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  #51  
Old 09-13-2011, 08:36 PM
MichelleZed MichelleZed is offline
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Originally Posted by Carma View Post
He has even made the joke, "Oh, sure, just when I was starting to have some fun, you call the whole thing off!"
I find this joke vaguely disturbing because I seem to recall he was the one who called it off. He didn't want to change the way he was relating to his girlfriend, and said that he wanted to continue the way things were (where you girls didn't meet and he could tell her lies about you) or end both relationships. What were you supposed to choose?

I kind of feel like he put you in a difficult position and then is now blaming you for it, albiet jokingly.
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  #52  
Old 09-13-2011, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by MichelleZed View Post
I find this joke vaguely disturbing because I seem to recall he was the one who called it off. He didn't want to change the way he was relating to his girlfriend, and said that he wanted to continue the way things were (where you girls didn't meet and he could tell her lies about you) or end both relationships. What were you supposed to choose?

I kind of feel like he put you in a difficult position and then is now blaming you for it, albiet jokingly.
MZ, you make a VERY good point. It certainly sheds some light! The perspective helps -- I have been wallowing in guilt intermittently. Beating myself up quite a bit.

It seems that throughout my marriage, I have tried to overcompensate for every weakness I perceive of Sundance's. If he spends too much, I will scrimp. If he gets his hair done once every 3 weeks, I will go every 3 months. He eats a lot, I'll eat nothing. He watches tv, I watch none. He won't delay gratification in any way, I will deprive myself till it reaches the point of desperation. He won't read, I'll read EVERYTHING I can get my hands on. He won't take responsibility for a problem we have, I'LL take responsibility for the whole thing (because only then will I be able to FIX it,right?!?)....

The thing is, no matter how I tried to make up for things, I only overwhelmed the hell out of myself. So I started to shut down. I am a perfectionist, so if I can't do it perfectly, I won't do it AT ALL. If he's going to keep swirling, I will FREEZE.

Thank you for pointing this out as you did -- because I've been talking to my mother (who thinks poly is immoral and impossible and is SOOOO glad I've finally come to my senses) and she really has no sympathy for me in this, whatsoever. She just points out, "Well, what have you been doing to him for 4 years?" Which amazes me, because she has known (and sypathized!) about my feelings for Butch throughout the entire journey! She knows how hard I struggled. She knows how hard I fought loving him, because of the MORAL dilemma. She knows I did not cave in and start up an affair with him out of malice, that I never wanted to hurt my husband, that I was devastated by what I thought was a betrayal of my heart -- and of GOD, even. The ONLY thing that felt right then was to fill Butch's need. When this all began, yes, I realized what was at stake, I realized I could lose everything. But somewhere inside of me, it actually felt SELFISH to sit and watch him suffer, while I chose my cushy life instead. How could i be happy while I watched him hurting right in front of my eyes, every damn day???

Maybe I didn't learn boundaries growing up (well, I didn't) and maybe I didn't have the sense enough to realize where this could lead. But I loved him, and I'm not ashamed that I tried my best to honor the love I felt. And I DID try to set a boundary of honor, too -- that it couldn't go to a sexual arena, because that would pervert the purity of my heart, blah blah blah. I fought, I tried, I failed. I acted on the love and I do not have to be ashamed or full of regret for that.

Now I gave Butch up, not because Sundance was finally having fun! But because I was suffering too much from his lying behavior. Ending things with Butch was the only way to put a stop to the train wreck that my life was becoming. I love Butch and I love Sundance, but if I don't show MYSELF any love or respect, I am going to disintegrate.
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  #53  
Old 09-14-2011, 12:17 AM
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Now I gave Butch up, not because Sundance was finally having fun! But because I was suffering too much from his lying behavior.
Please please please please please make sure Sundance knows this, in no uncertain terms!!!

