Quad Family

My husband's and my mother-in-laws allergies always get worse when they move to a new place. They need time to build a tollerance. I'm told a tsp of locally grown honey each day helps. I bought some, but husband too stubborn to use it :rolleyes:, so I can't attest to it. Tastes good though.
 
Thanks, I had heard that but totally forgot about it. He is religiously doing low-carb, so I'll see if I can talk him into some honey.
 
What an interesting two weeks it's been.

Last weekend, we all spent the night at a friend's cabin, and we spent some time reconnecting. I thought it was great, even if later in the week I felt a twinge as I watched Sunday and Asha cuddling and wished that I could cuddle, too.

This weekend, we took the entire large family to a corn maze. It's an all-day event in an out-of-town location, with the eight of us packed into one car for hours on end. Considering the stress a trip like that can put on people, it was a really lovely trip! Even Moose was good all day long, allowing small children to climb all over him and keeping a generally good attitude the whole time. The only time we had a problem with his attitude was when I had to talk to him about playing too rough with his sister, and then he just took himself to the side until he was feeling less angry. I was so proud that he was being so mature. Monkey was a huge help with Rockstar, keeping an eye on him so the adults could finish lunch and going on rides with him. I enjoyed watching Asha and Monkey bonding--Monkey really looks up to Asha. Monkey snapped up the pumpkin that Asha picked out for her. Much fun was had by all, I think. :) I'm happy and hopeful that Moose can continue to feel more like a part of the large family, and stop keeping himself separate. He doesn't think that he needs the extra support, but I see it as a huge help for his future. Easy worked really hard this weekend to pay attention to me and to make sure I felt loved.

A downside to my weekend was that I continue to feel like I don't fit in this dynamic--Asha and Easy are so alike, and it usually feels like Sunday works hard not to have anything in common with me. Sunday and Asha belong together, I know, but sometimes I feel like Easy and Asha belong together, too. I also keep having dreams that no one wants me in the group. I don't feel like a part of the whole. I don't exactly know what to do about it or how to fix it.

I tried to flirt with Sunday a bit, only to be pushed away. I don't even know if he knows he's doing it. But I did have a few minutes of wondering why I even tried. I mean, I spent so many years of my marriage to Easy being pushed away. Putting up with it for so long damaged my self-esteem and made me want to walk out on the marriage. Why am I signing up for more of the same? I need to stop hitting my head on the brick wall, but I don't seem to be able to stop myself. Maybe I'm doing it because giving up on Sunday feels like giving up on the large family. Maybe I just desperately want to believe him when he tells me he loves me.
 
A downside to my weekend was that I continue to feel like I don't fit in this dynamic--Asha and Easy are so alike, and it usually feels like Sunday works hard not to have anything in common with me. Sunday and Asha belong together, I know, but sometimes I feel like Easy and Asha belong together, too. I also keep having dreams that no one wants me in the group. I don't feel like a part of the whole. I don't exactly know what to do about it or how to fix it.

Have you talked to Sunday about this. He may be feeling the same and isn't quite sure how to deal with it either.

I tried to flirt with Sunday a bit, only to be pushed away. I don't even know if he knows he's doing it. But I did have a few minutes of wondering why I even tried. I mean, I spent so many years of my marriage to Easy being pushed away. Putting up with it for so long damaged my self-esteem and made me want to walk out on the marriage. Why am I signing up for more of the same? I need to stop hitting my head on the brick wall, but I don't seem to be able to stop myself. Maybe I'm doing it because giving up on Sunday feels like giving up on the large family. Maybe I just desperately want to believe him when he tells me he loves me.

He probably doesn't realize he is doing it. I would start by believing what he has told you. However, you may need to tell him very bluntly what you need, when and why. Sometimes being subtle just doesn't work, especially if he is wrapped up in his own insecurities. If you need to be held, just walk up to him and tell him "watching them is making me want to crawl in a hole, could you hold me for a while" or something like that. Now you have given him something to fix.
 
