Redpepper's journey

When I wrote this morning I was ready to give up. I explained to Mono that what he was going through right now with his retiring from 21 years of service in the Navy is akin to him being in quicksand or jumping into a black hole. His crush on the woman is just part of it.

I feel like I am holding his feet as he plunges head first into his own self-sabotage because of his military career ending. Sometimes I hold on and have others helping me by supporting me, sometimes he is working on pulling himself out too, and sometimes I am not able to hold on and think I should let him go. This morning I was in the letting-him-go space.

I asked that Mono just do the bare minimum to keep me from throwing in the towel. All I need is a few words every day or a touch to let me know that he is still with me. I will fight for what we have created if I know he is with me and not ready to leave all we have created.

There is more at stake here than just him and me. I will fight for LB and PN's sakes also. We all have a good thing going. I am not going to let him destroy it without a fight. I will continue to tell him that he has a responsibility to us, that he will get through this, we will be here all the way and will be here when he leaves his job. We have not changed. He has us to anchor to.

I talked to PN and Brad about it and asked that they please be patient with me for the next few months. I will need help to hold our family together. They can help by listening to me and letting me go to Mono when necessary. They agreed to do that. I haven't talked to Derby yet, but I asked her to read this.

I feel very clear that this is not about his crush; it's a symptom of a larger issue. I hadn't realized that before today, when the onion of our relationship was peeled. He said he had to think about more than just us. That was part of it, but not the whole thing.

Now I have something to sink my teeth into and work towards. I feel strong again. I am going to give him everything I have, because I love him more than ever.
 
Wishing all of you the best as y'all work through this together. What a difference time to cool down and subsequent thought and revelation makes. Good for you Red, for taking advantage of your support system as things progress.
 
Thinking of you both, and believing you can work through it!
 
Thanks to both of you. I am sure we can, too.

Off to poly camp tomorrow. I'm leaving you with one mod. Be nice to him, LOL. He has my cell to call if anything comes up. :) See you Monday.

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I went to a drive-in movie with Mono, LB, Brad and his wife and boy last night. What a fun time. Mono, LB and I wandered around, waiting for the movie to start, and enjoyed laughing and being together. It felt like there was a load off and we just relaxed. Brad and family met up with us shortly before the movie started. The boys played together. We all sat around, chatting and joking. It was a relaxed and lighthearted time. We needed that. :)

Yesterday I went to pick up the ticket for the movie from Brad's wife's bf. He wasn't able to go to the movie. He was the one that I was so fearful to meet last weekend at the campsite. We talked for a bit and he told me of his child's accident, among other things, and I told him of my childhood growing up with drive-in movies. We had to bring the aluminum speaker into the car. Our hands always got dirty. I remember eating popcorn with our dirty hands. We also had to light mosquito coils and tape screening to the windows after everyone was in. We were in big trouble if anyone had to go to the bathroom, which of course I always did. Fun times.

After our chat about that, I told him that I had been nervous to meet him due to his relationship with Leo's wife. He listened intently as I told him how I appreciated that he had taken me at face value and had been inviting and inclusive of me in the conversation with their group. He said that the topic of RP had been off limits and that he was happy to meet me.

While I appreciated that there had been a cone of silence on the topic, I was a bit confused. I don't generally go with that option, but in this case appreciated it and understand why it had been necessary. It would've been gossip, rather than informative. It's not really something that needs discussion on their end, as I am not dating him. He is far removed so I can see why.

I told him that I had been fearful because there was still some pain there. He said he appreciated knowing that. It feels done to me, now that I said that.

I am looking forward to spending time with him and his family now, if I should be invited, without the weight of the past on my shoulders. Slowly it lifts in terms of others, and becomes one solitary weight of not being lifted from them. Yay, communication! I think he liked knowing he did something that made someone else feel comfortable too. Bonus all around. :p
 
Back from camp and back to work. I will wait to write. Some stuff is still emotionally raw, in the processing stage.

I met some fun people, learned some stuff about myself in context to the community at large. Yesterday I had a long day of gardening and cleaning up camping equipment, giving me lots of time to ponder.

LB leaves for Toronto today on a flight with my parents. I'm thinking mostly of that. My 9 year old is being a brave big boy who will be smothered by my extended family's friends. I gave him all the advice I could think of, packed his bag and away he went. Does that feeling of missing your arm ever go away, when your kid is not close and accessible?

