Partial Poly Breakup?

RedQueen

New member
This might be complicated because lots of people and relational contexts, but please bear with me and feel free to ask questions for clarification.

I am married to my primary, P. Our relationship is semi-open, that is we both have veto power but we are not monogamous. Outside of our marriage I choose to be a relationship anarchist ("there need not be a formal distinction between sexual, romantic or platonic relationships" ie no labels or commitments). My husband and I live with three friends, K and A and J. K and A are engaged but non-monogamous, J is single. P and I have been intimate with K in the past and I am currently intimate with A. K also has a boyfriend in addition to her fiance, but that's pretty irrelevant.

We have a group of 4 friends who live together. E and K are best friends which is how we all met. F and E have been dating for 4 years, and they are both (somewhat functional) alcholics. B and S have been dating for several months. Both of these couples decided to become non-monogamous within the last few months.

After they opened up there relationship, I cautiously started seeing more of F. Like I said, no labels, but we did start becoming intimate, sleeping together, etc. Problem is, E has been talking about ending things with F for years, and now apparently sees this as an out. She has notoriously poor communication skills, and refuses to go to counseling with him. She also refuses to be the one to break up with him, but in the meantime is treating him terribly, saying hurtful things, giving him the silent treatment, and flirting with other people (pretty much every person in each of our houses except for my husband and I) during their conflicts. It recently got bad enough to the point where he was breaking from heartbreak and ended up moving out. It effected him by him cutting back on his alcohol use, but she has been drinking more and more every night. I'm worried for them both. I'm worried to possibly be caught in the middle, despite everybody involved assuring me I wont be and its not my fault. I'm worried how it looks from the outside. To some degree I know its my fault because I saw red flags from E, but followed my heart to F anyways.

Tensions are high in both houses, while people claim not to pick sides or faults in their breakup, it becomes obvious. My husband and I think E is acting like a child and has issues she is refusing to work through. We are worried about her frequent visits with our roommates causing problems down the line between them as well as between our house and F. K and T have chosen E, they talk and flirt on the phone every night until E passes out from alcohol. B and S both say they think F is being treated unfairly, but because they have to continue living with E and also because they are attracted to her, openly flirt with her in front of F while she gives him the silent treatment.


This whole thing is a mess, and I just want to do damage control without tangling myself up in anything. I hate the thought of F not visiting because the other people here make him uncomfortable. Not to mention we all have to be in K and A's wedding in six months. Any advice? Not on the past but on the present and future? I know where mistakes were made, I just want to know where to go from here.
 
Hi RedQueen,

You said F moved out; maybe you could limit your visits with F to wherever he's now living? I would be as low-profile about my relationship with F as possible, not talking about it at all if possible except perhaps with P as long as he can refrain from talking about it around others.

I would similarly avoid talking about E except again maybe with P if he can keep quiet about it around other people. In general you have a high-drama situation and my suggestion is reduce how much drama you have to experience as much as possible. This may mean reducing how much contact you have with all of the others (except P). If you can reduce it.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
I am sorry you struggle.

I think you could visit with F wherever F is currently living since he moved out. And invite him over to visit you if he feels comfortable doing so.

You could attend the wedding if this is a wedding you wish to attend.

And during these visits / wedding, you all could behave like adults.

If Eggplant (or others) want to behave foolishly, that's their choice.

It is not your responsibility to be "den mother" or something and make people behave or whatever. The "damages" being done are in layers where you are NOT.

  • You worry about E damaging (K and A) -- well, you are not E, K or A. Let them handle it.
  • You worry about E damaging (K +A's relationship with F) well, you are not E, K, A or F. Let them handle it.
  • K and T flirting with E every night not he phone -- not your business or your problem.
  • B and S flirting with E even though they think E treated F badly -- not your business or your problem

If their behavior makes YOU uncomfortable, you can ask them to please stop doing X behavior in front of you. If they do not? You could put some distance between you and the person that makes you uncomfortable.

You could also consider moving out to be away from the drama houses if this continues to be drama.

That way you are out of the line of fire and don't have to worry about being "caught in the middle" any more.

And you can visit with F at your new home how you please without worry that other people are going to make F feel unwelcome.

Galagirl
 
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Gold Cortinas

He's actually moved back in with his parents so its less optimal to hang out there.

Our houses are about 3 hours apart so we often spend weekends at each other's homes instead of driving 6 hours in a day. Our house is optimal hang out because it has extra bed and is bigger since its out of the city. No matter what I say or do, E will be visiting regularly which sucks. Its really difficult for me to get to where they live on my own because its very difficult for me to drive for long periods of time by myself, and everybody here is too busy to come with me.

I really don't want to leave F all alone or make him feel abandoned, its one of his big issues. They share all of their friends, so if people try to avoid him, he'll be pretty isolated which isn't great and could potentially cause more drama :/

And the wedding is between K and A, we are all members of the wedding party so it isn't optional.