Talks with Sunday are incredibly difficult. Before we became a quad, it was easier, but now it's more like he's trying to run away. I have no idea what to do. Our talks usually start out with me saying something like, I need to talk to you about X. He says okay. I talk and talk and talk. He says something like, no that's not what I intended or I'll try to do that. I walk away not really knowing what he wanted and feeling like he'd say anything to shut me up.

We both communicate better via e-mail, but getting him to reply to an e-mail is like pulling teeth, since we became a quad. I miss the days when I could actually talk to him. :(

Here's the thing with physical intimacy--he's terrified that someone will see him, so very little affection happens where we can be seen. Being private doesn't happen all that often, and usually it feels like he's trying *not* to be alone with me. Asha says that's normal for him. She must be much, much stronger than I am.

I'm trying very, very hard to trust what he says rather than what I'm seeing. It's not an easy thing for me, and I'm waaaaay past my comfort zone. I do keep pushing that limit, though--today is just a down day for me, I guess, and it feels harder. I hadn't realized how down I was. I think it's because I keep dreaming that no one wants me and it's wearing on me.
 
Talks with Sunday are incredibly difficult. Before we became a quad, it was easier, but now it's more like he's trying to run away. I have no idea what to do. Our talks usually start out with me saying something like, I need to talk to you about X. He says okay. I talk and talk and talk. He says something like, no that's not what I intended or I'll try to do that. I walk away not really knowing what he wanted and feeling like he'd say anything to shut me up.

We both communicate better via e-mail, but getting him to reply to an e-mail is like pulling teeth, since we became a quad. I miss the days when I could actually talk to him. :(

My husband zones out and only hears about the first two words I say (found this out in a counceling session):rolleyes:. Just to get information out of him for an event we are both attending, I have to play 20 questions. I have gone to writing in a blog, just so I can keep him up todate on what I'm feeling. It has been working pretty good, although it might take him a couple days to formulate a question on something I wrote, he is reading it and processing the information, but at his speed. He is supposed to start one also, but has been putting it off.

I would say continue to e-mail, even if he doesn't reply, but remember to e-mail the good stuff too. Introverts don't do well with all negative information.

What does he say about the change in the way you guys communicate (or don't communicate)?
 
Well, there's a reason he stopped communicating with me. He handled NRE poorly, and experienced a lot of marital problems because of it. He (rightly) took some time apart, and I agreed to back off while he figured things out. We've just never managed to regain that closeness. He doesn't seem to notice. Maybe I just imagined that we were that close. :/
 
A downside to my weekend was that I continue to feel like I don't fit in this dynamic--Asha and Easy are so alike, and it usually feels like Sunday works hard not to have anything in common with me. Sunday and Asha belong together, I know, but sometimes I feel like Easy and Asha belong together, too. I also keep having dreams that no one wants me in the group. I don't feel like a part of the whole. I don't exactly know what to do about it or how to fix it.

I tried to flirt with Sunday a bit, only to be pushed away. I don't even know if he knows he's doing it. But I did have a few minutes of wondering why I even tried. I mean, I spent so many years of my marriage to Easy being pushed away. Putting up with it for so long damaged my self-esteem and made me want to walk out on the marriage. Why am I signing up for more of the same? I need to stop hitting my head on the brick wall, but I don't seem to be able to stop myself. Maybe I'm doing it because giving up on Sunday feels like giving up on the large family. Maybe I just desperately want to believe him when he tells me he loves me.

God-some days I SO FUCKING UNDERSTAND THIS!
WHY hit my head on the SAME DAMN BRICK WALL when it only seems to get harder with each hit (maybe my head is getting softer)?

I have no helpful answer-but I sympathise and offer hugs.

I am having some similar emotions and it's so disappointing!
 
Here's the thing with physical intimacy--he's terrified that someone will see him, so very little affection happens where we can be seen. Being private doesn't happen all that often, and usually it feels like he's trying *not* to be alone with me. Asha says that's normal for him. She must be much, much stronger than I am.