Date with Brad tonight. It's been a week of not seeing each other, a few days of no contact at all. I am looking forward to catching up.
 
LB leaves for Toronto today on a flight with my parents. I'm thinking mostly of that. My 9 year old is being a brave big boy who will be smothered by my extended families friends. I gave him all the advice I could think of, packed his bag and away he goes. Does that feeling of missing your arm ever go away as a parent when ones kid is not close and accessible?

Sounds like fun!! I imagine he'll be enjoying himself, there's lots to do in TO. And no, that feeling never goes away, rofl. I've sent my wee one with family a few times and every single time the house gets quiet and I have to try to find other things to do.
 
Does that feeling of missing your arm ever go away as a parent when ones kid is not close and accessible?

It lessens each time, but never truly goes away. One adult goes away, people barely notice, one kids goes away and the house gets eerily quiet.
 
Oh my, so true. We are tripping over the quiet around here, and the lack of things to do for him. No lunches to make, no scheduled dinner, no massive amounts of laundry, no deciding who stays home with the boy, no endless prompts to get out the door for the day.

He has called three times so far in less than 24 hours. This afternoon he called to say he was standing on the glass floor of the CN tower looking down while he ate his piece of cheese pizza. He was so excited each time he called.

It's a trip of a lifetime to go and do something like that with your grandparents. To think it was not that long ago that I was telling my mum that she had better work on her approach and judgment of my lifestyle or she wouldn't see him again. Worth every bit of the work with her for her to take him there and for me to hear his voice so happy and excited on the phone.
 
I had a lovely date night with Brad last night. We have gotten attached at this point and there is really no backing out without a lot of pain. I fear that a little, as I watch the last ditch effort to "make sure" fade into the back ground. I'm all in now.

I took a workshop at poly camp on "Breaking up." There is no sign of anything ending in my relationships as they are now, but I thought it might help my grieving process and help me understand why I still feel sad about Leo. What I learned really helped me. I learned that to break up with someone is to honour them as I did during the high times of our relationship. It should never get to the point where resentment builds that you are with someone. Something that goes on too long breeds disdain and resentment.

I learned that to honour someone, to love them for who they are, regardless of differences, means being truthful when things aren't working to the point of needing the relationship to end. It also means being kind in words and actions without sacrificing what my needs are to reach closure, but to be considerate of the person's feelings without owning them and taking them on. Lastly it means being helpful. If someone has been a shmuck, then they need to know that, in the most kind way of saying it as possible. It's an art form to break up with someone; it takes time and is a process, just like getting together in the first place. That process doesn't end with goodbye. It can and should happen together, if possible.

If ever I break up with someone again, I intend to hold them close, love them with all my heart, listen to them cry, cry with them, allow them to go through the grief process of denial, bargaining, sadness and anger, being present and available every step of the way. It won't be easy, but I now feel as if I have some confidence to know when to let go and how to do that with the best possible outcome.

When my marriage ended with my wife, we went through a beautiful process like the one above. I intend to use that as a landmark in the future as what worked for me and hope that I can offer everything I have learned to any other partner I have in the future.
 
Hey RP I just wanted to let you know that as much as you miss LB he is creating cherished memories. The summer before my last year in high school my grandparents took me, my brother and our two cousins on a grandparents bus trip. We were far older than the other kids, all of us being teenagers and them being about LB's age. But there was no doubt that memories were made. It was a fantastic week of time with family that we hadn't had in a very long time. Teenagers get so lost in teenagerdom that we forget to make memories. That fall my grandfather passed away unexpectedly and we all four said how grateful we were for that trip.

I'm so glad you worked things out with you mother so that LB can have these memories, and so that you can as well.


Alright, back to catching up on all I missed while I was away.
 
Someone wrote on FB today that they were dumping the term poly and going with open/fluid marriage instead. It reminded me of a time when I did the same thing. The term "poly" got so weighted for me I needed to step away from it, see it as an umbrella term and then pick and chose what worked from what I saw. It was a process of making it my own. Well, I own it now, I guess. I found my sub-community. I found people that are poly yet have other things in common with me besides that. Finally somewhere to belong. :)
 
I'm at my parents' island cottage this weekend, spending some last moments of summer with Mono. He says hi to anyone who cares, by the way. ;) He's making coffee downstairs, below the loft bedroom.

