate me being with you - but I'm going to be with her too." I can say beyond a shadow of a doubt that I would have left. I would have been there for HMA, been a friend - but I couldn't have been in a relationship with them, not even a V. Because of how little I respect S, and how much I dislike her, and how horrible the situation was that involved all three of us.

I would never force HMA to cut S out of his life - she has his kid for now, one state away, and they're learning to talk as friends. If a relationship ever started to re-kindle there, I would put my foot down, just like TheMountainBoy did to you. I would tell HMA he could either be happy with the fact that I could handle them being friends, and respect that I can't take it, and that they broke up for a reason - or I was out. Gone. I couldn't do that to myself. There comes a point where personal happiness is more important.

When I was going through my serious trouble with Anne (our current third) and struggling with our relationship, there was always the "out" for me. A veto power. HMA wasn't willing to compromise what he had with me, and the other possibilities out there, for one girl. He was in love with Anne, yes - but our relationship, and the possibility of other relationships with a different girl existing was more important. His willingness to help me, or let it go for me and for the relationship HE AND I had was what ultimately drive me forward. I'm glad he did, but that tactic wouldn't work in every situation.

Frankly, Jools, if I was TheMountainBoy in your situation, I would be bracing myself to leave you. He's been able to handle you being with other men, he's been able to continue on with poly despite getting burned by cheating. I don't know that I would be that strong, so MAJOR props to him! You have access to ANY OTHER MAN on the PLANET that will have you, TheMountainBoy has only asked that because of the pain that was caused by your cheating that you not develop a romantic relationship with M. That's what I asked of HMA. We had an open relationship, yes. And I was so uncomfortable with S because of what happened, I asked him to not fuck her. ANY woman but her. He agreed. It wasn't that much to ask.

You need to very, VERY carefully evaluate whether your relationship with M is more important than the one you have with TheMountainBoy. Because if he can't handle it - some people just can't, and I'm one of them, you're going to lose him. Is it worth it? Or is it just you rebelling against a "rule"? Is it because he's the one person you've been asked NOT to have, there's now an incurable allure to the forbidden? Or is your love for M THAT strong that you HAVE to have him, all consequences be damned?

Talk to TheMountainBoy about it. If he can't see it working, and he can't budge on it because of a moral issue or whatever - if he can't handle you being with M, evaluate closely. Don't begrudge him his feelings, they're valid. If they can't be worked through - you have a decision to make. The ball will be in your court. Pursue a relationship with M at the expense of the one with TheMountainBoy, or lose TheMountainBoy and move forward with M, and be poly with him. Seek new opportunities and new lovers without TheMountainBoy in the picture.

Just my 2 cents, and how I feel. I'm more than happy to PM you about it, if you need a sounding board or a differing opinion. In the end, we're all here for each other!

(I hope I got the names right. Correct me if I'm wrong!)
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  #19  
Old 10-28-2009, 12:32 AM
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I figured it out who he was from your post on my thread. Sorry for the confusion!

Anyway-yes I do know what that is like. I moved away and spent many a night puking in a freaking outhouse bathroom (no I'm not joking about the state of the bathroom) over the whole disaster.

I love Maca in ways I can't possibly explain (which is part of the problem for him) and I definately never want to see him walk out our door. I see us together in old age and I see myself holding him in my arms as he makes the peaceful end to his life here on earth.

BUT-I'm not the innocent "vanilla cracker" that he hoped I would be.
I'm not even sure how he came up with the idea I ever could be. I wasn't when we met and he knew that. He certainly didn't know EVERYTHING-but he knew I wasn't that.

Just remember-this isn't a game of all or nothing. This is life and sometimes life MUST go one tiny step at a time, not just one adult step at a time. When someone's heart has been broken, their trust annihilated, their ability to progress decreases and they have to start back at tiny steps. Like a person who was in an accident and lost the ability to walk, first you work on building muscle in the legs (rebuilding trust between the two of you), then you work on their self confidence in themselves (reaching out to the world as a whole, not M), then they get to try their feet so to speak with the bars on both sides of their body (building relationships w/others, not M), then as they get better with the bars they progress to walking with a walker (talking to M MAYBE) and IF THEY ARE LUCKY THEY GET TO WALK AGAIN, but no guarantees (M).

It's not something you can even say WILL happen. You do the work, you see how far it gets you. Each step is an accomplishment in itself, but no step is a guarantee of reaching the last step.
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  #20  
Old 10-28-2009, 12:32 AM
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its not a case of me wanting M more than montianboy,
i dont' love him more, but i do love him

i can have any other man on the planet that wants me, but i am in love with M, and i tried to cut him out i managed no contact for a year and it drove me mad,

i realised that i cant do it, i can't even explain why i can't do it but i just cant it hurts me too much,

i am prepared that i may lose montianboy,
i don't want to lose him, but i understand that i might
i do have faith that we can work through this

M is not a bad person he like me made a mistake, regrets it and is willing to do whatever it takes to regain montianboys trust, but i do not begrudge montianboy his feelings, because the mistake we made was so bad that we deserve those feelings,

i seem unable to change how i feel about M
so i have to try something diffrent even if it means i lose montianboy,

Jools
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