I don't think it's that Asha is stronger than you. I don't know why-I just don't think that's true. I can't explain it-can't give you reasons or logical explanations either.....

GG used to worry about being seen. Made me NUTS NUTS NUTS. He still has moments-but we're working a step at a time. He's comfortable now with me holding his arm. That's something that I just insisted on and he's gotten used to it.
I kiss him on the cheek as well-but the deep, passionate kissing is reserved for the house still. One day-but not today.
BUT-having put in place the rule that I flat will NOT walk without holding an arm was one of the best moves I made. It helped that I walk that way with Maca-it just comes natural for him, his dad does it too. But that was the key to me feeling more comfortable in public becuase even if GG is feeling distant, that one link is there and so I can be sympathetic to his discomfort knowing that he's giving me that.
:)
 
God-some days I SO FUCKING UNDERSTAND THIS!
WHY hit my head on the SAME DAMN BRICK WALL when it only seems to get harder with each hit (maybe my head is getting softer)?

I have no helpful answer-but I sympathise and offer hugs.

I am having some similar emotions and it's so disappointing!

Here is a man hint (or two)...;)...one possible answer, if a guy is refusing being flirted with, its because he has something bottled up that is overpowering the sex side. Sometimes there is something resentful or hidden that they just can't verbalize yet. Pushing or flirting becomes annoying ;)

That or...everyone always assumes the guy will be "on"...that becomes a lot of stress...sometimes we aren't. It happens, honestly. But it is hard to say "sorry sweety *I* am not in the mood for sex"...because thats against the rules. Regardless of what you say, or how you mean it...that belief might be in our heads.

In both cases, accept it (wow thats harsh :D). When girls have headaches or want to shower or whatever the reason, we aren't allowed to bash our heads against the wall. Its just accepted when a woman can say no...but its always a battle when the guys do it ;)

Anyways, jsut putting the guys potential perspective potentially. I have been in both situations above.
 
If he had a hard time handling NRE but is getting over it, hang in there. My OSO also had a hard time and almost ended our foursome. While he was all angsty about control in his marriage, I was sitting on the sidelines silently screaming, "Hey, dumbass, I am head over heels for you!"

You know him. Does your gut tell you he was being sincere when he told you he loves you? Circumstances may whisper otherwise, but sometimes we have to stand firm in what we don't "see."
 
Wow, a lot of great replies! I am feeling much better today, and have taken some of the suggestions that I saw.

@SNeaCail--I like your suggestion about e-mails. I sent one today, just telling him I thought he was doing a great job planning an anniversary thing for Asha. It made me feel more at peace.

@LR--hugs back. I like your suggestion about taking an arm, I think I will try to see if there is just *one* action that Sunday would be okay with me doing in public. He's usually okay with hugs, but I can't just walk up and hug him whenever I want, without it looking odd. If I can get him to just let me touch his arm, for example, I think that would help me.

@Ariakas--I get what you're saying, and I'll definitely keep it in mind. But Sunday and I haven't had a sexual relationship for a year, so I can't imagine that he feels pressured to have sex with me when I flirt. Can he? I don't really flirt an awful lot, just within my foursome.

@Jade--The conclusion I've come to is, I don't really trust my gut. I am *telling* myself to trust what he says, it doesn't come naturally. But I'm working on taking deep breaths and believing what my loved ones say, and not trying to second guess based on how I see them behaving.

On contemplation, things are better now between us than they were a month ago. I'm still frustrated, but I think working on believing what he says and more *patience* (sigh) and just accepting things as they are will help.
 
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Wow, a lot of great replies! I am feeling much better today, and have taken some of the suggestions that I saw.

@SNeaCail--I like your suggestion about e-mails. I sent one today, just telling him I thought he was doing a great job planning an anniversary thing for Asha. It made me feel more at peace.

