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  #1  
Old 06-02-2010, 09:17 AM
DD123 DD123 is offline
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Question "Maybe I shouldn't have..."

Hi all! male mono here, my gf is poly, Im 22 and she is 20 (just to answer before its asked).

So my gf just got back from visiting her family and her x-bf in a city 5-6 hours away from where we both go to college. She told me before she left that she was going to sleep with her x-bf. She told me of her weekend when she got back, not only did she sleep with her x-bf, but also had a 3 way with D and Ds gf.

Before my question I have to say that my gf agreed with redpepper's statement that: "she is not the sort of person that sees sex as a loving, bonding thing, but a fun sport."

She then tells me that it shocks her at how much of a "slut" she is. When she was presented the opportunity with D and his gf, she was excited and looking forward to it. She tells me that after the fact, she thinks that maybe she shouldnt have done that. I cant speak for her, I can only guess that maybe she feels guilt, remorse, and like she was people pleasing so that she would be liked by D and his gf.

So I am looking for similar feelings/experience from poly ppl. What is too much? What is the line where the cost out-weighs the benefit? is she looking to boost her self-esteem by people pleasing? When is a "slut" too slutty?
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  #2  
Old 06-02-2010, 12:57 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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Do you think she could possibly be feeling "judged" by the "poly community"?

I've noticed a certain, I don't know a polite way to say this - disapproval on this forum and elsewhere toward people who say that they have had casual sex, do not regret it, and would do it again if they had the chance. It seems as though the correct answer to "how do you feel about casual sex?" is "I tried it and it felt so wrong that I will only have sex within the context of a "loving" relationship from now on."

Even though there are probably just as many if not more folks on this forum who enjoy casual sex and are not afraid to say so, I think that the term "polyamory" CAN connotate casual sex as something people do because they don't know any better.

For the record, I am one of the individuals who DID used to enjoy "casual sex", "sport-fucking", "friends with benefits", etc. and while there are certain incidents in which I would have been better off not taking part, overall I do NOT regret it, and would for the most part do it all over again. So, I say to your girlfriend, "Go girl", as long as you are up-front about it with each other, and practice safe-sex.
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  #3  
Old 06-02-2010, 01:19 PM
DharmaBum23 DharmaBum23 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YGirl View Post
Do you think she could possibly be feeling "judged" by the "poly community"?

I've noticed a certain, I don't know a polite way to say this - disapproval on this forum and elsewhere toward people who say that they have had casual sex, do not regret it, and would do it again if they had the chance. It seems as though the correct answer to "how do you feel about casual sex?" is "I tried it and it felt so wrong that I will only have sex within the context of a "loving" relationship from now on."

Even though there are probably just as many if not more folks on this forum who enjoy casual sex and are not afraid to say so, I think that the term "polyamory" CAN connotate casual sex as something people do because they don't know any better.

For the record, I am one of the individuals who DID used to enjoy "casual sex", "sport-fucking", "friends with benefits", etc. and while there are certain incidents in which I would have been better off not taking part, overall I do NOT regret it, and would for the most part do it all over again. So, I say to your girlfriend, "Go girl", as long as you are up-front about it with each other, and practice safe-sex.
I've noticed the same thing. I think(and this is only a hypothesis) that it has to do with the perception of poly as being deeply intertwined with sex(which is enough of a perception that I can think of at least one fairly popular podcast that has as its tagline, "It's not all about the sex.") and an attempt to disassociate poly with swinging.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DD123 View Post

She then tells me that it shocks her at how much of a "slut" she is. When she was presented the opportunity with D and his gf, she was excited and looking forward to it. She tells me that after the fact, she thinks that maybe she shouldnt have done that. I cant speak for her, I can only guess that maybe she feels guilt, remorse, and like she was people pleasing so that she would be liked by D and his gf.

So I am looking for similar feelings/experience from poly ppl. What is too much? What is the line where the cost out-weighs the benefit? is she looking to boost her self-esteem by people pleasing? When is a "slut" too slutty?
A "slut" is too "slutty" when their actions have consequences that they do not want.

