Need advice please!!!!

Hrnycple

New member
Hi all,

My husband and I have been in the swinging lifestyle off and on for about 7 years. When we met we talked about our fantasies and discovered that he liked the idea of being a voyeur and I liked the idea of being watched. In all honesty I thought it would just stay as a hot fantasy that we talked about. Slowly, my husband wanted me to sleep with another guy. It took me years to be comfortable with the idea. I wanted to be sure that we had a rock solid marriage and that we were doing this for the right reasons.We started off slow, some hits, some misses. Then I fell pregnant with our first child and we took a break.

After having my child, I had difficulty getting back into the lifestyle. My husband was not happy with me, I felt different. It was so hard for me to get that confidence back, but I wanted to and I knew it would make my husband happy if we got back into the lifestyle. So after 4 years we made a decision to revisit the lifestyle.

Here is where the story turns. Turns out, my husband wanted to see me with a black man. This took some time for me to be ok with, but I found out quickly that black guys are very very very attracted to me. And so I agreed that if I was attracted to the guy I would sleep with him. I have now been with quite a few black guys and it is fun. The problem is, my husband has suddenly turned on me. He says he is not jealous or anything but he is furious at me for being with two guys that he believes I had feelings for. It is affecting our marriage. I am upset because I was ok with NOT swinging and my fears of him turning against me have come true! He is upset because he thinks I am.... I don't even know what... In love with these guys? Which I am not! I am completely committed to my husband. I love him and was only open to this lifestyle BECAUSE of him! Admittedly the two guys he refers to I did have a friendship with. But never in a million years did I ever want more than hot sex with them. One of them had problems keeping it up, and my husband got mad about that. We bent over backwards for this guy, I even met him alone, because he said that is the only way he would be comfortable. We are both mad about that, but my husband blames me and solely me for this mess! I have SINCE cut off all contact with these guys.

I have told my husband we can stop the swinging. I have told my husband that he can go sleep with another woman that he wants. I don't care! I just want our marriage to be ok! He will not listen to me. He remains angry at me and is constantly bringing everything up, rehashing things, questioning my motives and my fidelity to him. I am so frustrated and I cry all the time now. I can't function. I want our marriage to work! But I can't get through to my husband!!! He seems to think that I should be able to **** just any guy, that I shouldnt have to be attracted to them! Also, he used to complain that I never really go into ******* the other guys so I changed and made a real effort and now he thinks I am all obsessed and in love with these guys. WHICH I AM NOT!!! How do I convince him and fix all of this? I feel backed into a corner.

Please someone help me!!!
 
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Solo & marriage counseling is about the only advice I have that doesn't involve just breaking up. He obviously has a lot of issues going on that he isn't dealing with in a healthy way, and I find it unlikely he's going to calm down and figure out what is actually bothering him without it.
 
I will assume good intent despite the moniker so... I agree with counseling!

Has he told you what he needs from you behavior wise to help him through his jealousy? Is he wanting to work through his jealousy and let it go? Could this help? Page 5 and page 6 things?

http://www.practicalpolyamory.com/images/Jealousy_Updated_10-6-10.pdf

This may be hard to hear. I apologize. :(

But you have a very controlling sounding spouse. Who does not view you as a PERSON but as a sex show producing THING. Those "sex shows" are for HIM to voyeur for HIS pleasure. Never mind your wants and needs as a person in there.

  • After having my child, I had difficulty getting back into the lifestyle. My husband was not happy with me, I felt different. (No consideration for new mom? New baby needs?)
  • He seems to think that I should be able to (have sex with) just any guy, that I shouldn't have to be attracted to them. (You are a sex machine he can turn on and off for his enjoyment?)
  • He used to complain that I never really go into (having sex with) the other guys (for his better viewing pleasure?) so I changed and made a real effort. Now he thinks I am all obsessed and in love with these guys. (Because that would put things OUT of his control?)
  • One of them had problems keeping it up, and my husband got mad about that.

Erectile dysfunction from "performance anxiety" is common enough in swinging. But your DH does not care -- he gets "mad" because he's not getting his sex show? Then the other guy is also not a person. The other guy is a THING too. I wonder if you meeting the one fellow ALONE is part of why your husband is having jealousy now? Because it was outside of his control?

This is a huge red flag to me. Is there other controlling behaviors that he does to you? I hope not. This is bad enough. :(

Please get yourself to counseling. And if it isn't moving to a healthier relationship? Leave. Remember you have a kid to protect and provide for.

