Do I speak up or butt out?

scarletzinnia

New member
I have a friendly acquaintance I will call Sam. Sam is involved in the early stages of a romantic, long-distance relationship with Lisa. I am also pretty good friends with Bill, one of Lisa's partners. Bill has revealed to me that his relationship with Lisa has been sexless for some years, and that furthermore, she is celibate with all her numerous partners, including her spouse. I do not know if she is asexual or has health issues, but it sounds like a combination of both, from the little Bill has told me.

I am 99 percent certain that Lisa has not revealed her celibacy to Sam. I am also 99 percent certain that Sam would not be pursuing this long-distance connection romantically, if at all, if he knew this.

I will not betray Bill's confidence in me, but I am wondering if there is any way to inspire Sam to ask Lisa questions that will help him avoid a worst-case scenario (say, him buying a very expensive plane ticket and traveling to see Lisa, without knowing that she intends their relationship to remain platonic)?

Of course, I suppose it is possible that Lisa is 1. lying to Bill and does have sexual relationships with her other partners, just not with him, or 2. that she is open to a sexual relationship with Sam even if she doesn't have one with her other partners. No way of knowing.

And yes, I know that this isn't my business and I should probably butt out. I just like Sam a lot and wondered if there was any way to help him avoid being hurt or disappointed, without being a busybody.
 
And yes, I know that this isn't my business and I should probably butt out. I just like Sam a lot and wondered if there was any way to help him avoid being hurt or disappointed, without being a busybody.

I'd butt out.

But for myself? Examine that bit. What's so horrible about witnessing Sam having to process hurt/disappointment? :confused:

Galagirl
 
GalaGirl, I tend to feel protective of people I like, and want to spare them pain if I can.

I guess I am also not a big fan of Lisa, she has been pretty nasty to at least one of her metamours, who is a good friend of mine.

The poly world can be too small sometimes.
 
GalaGirl, I tend to feel protective of people I like, and want to spare them pain if I can.

Yes, in your OWN relationship with Sam you could strive to not bring him pain. But you could trust that he can handle his life's problems and deal with his life's upsets/disappointments and deal with his other relationships. Healthy boundaries.

What did she do to the metamour (your other friend) that was mean? Why kinda worried she will do this to your friend Sam and NOT sounding kinda worried she will do this/is doing this to your friend Bill?

Is this about envy? You say you like him a lot -- is it that Lisa (someone you dislike) is getting attention from Sam (someone you like a lot) and you would like more of his time and attention yourself as a friend or as more? :confused:

I'm sorry you struggle, but really it's his business who he dates. Even if he dates people you do not like. :eek:

Galagirl
 
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MYOB...

Keep your nose out of relationships that are not your own.
 
I also wouldn't get in the middle of it.

Choosing not to have sex is her right. Relationships don't ALWAYS include sex, and people should NEVER assume they're going to get it. If Sam cares about Lisa and wants to visit her, he should do that. Regardless of whether or not they will/won't have sex.

I would be a bit concerned that Bill finds it appropriate to mention that information to you unless it's something Lisa makes public. That is her private life he is blabbing about. If he's unhappy with the lack of sex in his relationship with Lisa, he could be purposefully trying to plant a seed of discontent between Lisa and Sam in the first place.

Sounds like there could be some shady motives and way too much convolution for me, personally. I'd butt out and just be there to support the people I care about when they need me.
 
It is hearsay, and not apppropriate nor ethical to repeat it. Leave her alone. You don't know (nor need to know) what your friend gains from his communications with her. If it turns out that he wants to bang her and she tells him he can't, I am sure he'll be able to take care of himself. It certainly wouldn't be the first occasion in history where a man wanted sex and couldn't get it, for goodness sakes. And you don't need to try to steer his relationships in a direction you think they should go. It seems quite mean-spirited to me, to even consider repeating such gossip just because you dislike the chick. I think a bit of maturity on your part, and less need to control, is in order.
 
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Re (from scarletzinnia):
"I tend to feel protective of people I like, and want to spare them pain if I can."

Well that's perfectly understandable, I'm sure most of us feel the same way. But, alas, sometimes we can't spare them the pain of some particular situation. Although we can still be there for them with a listening ear and shoulder to cry on if they should need that.

Technically, you could inform Sam of what Bill had said. But then you'd be participating in gossip and I think you've already decided not to do that. So, then, what can you do?

Re (from OP):
"I am wondering if there is any way to inspire Sam to ask Lisa questions that will help him avoid a worst-case scenario?"

Goodness, how would you do that? That would be quite an acrobatic feat as far as verbal communications go.

Given your general dislike of Lisa, I suppose you could argue that you'd worry for anyone who'd get involved with her -- fearing for them without specifically knowing why. In which case you could tell Sam, "Just be careful, okay? I don't know if I trust this Lisa person."