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Originally Posted by Carma View Post
Ending things with Butch was the only way to put a stop to the train wreck that my life was becoming. I love Butch and I love Sundance, but if I don't show MYSELF any love or respect, I am going to disintegrate.
You made a sacrifice for him because you saw that it was necessary. It was the ultimatum he gave you and you met that ultimatum. It is unfortunate that he looked to you to corral his own bad behavior rather than cultivate his strength of character to do the right thing on his own. I hope eventually Sundance realizes this, and what a sacrifice you made. Are you looking for some therapy/counseling for the both of you?
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An excellent blog post on hierarchy in polyamory:
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  #54  
Old 09-14-2011, 08:43 PM
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Carma, I understand that you are trying to simplify things and save your marriage, but are you really going to be happy this way? Already you are saying you will forgive him if he cheats...assuming he will. Yet, you've sacrificed your other love, sacrificed your happiness. It's not like giving up Butch will keep Sundance from lying. Please find someone to talk to. I want you to be happy, and stop sacrificing things because you think you need to. The sacrifice needs to be on both sides for it to be a happy marriage. I'm not saying that you shouldn't focus on your marriage, because it sounds like whatever relationship he is in, Sundance wants to be the center of that person's world...it's pretty obvious in his dealings with Barbie. Whether or not you continue in a poly relationship, you need to be able to feel secure and happy...and you need to find someone to talk to so you can overcome your past issues. It sounds like Sundance needs it too, but I'd like to know you are working toward your own happiness, and not just his.
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  #55  
Old 09-16-2011, 02:52 PM
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Somegeezer Somegeezer is offline
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Originally Posted by Kealoha View Post
Carma, I understand that you are trying to simplify things and save your marriage, but are you really going to be happy this way? Already you are saying you will forgive him if he cheats...assuming he will. Yet, you've sacrificed your other love, sacrificed your happiness. It's not like giving up Butch will keep Sundance from lying. Please find someone to talk to. I want you to be happy, and stop sacrificing things because you think you need to. The sacrifice needs to be on both sides for it to be a happy marriage. I'm not saying that you shouldn't focus on your marriage, because it sounds like whatever relationship he is in, Sundance wants to be the center of that person's world...it's pretty obvious in his dealings with Barbie. Whether or not you continue in a poly relationship, you need to be able to feel secure and happy...and you need to find someone to talk to so you can overcome your past issues. It sounds like Sundance needs it too, but I'd like to know you are working toward your own happiness, and not just his.
Couldn't agree more.

Do you have a limit with Sundance? Is there a point where you would say to yourself, "this is it, I can't give up my own happiness any longer, Sundance must go!"? Because I think if you don't give yourself a limit and stick to it, he may just end up walking all over you.

I really hope it never has to come to that though. That all your problems get solved and you keep your happiness and your sanity! =]
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  #56  
Old 09-16-2011, 09:15 PM
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Yes, SG, I believe I DO have a limit, and I hope I will know when I've reached it! Haha. Don't worry, I've been wimpy and played victim sometimes, but when it comes down to it I WILL find my backbone (pretty sure I have one ). And with help from people on here like you, I can be strong.

Kea, NY, MZ, thanks -- I'm working on the marriage, but I'm not going to lose myself on the way. Love you, sisters.
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  #57  
Old 09-19-2011, 07:55 AM
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Somegeezer Somegeezer is offline
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Originally Posted by Carma View Post
Yes, SG, I believe I DO have a limit, and I hope I will know when I've reached it! Haha. Don't worry, I've been wimpy and played victim sometimes, but when it comes down to it I WILL find my backbone (pretty sure I have one ). And with help from people on here like you, I can be strong.

Kea, NY, MZ, thanks -- I'm working on the marriage, but I'm not going to lose myself on the way. Love you, sisters.
Everyone knows when they've hit their limit. The point is to never get yourself there. =] Keep us all updated on the happenings. =]
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  #58  
Old 09-19-2011, 06:56 PM
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Moderators, I think I need help!

Can you figure this out -- I've got a blog "Turnabout," and this thread, both kinda dealing with the same stuff. I'm repeating myself, having parallel conversations, developing a split personality or something! Can you recommend something?
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  #59  
Old 09-19-2011, 07:52 PM
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ImaginaryIllusion ImaginaryIllusion is offline
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Originally Posted by Carma View Post
Can you recommend something?
Pick one? (The mono way)

or

Realize that a single thread cannot be all things, and allow each to fill it's roll as best it can...one for support & affirmation, the other for open discussion and hard analysis. (the Poly-ish solution)


Lube!
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  #60  
Old 09-19-2011, 07:54 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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MOD HAT ON:

Well i could merge the threads. You were the one who started this in General Discussions so it was taken at face value that you wanted a discussion about going from a V to an N.

Is that what you want? Both threads merged together and placed in Life Stories and Blogs?

MOD HAT OFF:

I'll add that it's helpful to know what you want before you ask people to give you what you want. Other people can't read your mind. This is just a general comment toward the subject of your blog/discussion thread which i have been following somewhat but haven't felt like participating (and still dont TBH because it's quite a trainwreck at this point).
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