The above answer is vague by design. The "slut" in question is the only one who can make the final determination of if he or she was too "slutty". However, the people surrounding them can give their input in regards to the consequences that apply to them.
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  #4  
Old 06-02-2010, 01:20 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DharmaBum23 View Post
I've noticed the same thing. I think(and this is only a hypothesis) that it has to do with the perception of poly as being deeply intertwined with sex(which is enough of a perception that I can think of at least one fairly popular podcast that has as its tagline, "It's not all about the sex.") and an attempt to disassociate poly with swinging.
I would tend to agree that there is some basis in reality for that hypothesis.
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  #5  
Old 06-02-2010, 02:53 PM
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redpepper redpepper is offline
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I personally don't see how this forum should be chalked up to being against casual sex.. I think some people are and that is fine, that is their thoughts and opinions. But to chalk up a whole forum to being against it, come on! That's a bit much

Any opinion I have would be based on my own experiences and the results of them. For me the whole casual sex thing is a "been there, done that" thing that I do not regret. I regret who I hurt along the way, including myself.
There are times when casual sex is not the best idea because it could do more harm than the fun it can be.

I would suggest that in the case you are talking about DD123, you had your feelings hurt and perhaps she could of approached it differently. She was excited about it and didn't tell you she was going to? This didn't just come up, it was arranged and she didn't tell you it sounds like. She didn't tell you, by the sounds of it, because she thought you might object to her having a threesome. That to me is not responsible. Poly to me is based in responsible non-monogamy, it has it's roots there. Use the poly term as you will to feeling loving in casual sex, but being irresponsible is just plain irresponsible and perhaps why she feels like a slut in a negative sense. She chose to avoid being honest... I remember doing that and it made me feel like a slut too.

I love feeling like a slut personally. In the fun yet dirty sense. But when I do, it's because I have done what I can to make sure that in the moment of slutness I have been empathetic, forthcoming with information on what I am about to do and don't go beyond the bounds that in my gut make me realize I will hurt someone. If I find myself going beyond what has been previously agreed upon by my loves, then it means I have to tell them and face the repercussion... to me that isn't worth it and fucking can wait. There will always be another moment.

This is a learning process for her and I am glad you are being patient. It sounds like she could have a lot of fun, I hope next time she takes what she has learned and is more responsible in her approach to the ones that she wants to have sex with and more responsible to you and your relationship.
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  #6  
Old 06-02-2010, 03:20 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
I personally don't see how this forum should be chalked up to being against casual sex.. I think some people are and that is fine, that is their thoughts and opinions. But to chalk up a whole forum to being against it, come on! That's a bit much.
Redpepper,

I said "ON THIS FORUM AND ELSEWHERE", not "the whole forum".

Quote:
I've noticed a certain, I don't know a polite way to say this - disapproval on this forum and elsewhere toward people who say that they have had casual sex, do not regret it, and would do it again if they had the chance. It seems as though the correct answer to "how do you feel about casual sex?" is "I tried it and it felt so wrong that I will only have sex within the context of a "loving" relationship from now on."
I also said this:


Quote:
Even though there are probably just as many if not more folks on this forum who enjoy casual sex and are not afraid to say so, I think that the term "polyamory" CAN connotate casual sex as something people do because they don't know any better.
Furthermore, I am part of this forum and I said:
Quote:
For the record, I am one of the individuals who DID used to enjoy "casual sex", "sport-fucking", "friends with benefits", etc. and while there are certain incidents in which I would have been better off not taking part, overall I do NOT regret it, and would for the most part do it all over again.


I grow impatient when people respond to something that was never even said. I appreciate it when people read what was ACTUALLY said before answering (especially because I made a conscious effort to NOT GENERALIZE ABOUT THE ENTIRE FLIPPING FORUM). Reading things that were never even said into someone's posts is "a bit much".

That is all.

Last edited by NeonKaos; 06-02-2010 at 03:32 PM.
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  #7  
Old 06-02-2010, 03:38 PM
NeonKaos NeonKaos is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
I would suggest that in the case you are talking about DD123, you had your feelings hurt and perhaps she could of approached it differently. She was excited about it and didn't tell you she was going to? This didn't just come up, it was arranged and she didn't tell you it sounds like. She didn't tell you, by the sounds of it, because she thought you might object to her having a threesome. That to me is not responsible. Poly to me is based in responsible non-monogamy, it has it's roots there. Use the poly term as you will to feeling loving in casual sex, but being irresponsible is just plain irresponsible and perhaps why she feels like a slut in a negative sense. She chose to avoid being honest...