@LR--hugs back. I like your suggestion about taking an arm, I think I will try to see if there is just *one* action that Sunday would be okay with me doing in public. He's usually okay with hugs, but I can't just walk up and hug him whenever I want, without it looking odd. If I can get him to just let me touch his arm, for example, I think that would help me.

@Ariakas--I get what you're saying, and I'll definitely keep it in mind. But Sunday and I haven't had a sexual relationship for a year, so I can't imagine that he feels pressured to have sex with me when I flirt. Can he? I don't really flirt an awful lot, just within my foursome.

@Jade--The conclusion I've come to is, I don't really trust my gut. I am *telling* myself to trust what he says, it doesn't come naturally. But I'm working on taking deep breaths and believing what my loved ones say, and not trying to second guess based on how I see them behaving.

On contemplation, things are better now between us than they were a month ago. I'm still frustrated, but I think working on believing what he says and more *patience* (sigh) and just accepting things as they are will help.

Personally, you sound like the strongest one in the group. The others are getting their needs met more freely from the sound of it while you are struggling to find your own and yet, you're still putting in the work. It makes me wonder if the others would have the same fortitude if they were in your shoes.
 
Personally, you sound like the strongest one in the group. The others are getting their needs met more freely from the sound of it while you are struggling to find your own and yet, you're still putting in the work. It makes me wonder if the others would have the same fortitude if they were in your shoes.

:)
 
Thank you. I'm honestly a little stunned by the idea that I could be a strong person--I feel weak and whiny.

I'm having some computer problems this week, so I was forced to steal Moose's computer. This weekend was a fabulous one for my little family. We had a birthday get-together for Sunday, and the next day we drove *forever* to help with a horse rescue. And Moose came along for all of it! He wasn't pleasant all day long, but he was pleasant enough for most of the time, and he self-regulated his temper. The only time he actually lost his temper was when someone else was rude to Rockstar. Moose jumped to the defense of Asha's baby! It was so hard for me to be a good parent and discourage the angry behavior when inside I was jumping for joy that my Moose seemed to be treating Rockstar like his family.

At the horse rescue, Moose jumped in and helped build fencing with his father and with Sunday. It was so good to see him bonding and being a part of the family. It feels like I've been holding my breath and now I finally get to breathe, though cautiously.

This upcoming weekend is going to be insane. We've been planning a tenth anniversary party for Asha and Sunday, and then of course there are all of the other things that people with children do on Halloween weekend.
 
We've been having a tough time lately. Last Friday was Asha's mother's birthday; Asha's mother passed away a little over 5 years ago. We didn't call her to check on her, and she was upset. Then I was upset that she didn't call if she needed to talk. Then Saturday we celebrated her anniversary with Sunday, and afterward Easy and I went to a party, assuming that she and Sunday had plans. But Asha wanted to go to the party with us, and got upset that we didn't invite her along--which of course she would have been more than welcome! So Halloween we had a fair amount of angry dialogue. We did get to take the kids out trick or treating, which was fun! We went in a large group that kept separating and going different directions, until finally, Monkey and Ocean had ditched us and there was a group of five adults with Rockstar. It was interesting to trick or treat with such a large group following around one little kid.

Everyone's been sick all week, including me, so I haven't seen anyone or done anything, and I'm feeling isolated.

Last Friday, we finally got Sunday to a munch for the local BDSM support group. I think it went well, but during the munch, Easy was holding and touching Asha, and so was Sunday. I was watching them, and suddenly I thought, This group is going to find out that I'm the only one that no one wants. It kind of came out of the blue, but it's been giving me trouble ever since, and tonight it's really bad. This group is the only place we're "out", and Sunday only touches me to hug me and kiss me when we say goodbye. Asha doesn't touch me either. I feel silly, but I can't seem to get over the absolute fear that everyone is going to realize that I'm unwanted.

