Polyamory.com Forum  

Go Back   Polyamory.com Forum > Polyamory > General Poly Discussions

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-29-2011, 05:59 PM
redpepper's Avatar
redpepper redpepper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,661
Default cheating-poly; what's the difference?

I recently wrote elsewhere (right here) about how cheating is not poly to me and how frustrating it is that people who identfy as poly use cheating as a way of justifying their actions. As if they can shrug off cheating by saying they are poly. Cheating sites think they can say they are polyamorous sites as a result. It has become so common in the mainstream world that poly, and the ethics around it that I know and strive for are being bastardized. Very frustrating I find to be working towards something I consider noble, only to find others working towards giving it, what I consider, a bad name by cheating.

At one point I didn't identify as poly for this reason (and others). Then I decided that I admired the ethics of MOST poly people around me and wanted to be a part of THAT instead. To me its very important to divide cheating from poly. Poly to me is a way of being inside oneself that can cause people to cheat as a behaviour, but poly is not the behaviour of cheating itself. Thoughts?
__________________
Anyone want to be friends on Facebook?
Send me your name via PM
My blog

Last edited by redpepper; 10-29-2011 at 09:06 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-29-2011, 08:26 PM
marksbabygirl marksbabygirl is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Squamish, BC
Posts: 790
Default

To me, cheating has always been breaking the boundaries that were set as a part of our relationship.

For some, that could be looking at porn.
For some, that could be flirting with someone.
For some, that could be physical intimacy
For some, that could be emotional intimacy.

It depends on what boundaries you have in each relationship.
__________________
Some believe in destiny, and some believe in fate
I believe that happiness is something we create


My Journey to Health and Fitness
My Journey as a Widow

Jane
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-29-2011, 11:33 PM
BrigidsDaughter's Avatar
BrigidsDaughter BrigidsDaughter is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 822
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by marksbabygirl View Post
To me, cheating has always been breaking the boundaries that were set as a part of our relationship.

For some, that could be looking at porn.
For some, that could be flirting with someone.
For some, that could be physical intimacy
For some, that could be emotional intimacy.

It depends on what boundaries you have in each relationship.
I'd have to say mutually agreed upon boundaries; especially the in regards to porn. I hear so many people saying they consider their SO watching porn to be cheating, but I don't believe that it is, unless the couple had a mutually agreed upon boundary of no porn.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-29-2011, 11:54 PM
marksbabygirl marksbabygirl is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Squamish, BC
Posts: 790
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrigidsDaughter View Post
I'd have to say mutually agreed upon boundaries; especially the in regards to porn. I hear so many people saying they consider their SO watching porn to be cheating, but I don't believe that it is, unless the couple had a mutually agreed upon boundary of no porn.
I'm pretty sure that's just what I said...
__________________
Some believe in destiny, and some believe in fate
I believe that happiness is something we create


My Journey to Health and Fitness
My Journey as a Widow

Jane
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-30-2011, 12:24 AM
BrigidsDaughter's Avatar
BrigidsDaughter BrigidsDaughter is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 822
Default

I didn't see anything about the boundaries having to be agreed upon in your post and I think that is where alot of people get caught up. They have personal boundaries that they want in their relationship, but they only bring it up once their partner crosses their boundary and then they accuse them of cheating. I've seen it here too, that people may not know that it is a boundary until it is too late and then they end up paying for it.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-30-2011, 01:29 AM
Chimera Chimera is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: New York
Posts: 66
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrigidsDaughter View Post
I didn't see anything about the boundaries having to be agreed upon in your post and I think that is where alot of people get caught up. They have personal boundaries that they want in their relationship, but they only bring it up once their partner crosses their boundary and then they accuse them of cheating. I've seen it here too, that people may not know that it is a boundary until it is too late and then they end up paying for it.
I think this is an important issue that you've hit on. There's often a lack of clarity around boundaries -- how one person understands a conversation about the relationship might be distinct from the other partner. Or one person has personal rules/boundaries that they don't really communicate to the other person, but assume that they're in agreement. There are times when the "cheating" is really a misunderstanding. I'm not romanticizing things or taking it lightly. I have serious issues with trust. I've been on both sides (if there are "sides" of this issue) -- been given time and chances and I've given that to others.