Moving out is not an option whatsoever, we're in a lease and this is the only way we can all afford to live in our expensive area as students. Can't really reduce contact with people I'm living with lol.
 
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No matter what I say or do, E will be visiting regularly which sucks.

Why does it suck? You are not able to be civil?

I really don't want to leave F all alone or make him feel abandoned, its one of his big issues. They share all of their friends, so if people try to avoid him, he'll be pretty isolated which isn't great and could potentially cause more drama :/

Those are his feelings to manage. Not yours. I get that you pity him, but his emotional management is his job. Not yours. If this is about reducing your stress, you could remember that you do not exist to be other people's life raft.

And the wedding is between K and A, we are all members of the wedding party so it isn't optional.

It's always optional. I get that it would be disappointing, but sometimes choices are not win or lose. But "This stinks" and "this stinks" -- which one stinks least? If you no longer feel willing and able and dread the idea of being in the wedding part and prefer to attend as a guest or not at all? Bow out NOW so they have more time to find a replacement. Otherwise attend and just behave like an adult.

Moving out is not an option whatsoever, we're in a lease and this is the only way we can all afford to live in our expensive area as students.

When is the lease up? You wouldn't consider a new lease with other people at that time? And then in future not date your roomies to avoid this sort of situation from happening again?

Galagirl
 
It sucks because I don't like having her around right now, not because I can't be civil. Trust me, I've very nice to her, its just hard watching her do things with my roommates when she hasn't officially ended things with F, its unethical in my eyes.

I don't pity F, I care for him deeply and if it were me I'd not want to be abandoned. Its dangerous to cut people, especially partners, out of your life suddenly especially when they are already dealing with so much.


I think you're misunderstanding my relationship with K and A, they are my roommates and my best friends and sometimes more. I'm fully committed to living with them for the rest of my life. I won't bow out of being the maid of honor. My problem isn't with them, its with the situation and with E being sort of a force of destruction and drama between everybody.
 
Thanks for more details.

Would you feel better if E "officially" ended it with F? Or F ended it with E?

In your ideal situation, what would happen?

Galagirl
 
...
And the wedding is between K and A, we are all members of the wedding party so it isn't optional...

It IS optional - really, although it took me 3 months to see it. I had agreed to be in a wedding for a friend - and then she treated me in such a way that I no longer wanted to be her friend, but she "needed" me to be there for her wedding...so I ended up (after much agonizing) telling her that I couldn't come to her wedding. My life has been MUCH less stressful since then :rolleyes:.
 
I don't pity F, I care for him deeply and if it were me I'd not want to be abandoned. Its dangerous to cut people, especially partners, out of your life suddenly especially when they are already dealing with so much.

Why 'dangerous'? Are you afraid of what F will do if he feels abandoned? Will he hurt himself? You? Your roommates? Others? Are you talking more along the lines of emotional danger? What feels dangerous to you about this situation? Where does this strong association of danger come from?
 
I do think it would be best if either E officially broke up with F or if she put effort into fixing their relationship.

Dropping out of the wedding is not an option. I live with K and A, I'm in an intimate relationship with them, I love and care for them. Dropping out would be a huge dick move, something that happened with some of my wedding party and I never forgave them. Its a fucked up thing to do, and I'll leave it at that.


The danger comes in many forms, though it could be my PTSD talking. I do think that isolation can drive people to self-harm or commit suicide. I think it can be destructive and at the very least cause a serious episode of depression and potentially long-term abandonment issues. Speaking as somebody in the counseling field, and somebody who has been abandoned, I don't think it is ethical to abandon somebody that way.
 
If someone starts hurting themselves or others because someone says "this isn't working for me, bye", they had pre-existing issues that have not been dealt with.

A few years ago I had a boyfriend type person who, when I broke up with him due to his never ending drama and obliviousness, threatened to commit suicide. Obviously I immediately called the cops to go do a wellness check on him-
I had a friend who chose suicicde when I was a teen so I take that shit pretty seriously. Even still, though, if he had been splashed on the cover of the newspaper the next day having succeeded at murdering himself, I would not have "caused" that. You don't "cause" other people's choices. They choose.

Someone's inability to deal with the shitkickings life is guaranteed to dish out at some point is not your fault or responsibility, in my view. Offer support, offer love, offer kindness... but don't take the responsibility for their emotional and mental wellness from them. That is theirs to own and manage. You in turn are responsible for your own emotional and mental wellness, first and foremost. Do what is best for your health and wellness and I've found the rest will fall in place. I've never found that self sacrifice is truly necessary for love.
 
I'm not talking about self-harm from a breakup. I'm talking about being completely and abruptly isolated from every one of your friends for no reason. Situations cause behaviors, it's basic psychology. Isolation and abandonment in this way are considered to be traumas, and have been known to cause PTSD. I don't want that on my head, because yes it is my fault if I choose to subject somebody to that kind of abuse.

I still don't even know why we are arguing about this, what is the benefit of completely cutting out a love interest who has never done me wrong simply because his girlfriend is leaving him?
 