I am sorry you are experiencing thing.

Galagirl
 
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I think you have stated your side of this very well here. Invite him to read it and maybe he will "get" where you're coming from.

He has no right to be angry, it seems. If anything, you are the one who has every right to be pissed off as hell at him - you felt pressured into it and did it to please him and now he is slapping you in the face with it and punishing you. It sounds like something triggered his reaction. (And now you know that it is better to stay true to yourself and not compromise your integrity and what you really want - or don't want - just to appease someone).

Therapy or counseling does sound like another good step to take.
 
Thank you for your thoughts and advice. I would like to seek therapy or counseling. My husband is reluctant as he does not think there are therapists out there that support the lifestyle?

Can someone please recommend a good counselor? We are in the PA area.


My husband is a really great guy. He is a good husband and father and in other aspects of our life he is wonderful. We are just having problems with this side of our marriage. We all have our issues (trust me, I have my share of issues!!!) , and I know he is no exception, it is just difficult convincing him that I am on his side and want to work this out. Am I fighting a losing battle?


Thank you again for your help.
 
I am the husband referred to in the original post. I do believe that there are two sides to every story which is why I posted my own account of the situation. Contrary to what everyone has posted in reply to the thread, I really am a thoughtful person that is interested in having a great relationship. I am interested in objective opinions. That is why I posted my side of the story because I think there were some important details missing from the story. These types of relationships require open and honest communication. I appreciate your feedback.
 
One spouse makes a thread. The other makes a thread. Both threads tell pretty much the same thing. No real shocking reveal of important details having been omitted. But one spouse clearly isn't comfortable with the other having their own voice on the matter.

What would you call that?
 
One of the things that has come up for DH and I is the difference between how women tend to experience sexuality and how men do. Men tend to see sex as more of an act than women do, and women tend to want (or even sometimes need) more of a connection person-to-person with their partner to have a fulfilling sexual experience. Of course, there are many exceptions on both sides, so I don't mean to put genders into strict boxes, but understanding the difference can help partners communicate.

Perhaps Hrnycple's desire to connect with her partner(s) is interpreted by mrblueeyes as being more meaningful and threatening than it really is. A man might not need this connection in a strictly sexual relationship, and so may find this need hard to understand.

mrblueeyes - think about it this way: you could have a wild sexual relationship with a woman without wanting to leave your wife for her, right? Similarly, your wife may well be able to enjoy an emotional or intellectual relationship with a man without being "in love" with him or wanting to leave you for him.

That said, lying about sexual hygiene practices is a REALLY. BIG. FREAKING. DEAL!

Suggesting individual and couple's counseling in this instance is like suggesting diet and exercise to a person who is trying to lose weight. It's not the sexiest solution, and no one likes to hear it, but it really really is going to be the best way to work things like this out. Really. Seriously.
 
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I had no intention of turning this into a blame game. I love my husband. He opened my eyes and mind to so many things. I was raised a very conventiOnal way. So this lifestyle was something new to me.

Yes it took me time to get comfortable with it. But I wasn't NOT open to it. If i came across that way in my original post, i apologize. It's just another way of thinking. I think I have come a long way when it comes to being open to the lifestyle despite being raised in a mono only household..

What I was hoping to get out of this was for some sound advice. I am looking for a alternative lifestyle counselor but it's slim pickings where we live.


I have no interest in leaving my husband or name calling him. I want to know how he feels. I want to work through this with him, with as little heart ache as possible. He is a great man who knows everything about me and we have a solid friendship and active sex life, as well as the most amazing child in the world.

In my opinion we need help communicating in this area of our marriage. It's difficult. I don't necessarily need validation for my feelings. I just want to focus on working this out. And what I can do to nourish our marriage.
 
I responded in your husband's thread, where even in his telling of events he comes off as controlling, so I don't think we're name calling, I think we're looking at the behaviors that are presented as objectively as possible with the limited information we have.

I'm having trouble reconciling what you just posted to what you originally posted, namely this part:

He will not listen to me. He remains angry at me and is constantly bringing everything up, rehashing things, questioning my motives and my fidelity to him. I am so frustrated and I cry all the time now. I can't function. I want our marriage to work! But I can't get through to my husband!!! He seems to think that I should be able to **** just any guy, that I shouldnt have to be attracted to them! Also, he used to complain that I never really go into ******* the other guys so I changed and made a real effort and now he thinks I am all obsessed and in love with these guys. WHICH I AM NOT!!! How do I convince him and fix all of this? I feel backed into a corner.