I think it could be the opposite phenomenon at work. Perhaps the DD123's girlfriend thought it would be no big deal to him if the ex's girlfriend joined them. It is also possible that DD123's girlfriend didn't tell him because he might have said "ok" but underneath she felt like she "should" be having a threesome with DD123 and a third person, instead of being the "third" person with two other people.

Keep in mind that I do not necessarily "believe" either of these scenarios. I'm just putting different spins on the situation.

DD123, you should get your girlfriend over here so the rest of us have her perspective on all this.
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  #8  
Old 06-02-2010, 10:31 PM
jkelly jkelly is offline
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Default Sluttiness, slut-shaming and polyamory

Quote:
Originally Posted by DD123 View Post
She then tells me that it shocks her at how much of a "slut" she is. When she was presented the opportunity with D and his gf, she was excited and looking forward to it. She tells me that after the fact, she thinks that maybe she shouldnt have done that.
We have a lot of nonsense in our society around women's sexuality. It's easy to internalise that and start shaming yourself when you do something that you know society would judge you for.

I think that, if you can, the best thing for you to do here is to encourage her to not be ashamed of her sexuality in any way, and try to get to a place where she can feel good about her choices and connections with people (as long as they are safe, sane and consensual, of course).

Quote:
Originally Posted by DD123 View Post
When is a "slut" too slutty?
If one's sex life is having a negative impact on one's life outside the bedroom (like, neglecting the kids, or falling behind at work, or something), then it may be time to try to refocus one's attention. Otherwise, I'm not sure that there's any reason to believe that there is any such thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
I personally don't see how this forum should be chalked up to being against casual sex.. I think some people are and that is fine, that is their thoughts and opinions. But to chalk up a whole forum to being against it, come on! That's a bit much
Quote:
Originally Posted by AutumnalTone View Post
It ain't poly if you're just fucking around.
A forum moderator thinks that this message is important enough to attach to every post.

Don't get me wrong, I'm no fan of having weird assumptions about my sexual appetite being made just because I'm poly-. That's really annoying! I totally get why lots of poly- people get defensive about this, and want to emphasise that their relationships are loving, with a great deal of emotional depth and commitment. I do that, too!

But I don't think that we should just blow right past YGirl's observation. Our society really does engage in (sometimes horrific) slut-shaming, and, even in the very unlikely case that every influential voice in this forum is enthusiastically pro-sex, the way that poly- people defend the emotional intimacy of their relationships can start to sound like more of that shaming and dismissal. I think it would be valuable for everybody to simply be conscientious about how they phrase the distinction between polyamory and casual sex, assuming that they don't want to perpetuate that.
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  #9  
Old 06-03-2010, 08:55 PM
AutumnalTone AutumnalTone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkelly View Post
But I don't think that we should just blow right past YGirl's observation. Our society really does engage in (sometimes horrific) slut-shaming, and, even in the very unlikely case that every influential voice in this forum is enthusiastically pro-sex, the way that poly- people defend the emotional intimacy of their relationships can start to sound like more of that shaming and dismissal. I think it would be valuable for everybody to simply be conscientious about how they phrase the distinction between polyamory and casual sex, assuming that they don't want to perpetuate that.
If you take my sig file as being anti-sex in any fashion, then you infer something far removed from what it says. I am in no fashion anti-sex, nor anti-casual sex; indeed, I enjoy casual sex (my wife and I have an open relationship, in addition to being poly). My sig file statement is concerned with nothing more than accuracy in description--that poly is different from open and swinging--and nothing more.

Anybody who infers anything different is bringing his or her own bias into the reading.
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When speaking of various forms of non-monogamy...it ain't poly if you're just fucking around.

While polyamory, open relationships, and swinging are all distinctly different approaches to non-monogamy, they are not mutually exlusive. Folks can, and some do, engage in more than one of them at a time--and it's all good.
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