Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > General Poly Discussions

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 09-07-2011, 02:30 AM
ray's Avatar
ray ray is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 819
Default

Only you can judge whether you and Cherry have good compatibility, so I say this not to you specifically but as a general thing. We often make the assumption that because a relationship has lots of good aspects that we should hold on no matter what. But I am finding that if there's something important, even if it's one thing, that's just not working, all those good things don't make it a good relationship. Obviously, there's a difference between something needing time to settle and an aspect NOT WORKING. Sometimes, I see mono-poly dynamics and many of them just seem like they're not working. Obviously, there are examples of some who do but sometimes I wonder if people are trying to fit square pegs in round holes and again... It's Just Not Working.
Perhaps that's something that needs to be understood more. How to know when to say enough's enough versus let's try harder. I'm not trying to say that mono/poly dynamics are bad and unhealthy. I just think that if some one really doesn't want polyamory or monogamy and they're just trying to will themselves to be okay with something they're NOT....it's totally nuts. I have personal experience with this so perhaps it's an emotional subject. My metamour of my previous relationship, tried really hard but couldn't stand up to her husband and say what she wanted. I guess my issue is that I see people (including me) unable/unwilling to stand up and say, hey this isn't working, obviously we aren't going to make good lovers, I still care about you...I need XYZ in a relationship and we can't give that to each other.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-07-2011, 03:10 AM
SourGirl's Avatar
SourGirl SourGirl is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: South of an Igloo, North of a Desert.
Posts: 885
Default

Great point Ray.

This is something I have come full circle on as well.
In past attempts to do poly 'correctly,' I have stayed in situations far past their expiration dates. Hoping for something to give/change, when it really shouldn`t have changed. We were different people .
That`s OK. Moving on is just fine.

There is so much talk about not 'abandoning' people, and not 'discarding' them, that I have seen others, as well as myself, work at something much longer then they should have.

Of course, only those people can decide those things.

Some people are able to compromise more then others, and for longer periods of time. I have seen some mono`s on here, compromise to huge extents.
It doesn`t make the relationship a failure, as long as respect stays mutual.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-11-2011, 07:03 PM
redpepper's Avatar
redpepper redpepper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,634
Default

Somegeezer- I like to think of mono/poly as "cultural" differences...you are from Britain and she is from Brazil for an example. You live in Brazil with her and have to figure out how to be in this "culture" that isn't your own. Does that make sense?

It has helped me let go of "fixing" my relationship with Mono and just living it as best we can from our own points of view. I spend more time being curious about his "culture" that way, rather than getting frustrated that he doesn't get it. I think this is useful in all relationships with anyone really. It takes away our natural desire to expect and assume I think.

There is no real answer to your questions,,, no real fit. Its all personal and all a mystery from day one. I think I can relate to how you feel and the frustration it brings... its just a matter of checking in with your self about whether what you have is rooted in love for one another or rooted in MAKING it work. If the answer is the latter, keep at is and see what happens in time.

For the record; I have come to see couples where one opens up to poly and the other doesn't as that person deciding to take on another religion after being in another religion their whole lives. Say you are Christian, born and raised in the bible belt, married a Christian person and raised your kids that way... then discover Buddhism. BAM! Everything changes.... you know the story. We hear it here all the time. Imagine what that would feel like! There is common ground, but wading through the politics of both religions to get to that is hard work and along with that is a great deal of feelings of betrayal for the one who is still Christian.

What you are in SG is like this.... finding common ground and holding on to it for dear life (because you love each other so much) is all there is as far as I can see.
__________________
Anyone want to be friends on Facebook?
Send me your name via PM
My blog
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-11-2011, 09:09 PM
SNeacail's Avatar
SNeacail SNeacail is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Near Disneyland
Posts: 1,551
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
For the record; I have come to see couples where one opens up to poly and the other doesn't as that person deciding to take on another religion after being in another religion their whole lives. Say you are Christian, born and raised in the bible belt, married a Christian person and raised your kids that way... then discover Buddhism. BAM! Everything changes.... you know the story. We hear it here all the time. Imagine what that would feel like! There is common ground, but wading through the politics of both religions to get to that is hard work and along with that is a great deal of feelings of betrayal for the one who is still Christian.
RP I think this is a great parallel.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-11-2011, 10:15 PM
nycindie's Avatar
nycindie nycindie is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: The Big Apple
Posts: 7,161
Default

The idea that reconciling poly vs. mono by thinking of them as two cultures needing understanding and curiosity about each other is a good one... to a point. I think it's pretty easy for someone who identifies as poly to think of it this way. The reality, however, is that if and when the poly person does find another potential partner, the mono person is generally going to feel threatened by the idea of "sharing" them. All intellectual understanding flies out the window when you're brokenhearted about your love having sex with someone else or falling in love with another. A monogamous person wants to be the only one in someone's heart and bed, plain and simple. It is contrary to everything monogamy has taught us to truly believe that if a loved one is involved with someone else, they won't leave us for them.