My partner and I are now working on creating written agreements because of some of the issues we've had in the past. Tristan Taormino suggests this in "Opening Up" and we think it might help really make desires and behaviors transparent.

I also think that leaving the door open to renegotiation can be a positive thing. I've learned the hard way that rigidity can stifle open communication, even if in the end, boundaries don't shift.

Oh and to the OP, in my mind, cheating is just cheating. I guess I see that stereotype linked to ideas of swinging and unicorn-hunting -- that's the image of what "poly" is. And, while I'm on the subject, I'm not fan of Mormonism (I'll leave those reasons aside), but it's ridiculous to me that people in polygamous relationships get arrested and charged with crimes.
__________________
"Love takes off masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within."James Baldwin

Last edited by Chimera; 10-30-2011 at 01:34 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-29-2011, 11:34 PM
lucky7's Avatar
lucky7 lucky7 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Nor Cal
Posts: 55
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by marksbabygirl View Post
To me, cheating has always been breaking the boundaries that were set as a part of our relationship.

For some, that could be looking at porn.
For some, that could be flirting with someone.
For some, that could be physical intimacy
For some, that could be emotional intimacy.

It depends on what boundaries you have in each relationship.
Exactly
__________________
37, M, married, 15 years, in a happy triad for the same amount of time. It's not always easy, but it sure is fun.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-31-2011, 03:14 PM
MonoVCPHG's Avatar
MonoVCPHG MonoVCPHG is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: In Redpepper's heart
Posts: 4,742
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
Poly to me is a way of being inside oneself that can cause people to cheat as a behaviour, but poly is not the behaviour of cheating itself. Thoughts?
In my opinion this is the best statement you have ever written Lilo. I think it is clear, very precise and reflects a valid point.
__________________

Playing the Game of Life with Monopoly rules.
Monogamy might just be in my genes

Poly Events All Over
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-31-2011, 03:24 PM
GroundedSpirit GroundedSpirit is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New England USA
Posts: 1,231
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
I recently wrote elsewhere (right here) about how cheating is not poly to me and how frustrating it is that people who identfy as poly use cheating as a way of justifying their actions.
Hey RP,

I wish everything could be as B/W.
I'm not one who can draw that hard line in the sand in many instances.

As we've seen so many examples of even just on this little forum, life is not always that simple. I've seen people who are obviously, truly, polyamorous but because of circumstances are - by what most would define - "cheating". Because they see no way out according to the "do the least harm" philosophy.

But on another note, I do agree with your overall sentiment that you also have a number of "abusers". And this too is just another unfortunate part of the human equation. Despite all the purest and best intentions, every group or movement has been 'tainted' by less that honest, ethical people. From the church to the government to the police dept. I only hope that most people are intelligent enough to make allowance for this fact also and not label the group by it's lowest member. It's a numbers game in the end. When the scales start to tip in the wrong direction - it's time to bail !

GS
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-01-2011, 08:23 PM
AutumnalTone AutumnalTone is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Kansas City Metro
Posts: 2,188
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redpepper View Post
I recently wrote elsewhere (right here) about how cheating is not poly to me ....

It's not just your thoughts on the matter. It's pretty cut and dried that cheating is not poly in any fashion. From Morning Glory Zell, herself:

In 1992, when the editors of the Oxford English Dictionary contacted Morning Glory Zell to ask for a formal definition and background of the word; part of her response was “The two essential ingredients of the concept of ‘polyamory’ are ‘more than one’ and ‘loving.’ That is, it is expected that the people in such relationships have a loving emotional bond, are involved in each other's lives multi-dimensionally, and care for each other. This term is not intended to apply to merely casual recreational sex, anonymous orgies, one-night stands, pick-ups, prostitution, ‘cheating,’ serial monogamy, or the popular definition of swinging as ‘mate-swapping’ parties."
__________________
When speaking of various forms of non-monogamy...it ain't poly if you're just fucking around.

While polyamory, open relationships, and swinging are all distinctly different approaches to non-monogamy, they are not mutually exlusive. Folks can, and some do, engage in more than one of them at a time--and it's all good.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
affairs, cheating

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 09:25 PM.