Then Asha went to a meeting last night that I couldn't attend--if I hadn't felt like I was dying, I still had a school function I should have gone to--and suddenly I felt like I wasn't needed anymore. My goal was to get everyone involved so they could get their needs met, so Asha going without me was a good thing and completely normal, but now I feel like a total outcast.

I'm having a tough night, and this fear is unexpected. I don't know how to deal with it--it seems pretty irrational to be afraid that a group of acquaintances will think you're tainted because someone doesn't touch you in public. I can't really call anyone to talk because, really, I'm not out to a lot of people, and I've lost my voice. So here I am.
 
Sorrry its been such a rough week and you're struggling tonight as well.

We've had a lot of drama ourselves. :(

I'm thinking about you!
 
Thanks, LR. I'm thinking of you and sending good thoughts your way.

Not much time for the big family this weekend, so we got together for dinner at a restaurant last night. The kids were all snippy and tired, and the restaurant was loud and I have no voice, but all in all I think we had a good time. I put a lot of value in doing things as a family, so I was glad we at least had time for this. Sunday goes out of town for a week today, so Asha isn't looking forward to being alone. This is a tough week for me to spend a lot of time at her place, because it contains Monkey's birthday and a day trip out of town, but I'll try to show some support. She did say that she'd appreciate it if we could find time for her. Next weekend is her big surprise 40th birthday trip, which I hope to heaven goes well. Well, I don't know if she'd consider it a "big" trip, but it's a big deal for us. Thank goodness we put some money aside for this, or we would never have been able to afford it. It's also incredibly lucky that scheduling forced us to go a week before her actual birthday, because her father decided he would come visit for her birthday and we wouldn't have been able to go.

Monkey has decided that she doesn't want to do a big party for her birthday, which is a good thing considering that she's changed her mind so many times that I have nothing planned. At this point, it may be the weekend after Thanksgiving before I can get schedules to work out so she can have what she's actually asked for, which is to learn to play D&D with her closest friend. Who knew that trying to work out schedules for just two girls would be so hard? But it's Nutcracker season, and now that Monkey's en pointe she's learning new routines, and marching band is apparently a big time killer too. Monkey's friend doesn't have as many extra-curriculars, but she's the oldest child in a family of seven, so she has to work around everyone else's schedules, too. It's funny how having four adults to four kids actually makes life a little easier than two adults to five kids.

A member of our sub group asked Asha if we could come over as a poly family some time and watch movies--all eight of us. It's nice to be able to do things openly, but I hadn't considered yet whether I would be introducing the people I met through this group to my children. I like this other person just fine, so there's no concern there. I guess I was more afraid of what CPS might say if someone got nasty enough to call them on us. I was thinking that I could say, "There's absolutely no overlap, my children are not exposed to this." It's nonsense of course, because I wouldn't bring people into my life who would expose them to what I felt was inappropriate, but where we live, looking mainstream is everything. Do you look like a good parent? Then you've got nothing to fear. Do you look like a good parent but live an alternative lifestyle? Uh oh. We're already Pagan poly sex-positive Renaissance Festival ex-homeschoolers with a casual disregard for the established systems. I'm guessing that I'm going to follow Asha's lead in this, because honestly both of my kids are older and I think she's got more to lose than I do. I think if I'm accused of exposing my kids to inappropriate sexual ideas it's easier for me to say, "Uh, no I don't, just ask them" than it is if the kid is say, 5. (And at 16 with an internet connection on what seems like every device he owns, Moose keeps me hopping to make sure *he's* not exposing *himself* to inappropriate sexual material. Oh the talks we have had.)

I always ramble in these things, and I wonder if I'm writing anything that could possibly be of help to a polyfamily just embarking on their journey, but Daylight Savings Time has me up before the rest of the family so here we are.
 
I always ramble in these things, and I wonder if I'm writing anything that could possibly be of help to a polyfamily just embarking on their journey, but Daylight Savings Time has me up before the rest of the family so here we are.