And even saying that much puts us in a moral gray area. So the point is, I can't think of much of a way you can help Sam without compromising your own ethics. You know, even if he gets burned, he'll learn wisdom from it. Wisdom is a good thing.

I know that's not much help, but there it is FWIW.
Sympathetically,
Kevin T.
 
You know what I'm going to say and I think you starting this thread is indicative of your greater need to control everyone and everything.
 
Multiple users told me to ignore london ages ago, and I didn't, but her negativity and hostilty (which I don't understand since I certainly don't know her personally) has proven a bit much for me, so I just did.

For those of you who don't know how this works, you just go to the User CP tab in the upper left-hand corner, go to "Settings and Options," then click on "Edit Ignore List." From there you can add a name to your list. Once you do so, they can comment on your posts but you won't be able to see their comments. So it works best to only do this to people when you don't give a crap what they have to say.
 
Don't... but in the end its up to you

Hi...

Honestly I understand... I would also worry that a friend might get hurt. But even if I am not contemplating any subconscious processes that might be driving your thoughts, beyond those of simple affection - not wanting a friend to get hurt because you will feel his pain or his grief will affect you - (this is my concept of altruism - I am sorry if it is disturbing, but at least it is very honest and straightforward) I would avoid interfering.

If you are friends with him (I have a hard time with the notion or property when it comes to people - like in "his" friend) then you will be ready to help him if he gets hurt... but to relay information of which you are not sure of just because they might be right and they might be hurtful for him in the future feels kind off like the USA making war against Iraq because of mass destruction weapons that never existed after all and that, having existed, might never have been used...

In the end, because this might not be correct, you might even ruin your friendship (or at least scar it) with no need... Don't... but in the end its up to you ;)
 
Thanks, Kevin, for your support. I hadn't really thought about this being a potential learning experience for Sam, but I suppose it will be if things go as badly as I suspect they will. That is something anyway.

AlwaysGrowing, I don't think Bill is even aware that I am friendly with Sam, so I don't think he was trying to sabotage Sam and Lisa by sharing what he shared with me.

Galagirl, I did ask Bill how he is handling Lisa being celibate. He said it is very hard for him. But he loves her, so he sticks with the relationship even though he isn't getting some of his needs met. Fortunately for him, he does have two other loving relationships where I believe he does get those needs met. This is one of the things I like about polyamory.
 
Many people said the very same as me yet the OP chose to only be offended by me. Weird.
 
Nice

So... I thinks lost some of it in the middle, probably.

I am happy to see things seem to be moving on. Poly is great because certain self imposed responsibilities stop existing and there is less suffering from those...

Perhaps it is something in the way you express yourself, london, the tone, the words used and not so much the contents? I don't know... just shooting in the dark here.

Anyway, scarletzinnia, I hope things work out well.

Cheers and much love :)
 
Probably due to my absolute refusal to enable or validate harmful, intrusive and/or oppressive behaviours. Personally, I feel "butt out" and "mind your own business" to be a little on the harsh side, but the OP obviously sees it differently.

Either way, I hope she leaves them alone to enjoy whatever relationship they want to have. The realist in me knows that she won't.
 
London you make valid points the problem is you refuse to consider other positions can be plausible or valid.

You have a very it is my way or the highway type attitude and have no clue when to step away and just agree to disagree. You tend to come across as trying to brow beat someone to accept your view point.
 
I could just as much say the same about other people who care more about saying why they think I'm wrong than sharing their opinions of the Op. Most threads outline a situation and ask for opinions. I find it bizarre when someone asks me to interpret a situation and give my thoughts on it and then they proceed to tell me that what I think about that situation is wrong. How can it be wrong? It's my thoughts on that situation. It only leads me to believe that what people generally want are opinions that validate the Op's position (and often general consensus too) and I can't promise to do that.

However, in this thread, I gave one comment amongst many similar ones and that post was highlighted by the OP. I can only assume that it's because I have proven not to be the source of validation she seeks and she finds that, in itself, antagonistic.
 
See to me *"]think you starting this thread is indicative of your greater need to control everyone and everything" sound more like a Personal attack than sharing your opinion what she should do.
 
Because she knows how I'd answer her question about what she should do. Butt out. The only difference in this thread is that mostly everyone agrees. I did mention that she would know my answer and I do believe that the reason she has to ask this is because she does have a propensity to control other people. That's what I've gathered from what she has said elsewhere. I've said it there too and I'm simply highlighting that this thread is another example of that. As I said, the only difference is that other people agree that not butting out and/or finding it overly difficult to allow others to have their own relationships (and make their own mistakes) is a problematic behaviour.
 
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