Please someone help me!!!

It isn't uncommon for people to see things different when they're upset than when they're calmer. The question is which one is the more accurate picture? Do you over-dramatize when you're upset? Or do you over-rationalize and justify things when you are calmer, and your true feelings come out when you're upset? I'm not saying one is right or wrong, I'm saying that YOU need to be honest with yourself about what's going on and what you personally can change. You can't change him. You can't change his behaviors nor how he communicates. IF he changes, great, but all you can do is make the best decisions possible for YOURSELF, YOUR health (both mental and physical), and your child.
 
I am looking for a alternative lifestyle counselor but it's slim pickings where we live.

Not to belabor the point, but I don't think you need to restrict yourself to alternative lifestyle counselors. When I sought counseling, I was actually looking for specifically a Christian counselor - so I thought it would be almost impossible to find one that was open to my poly lifestyle choice. It was not hard at all. Just start with the first counselor or therapist you find near you, and ask them directly whether they have experience with swingers or alternative sexualities (whatever you feel best describes your situation). If they say no, ask if they can refer you to someone who does.
 
Thank you. This is very helpful. Yes, I think I get over emotional and over react when upset. Yes, I think I regroup later and analyse a little more. Although I struggle with what I truly think and feel because my focus is and always has been, to be "good, liked, accepted, agreeable". The fact that we are at odds over this completely stresses me out and upsets me. I ALWAYS want to be number one in my husbands eyes. Whether that is right or wrong, I don't know, but it is how I feel. I reiterate that my main goal is to work this all out. I am committed to that and appreciate everyone's views and opinions.
 
I reiterate that my main goal is to work this all out. I am committed to that and appreciate everyone's views and opinions.

That is your goal. Is that his goal too? And you both want to try to work it out in what way? What are your proposed solutions? What are his proposed solutions?

What was both of your reactions to reading

http://www.practicalpolyamory.com/images/Jealousy_Updated_10-6-10.pdf

together? Anything useful there?

The tactics list? Anything useful there?

http://speakoutloud.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Tactics-Murphy-2010.pdf

Because you cannot solve behaviors and change them if you are not willing to talk about them and identify them. Maybe you read both things and nothing rings a bell. That's great. You know what it is NOT, and that could be reassuring to both. That's half way there -- now on to finding what it IS.

I'm certainly not wishing you to be mistreated or abused. But if BEHAVIORS you guys choose to do to each other are less than trustworthy, sound controlling, sound "off" in some fashion... gotta be willing to acknowledge that it could be seen as "off" by other people even if that is hard to do. :(

I am not there. I am not in this relationship. If I were? Some of this stuff would make me go "ACK!" and raise red flags. You also see it is "off" otherwise you would not bother to post to begin with. Maybe it isn't loud enough volume for you to raise a red flag -- but you are at least raising some color flag. It does not sound like a green "all is good to go here!" kind of flag. :(

That's all I'm saying.

I'm saying that YOU need to be honest with yourself about what's going on and what you personally can change. You can't change him. You can't change his behaviors nor how he communicates. IF he changes, great, but all you can do is make the best decisions possible for YOURSELF, YOUR health (both mental and physical), and your child.

I have to agree with ThatGirlInGray. I don't know either of you, so I'm not trying to be mean here. In his post he sounds a touch controlling too. So why is he not "secure" with your marriage?

Now "lying and no barrier sex" on your end was not cool (if this is how it played out. You do not mention this in your own post.) That kind of behavior does not cultivate an environment of "Trust" and "Secure" for the marriage. Have there been other things you do not mention? That would lead to him being nervous and controlling in the marriage because trust is shaky?

But what about before that? Why lie about it to begin with? Was it because he himself doesn't create an environment of "trust and secure" for you? Because he keeps asking you to cut off communication with lovers you enjoy? If you find another one that you enjoy, he is going to do what? Ask you to cut them out too? Is this the expectation/agreement in the marriage regarding "outside lovers?"

Could you both find a better way to create an environment of "trust and secure" for each other in the marriage with a counselor's aid?

Are you guys finding that he's more up for "swinging" and you are more up for "polyamory" in your open relationship model?

What model are you guys wanting to be in? What are the expectations of each other in that model? Of yourselves? Are these things reasonable and realistic? Doable?

GG
 
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