I still don't even know why we are arguing about this
Agreed. Perhaps you need to restart the thread, because you seem to have answered your own question:
Any advice? Not on the past but on the present and future?
Specifically, what actions you CAN take in this situation is all stuff that you REFUSE to do. Until you are willing to compromise, or to risk being responsible enough to let others act like sane adults (with the usual risk/reward gamut) & own their problems & solutions thereof, there is no chance of progress.

A good therapist sees a good therapist.

Is there any sort of advice that might help you & you wouldn't reject out-of-hand? People are certainly willing to assist.
 
Literally the only advice was to ignore and abandon people???

I'd welcome any /productive/ advice on how to improve the situation and my relationships instead of saying fuck it and abandoning my problems?
 
I don't think there's a lot you can DIRECTLY do. Just these:

  • Pause dating F, until F sorts out their E situation. That isn't abandoning them -- you can still talk and be friends. That's pausing the dating so they have time/space to clear up their E thing and so you don' have to be worrying/feeling guilty about dating them while the E thing is unsettled.
  • Move out or plan to move out when lease is up, so you don't have to work around K&A visiting with E in the shared home.

At this time, you are not up for those. So I grey them out.

There's some things you could ASK. Like INDIRECT solutions... but since you don't control other people's behavior, it is possible that when you ask, they might say "No, thanks. I am not willing to do that." I also don't know how willing you are to ask.

  • Ask your roomies to visit E over at that house, and not at your shared home for a few weeks so you can have some time to adjust without E being underfoot.
  • Ask E to either work on the relationship with F or break up.
  • Ask F to either work on the relationship with E or break up.
  • Ask F to seek counseling for their abandonment/suicidal stuff. That isn't something you can do for them. They have to do it. I am not saying to abandon them. I am saying to avoid enmeshment and maintain healthy boundaries. Let THEM attend to their healthcare issues. It is not your job. You can encourage them to attend to it, but you cannot do it for them.

My problem isn't with them, its with the situation and with E being sort of a force of destruction and drama between everybody.

I imagine it is tempting to blame E like she is a "force of destruction. " Some of her behaviors don't sound great. She does sound like she has a hand in the situation making. But she isn't the only one with a finger in the pie.

These people (K, A,B, S) choose to flirt with her, try to date her etc. even though they seem to acknowledge that she treated F poorly. And F is supposed to be their friend.

I guess I don't know how "friendly" that behavior is toward F. Where's the fire? Getting involved too soon with people who are (recently broken up, divorced, windowed, etc) is listed as a pitfall. If F and E are on the rocks, and these people were my friends? Even if I was interested in dating E at some point in time, I would wait a decent interval first and let them both heal post break up a bit. Rather than make new waves/problems/difficulties for E or F or within the circle of friends by swooping in too fast.

I'm sorry I cannot think of anything else. :(

Doing nothing is also an option. You may decide to endure the discomfort for now -- and just wait and see. You may not be able to think of anything you can TAKE AWAY from the stressful situation at this time, but you can try not to ADD NEW things to it.

Galagirl
 
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Okay, so I think there were some major misunderstandings here, that first greyed out option (pausing dating F) isn't something that was ever suggested. What I saw being suggested was to cut off contact with F and E, which is something I'm not willing to do. I don't think F needs a therapist or has any mental health issue that would cause him to be suicidal. I think that any average person who was entirely and abruptly abandoned by every one of their friends (which was what I heard being suggested here) would become traumatized by the experience and lead to self-destruction.

Anyway, to clarify, I am not dating F: "After they opened up there relationship, I cautiously started seeing more of F. Like I said, no labels, but we did start becoming intimate, sleeping together, etc." Now, if what you are suggesting is reducing intimacy, that is a reasonable suggestion and something I've been keeping in mind. Though I haven't seen him in person in weeks so it hasn't been an issue anyways.


I'm not going to live without K&A, so what I'm trying to do is get to a point where E's visits aren't troublesome.



As far as your other suggestions, E has to come stay with us rather than K&A visiting her because she is receiving medical care in our city regularly. I am going to be proactive and ask them to clarify the reality of their breakup, thats a good suggestion. And as stated above, F is not suicidal or in need of healthcare.


And thank you for the reflection on where I'm placing blame. I think its unhealthy that I'm directing my frustration and negative energy at E. I need to figure out a way to let go of that and try to see things objectively and nonjudgmentally, its something I will work on.
 
We both use words differently. A "dating pause" is what I meant. Be friends, but stop going out on dates, sharing sex, etc. until F sorts out the E thing. I apologize if it wasn't as clear before.

You describing it as a "reduction intimacy" seems odd to me, but I'm willing to go with that terminology. Just not my usual language.

Glad some of the other ideas helped some though. I hope you start to feel better in time.

Galagirl
 
Dating to me implies commitment and I don't like that. I also don't go on dates with him anyways. But yeah, that is semantics.
 
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