Somegeezer, I think there are two issues you are dealing with right now. One is that Cherry is at odds with a very important part of YOU and how you see yourself, and you wish she was more accepting or at least would try to understand. The other issue is sort of speculatory -- I think you are worried about what could happen if, down the road, you want another additional relationship. That is kind of hanging over your head, and the uncertainty is probably uncomfortable, while her judgment about poly likely feels constricting for you. You don't have that sense of freedom right now, knowing how she objects to non-monogamy. I think you are feeling that you can't really relax in your relationship with Cherry if (a.) you can't be fully yourself; and (b.) you will be prevented from pursuing what you want, if someone else comes your way.

I think it will take some bargaining. I think it will take unflinching honesty. Perhaps she hasn't really wanted to look at the reality of what your being poly actually means, nor try to understand it because she's afraid of being abandoned by you for someone else. I don't think you should harp on her about it, but if it's a sticking point that will not let you relax, a good, deep conversation may be in order. She needs your reassurance that your feelings for her are steadfast even if you do eventually meet someone else. But she also needs to come to some point of acceptance and be willing to at least try to understand how important this is to you.

Only you know if this relationship is worth the investment it will take, or if it will withstand some turmoil to reach a place of calm and centeredness. I know you know that if you do meet someone else you want to be in relationship with, you will need to make extra effort to reassure Cherry that she is loved and has no need to feel threatened.

But there may be a point where, if she doesn't budge, and it's all exhausting work on your part, the scales could tip in the direction of making your relationship more work than fun, more angst than loving, good feelings. Then you may have to say goodbye. It's up to you to figure out if you're willing to put in all that work and energy. Personally, I think love is worth it. Hopefully Cherry will be willing to come up against her boundaries and belief systems and examine them with a more open mind.
__________________
The world opens up... when you do.

Oh, oh, can't you see? Love is the drug for me. ~Bryan Ferry
"Love is that condition in which another person's happiness is essential to your own." ~Robert Heinlein

Last edited by nycindie; 09-12-2011 at 03:37 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 09-13-2011, 09:57 AM
Somegeezer's Avatar
Somegeezer Somegeezer is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Leeds, UK
Posts: 805
Default

Without having to quote absolutely everything from redpepper and indie, I find all of what you both said more helpful in the topic than a lot of the other stuff before it.

indie, I'm especially thankful to you, as it is all really helpful advice to my personal experience and I will keep all that and use it. I think "Personally, I think love is worth it." is my favourite line in the whole thing. Just to sum it all up, that sometimes things are hard, but you can push through. =]

RedPepper, you are one of the first to be on direct topic of what the thread was meant for, and not just for my personal benfit. ^_^ It's really great advice to have from someone who is actually in a mono/poly relationship. I definitely feel there is no need to "fix" anything and am certainly not trying to change anyone. I accepted amost immediately that it is not something she wants. I can't push her into it.

back to indie again, I've also thought a lot about when that time does come and if it can't be accepted. If it does happen that way, I personally feel that it obviously isn't the right place to be. I don't aim to make anyone unhappy and if it comes to a point where they are and there's no changing it, I really can't help them anymore than I have. But up until then, I definitely put everything I can of myself into a relationship. Love is definitely worth it. =]
__________________
[Insert witty comment here]
Feel free to add me up on facebook. - Just click here.
Do send a message in your request saying who you are and that you're from this forum. It will help me filter out any spam requests.
=]
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 09-14-2011, 12:29 AM
nycindie's Avatar
nycindie nycindie is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: The Big Apple
Posts: 7,161
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Somegeezer View Post
Just to sum it all up, that sometimes things are hard, but you can push through. =]

. . . I don't aim to make anyone unhappy and if it comes to a point where they are and there's no changing it, I really can't help them anymore than I have. But up until then, I definitely put everything I can of myself into a relationship. Love is definitely worth it. =]
Hey, I'm glad I could be helpful to you. There was one other thing I had wanted to say in my big long post, and forgot after I started getting going. And that is: enjoy what you've got. Yes, put everything you are into the relationship, be present with her and with your feelings, and pour your heart into it. You reap what you sow. The future will happen and worrying about it now won't change it. I think you're in good shape.
__________________
The world opens up... when you do.