I just got done reading through this from beginning to present, so I find this sentence ironic. I'm in the beginnings of a polyfamily and I find it extremely helpful! There's seven of us, no children yet to speak of-- we're only in our early twenties and dreaming. Apart from that, none of us are legally married just yet; Company and I are the first, and that's not until December. :D Ariel and Vegeta will be right behind us though, as soon as gay marriage comes around.

I sympathize a lot with the left out feeling. You mentioned that it's there even if you walk away from the group to do something else and hear them all laughing-- I feel that way a lot, too. We have a "communal bedroom" since five of us live together in a two-bedroom apartment, and I get very cranky if I go to bed by myself because I have to get up early and everyone else is playing a videogame or watching a movie. Or worse yet, I'll get paranoid about what they're doing that I can't hear; we started off a little bumpy because we handled NRE badly, and we've come a long way in the last couple weeks, but it's hard for me not to attempt to be controlling about it. Unfortunately, I don't have much better advice than LR's. If you want to be involved, you have to insert yourself. I couple this with another similar fear of yours-- what if I don't belong and I'm just being annoying? But once I do it, I feel better, involved, and when I talk openly to all my partners about it, they give me the assurance I need.

I'm glad that things seem to be looking up for you though, that you get to do so much together all the time. :)
 
Late post this week, I've been fighting depression and needed some space.

Last weekend we all went away with another couple for Asha's birthday. We rented a cabin at some hot springs. It was very nice--there's nothing quite like sitting in a hot pool while your hair freezes into icicles. Really! I was already having trouble with the depression, though, so I was quiet and withdrawn. Plus, I've been sick for weeks and I'm just run down and tired. There was a moment where Asha and Sunday were on the couch, and I announced to him that I was going to sit down next to him, and if he objected he should say so. He kind of mumbled something, so I sat next to him and put my head on his shoulder. I couldn't help feeling how uncomfortable he was, but I was tired and didn't have the energy to care. This is pretty typical of our interactions--I try to cuddle up to him and he cringes. I have since realized that this hurts me more than normal because this is how Easy treated me for so many years of our marriage, and I'm sick of feeling like a monster if I just want some affection. Easy is working on not treating me this way--and just this week he seems to have had an epiphany, because he's drastically better. Maybe seeing me feel miserable about Sunday and seeing it from an outside perspective is helping him see how his behavior affects me.

Easy got very drunk--not really his fault as a friend who brews keeps giving him beer and mead that's higher in alcohol content than Easy is used to. In his inebriated state he sparked a conversation between the four of us about how awful I felt, how unwanted and undesirable. I don't really feel like anything got resolved--well, really, I think I was the only sober one, so surprise surprise. Easy let slip that he felt like he was a failure because he's not meeting Asha's needs. That kind of hurt, a little. I considered for a time whether they would all be better off without me--couldn't figure out how to do that without negatively impacting the kids' lives. I just don't know how to balance everything.

I figured I'd had enough and told Sunday that I needed more from him. He confessed that he's running away from me. Ouch. He said that he's scared that he'll lose Asha, so sometimes he does avoid me. I don't even know what to do with that information. I told him that I needed him to stop acting like I'm a sexual predator, and that I'm not asking for sex, all I want is to be able to cuddle. He pointed out that he tries to make sure to hug me when we say goodbye. I told him I needed more touch. Asha pointed out that it was likely that I had no idea how he felt about me, because he's not communicating. He told me that he loved me.

I told Asha that I'd been avoiding touching her because she had said that she needed space. She said that she'd been taking the space when she needed it, and that I could feel free to touch her. That may be the only good thing that came out of that conversation.

I haven't spoken to either since. They have a guest, and I haven't been able to reach them by phone. I tried to keep this update honest but not emotional. I have trouble with depression, and this has not been my easiest week. I'm remembering to breathe, and taking it one step at a time. I've been talking so much that I swear Easy's ears are bleeding. Today is better than the days before it, at least.
 
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