Oh, oh, can't you see? Love is the drug for me. ~Bryan Ferry
"Love is that condition in which another person's happiness is essential to your own." ~Robert Heinlein
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 09-15-2011, 02:08 AM
MeeraReed MeeraReed is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: East Coast, U.S.
Posts: 349
Default

I'm assuming that Cherry is also around your age? 19 or so?

If that's the case, I would advise you to remember that she is YOUNG. Dating, relationships, and sex might all be pretty new to her in general. When you're young, you're often insecure about dating, sex, and relationships (without even realizing you are insecure) simply because it's all new and confusing.

You're young too, but you have the benefit of having questioned society's norms about relationships and figured out what you want for yourself.

I had a relationship with a poly guy when I was 21. I was mono (at that time) and he was poly. Before, I had never considered that there were any other options besides being monogamous. I liked the idea of an alternative type of relationship and I wanted my boyfriend (Techie) to be able to be himself.

But I was also not interested in dating anyone other than Techie, and I was uncomfortable with many of the things he did. I understood that he and I had very different perspectives on relationships, but I believed that we could be happy meeting halfway on some common ground.

He basically refused to meet me halfway and kept insisting that he could not be bound by any rules or restrictions. He also refused to explain what exactly he wanted (with his relationship with me or with anyone else) and insisted that he get to do whatever he wanted because "love has no boundaries."

It was hurtful and insensitive to me. It was also very frustrating because I was very introspective and self-aware, and I knew that most of my issues were due to my insecurities and inexperience. (I was a VERY late bloomer and Techie was my first sex partner, although I'd had one boyfriend before that. But I'd never even flirted with anyone else, ever!)

I explained repeatedly about how insecure I was, and how I was trying to overcome it, but Techie really did nothing to make me feel secure with him.

The idea of non-monogamy appealed to me, but I felt like I wasn't quite ready for it yet (and told him so). I explained to him repeatedly that because sex was so new to me, the idea of him having more and more partners freaked me out. But he did not care at all, sulked whenever I told him his behavior hurt me, and threatened to break up with me constantly.

Also, he did nothing to show that he cared about me. Actually, he treated me like crap. Which should have been obvious to me when I was with him, but wasn't (because I was YOUNG).

However, in retrospect, some of the things Techie wanted to do, which bothered me then, I now think are reasonable and would no longer bother me at all. I was so insecure with myself I really couldn't handle an open-type relationship, even though I wanted to.

What frustrated me most about Techie was that I offered him many middle grounds, and it was never enough for him.

When I supported his relationship with his live-in sort-of-ex girlfriend, it wasn't enough--I had to want to hang out with her constantly. When I encouraged him to continue to visit friends in other cities that were sometimes friends-with-benefits, it wasn't enough--he demanded I go with him to meet these friends, and he sulked for days when I said I wasn't comfortable with that. When I suggested he have certain days of the week or certain weekends where he went off to meet other girls, it wasn't enough--he needed to be able to flirt with every girl we ran into while walking across campus together.

When I talked to him honestly and openly about my jealousy and how I wanted to work through it, he accused me of being crazy and said we had nothing in common if I didn't understand "infinite love."

So I guess my advice is--if you want to be with Cherry, actually listen to her and try to understand her, and respect her boundaries. You present her as being really close-minded about poly, but maybe you aren't really listening to her.

You don't get to just do whatever you want on the excuse that your nature is poly.

And if you do decide to continue a relationship with her, for heaven's sake don't blame her for making you miserable when you finally do end it.
__________________
Single, straight, female, solo, non-monogamous.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 09-15-2011, 01:55 PM
River's Avatar
River River is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: NM, USA
Posts: 1,894
Default

MeeraReed,

I just wanted to say that I really appreciated your last post. A generous gift.
__________________
bi, partnered, available

River's Blog
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 09-15-2011, 02:26 PM
ray's Avatar
ray ray is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 819
Default

Meera, that is an interesting post. I think it says a lot about perspective. It's so easy for each of us to assume that we are right or doing things the way the should be. I guess we should all remember that our perspective is not the only one. That if we're in a relationship, we really need to consider the other point of view with the assumption that it is a valid one. We always want to say, well, who's right? And sometimes the answer is everyone or no one. Going along with the culture analogy, it does take a lot of understanding and moving away from "ethnocentricity." Or the assumption that your way is the best way. With mono's and poly's, there's already a lot of assumed tension where some monos feel like polys look down on them for being "less enlightened." And the polys may feel like the monos regard them as a bunch of polyfuckerous sluts. Both perspectives must be valued for a relationship to work.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
ideal, middle, mono, poly, pressure

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:37 AM.