PN is home and having a good time with two female friends. He's lighthearted, happily texting us and putting pictures on FB, joking around. He loves his alone time.

LB is still in Toronto, having been to the CN tower, Niagara Falls, and the zoo. Today they go to the Science Center. He's been having a great time. It's hotter there than he is used to, and he calls every night exhausted.

Derby is on the last day of her epic camping trip, as she calls it. Her husband is away for work again. Her parents are coming the moment she gets back. She will be sad her trip is over and life comes flooding back, I think.

Brad is camping with his family. The jokes between him, his wife, Mono, and me went on all last night via text. Mono likes to tease him. It's nice to see him unthreatened and proud of his position in my life. Unwavering and sure of himself. That is how I like to see him. A break from his struggles with retiring was welcome this weekend.

I decided to leave the issue of Mono's female friend alone. I don't talk about her and he doesn't either. He has realised how one can love another while loving their partner and that seems to be enough for him. He has told me there is nothing to pursue there and I decided to trust that.

I texted both Leo and Ken this week to tell them I miss them. Fuck it, why hold on to my envy of them spending time with others when really I just miss them. I was inspired first by telling Ken that. I felt good releasing that feeling and sharing it. It was out there. I admitted it and felt better.

I texted Leo next hoping for the same result and got it. He didn't respond, but I don't need a response to feel better. I don't need there to be some kind of huge movement of change from them. It's enough that they know. The change has come from within me. I'm not sure how yet, but I have kept myself from feeling bad.

Ken wrote back right away and said he hopes we can spend time together, as he misses me to. He and his gf are off for the weekend too. My relationship with my coworker, his gf, has changed. We seem to have some kind of understanding of one another that wasn't there before. We don't speak much more than we used to, but when we do it's with a closeness that we didn't have before.

Mono and I are off to enjoy the island today. Fall is here. The sun is low, the grass and forests are dry, eager for a winter of rain. The locals are buzzing with the last of the tourists on the island. Tonight we are going to a party at a pub restaurant that closes for the season tonight. Should be fun.
 
Hi Mono! :) *waves*

Smiling about all the fun LB is having in my hometown. I miss it so. I'm happy y'all are connecting on your own, separate experiences and all that.

When everyone gets back together I'm sure the stories will be endless.
 
Last night I noticed that Mono and his lady friend were messaging on FB. Trying to follow my own agreement with myself that I wouldn't bring it up, or go to the place of feeling threatened and fearful about him cheating on me and/or leaving me, I left it alone.

What I couldn't do was change how it affected me. I remained quiet and worked on it within myself. In time, he asked what was up and asked if I had seen that she was writing to him. It was the first time he had asked me to engage in a conversation about her. Usually it's been I who brings it up, in a fit of feeling distraught.

I said I had seen her face on his tablet screen and that I was working on not reacting negatively. He held me close and told me she had messaged him to tell him about a song she liked. He said that everything was back to normal between them, that their friendship was as it used to be, just friendship. He said wasn't going to leave me, I didn't need to worry. He loves me and has no reason to be with anyone else.

It was the first time he'd reassured me without my asking. I immediately felt reassured and believed him. I asked him today if he noticed the difference in how we related to one another because of his reassurance. He said he did. I told him I hoped he would reassure me more often now, as it works better for both of us if he tells me honestly how he feels in the moment. It works to do as I request in regards to getting my needs met.

I am so thankful to have made this new turnaround with him. I feel it might be the dawn of some new headway for our relationship. I feel like I am breathing fresh air.
 
Hi Mono! :) *waves*

Smiling about all the fun LB is having in my hometown. I miss it so. I'm happy y'all are connecting on your own, separate experiences and all that.

When everyone gets back together I'm sure the stories will be endless.
Off to meet up with LB and PN now. :) Mono says hi. :)
 
You know, this is causing me to think hard about the kind of agreement I would make with a poly-friendly mono man -- to wit, there would have to be an agreement not to blindside me with "Hey, she's shinier; I'm leaving you!" Because I know mono is mono and might prefer a mono partner, but a relationship is a relationship no matter the orientations of the people involved. People need to do right by each other, as Mono's doing right by you by checking in. <3
 
there would have to be an agreement not to blindside me with "Hey, she's shinier; I'm leaving you!" Because I know mono is mono and might prefer a mono partner
This has been my issue with his crush on her. Mono schooled me well in believing that if he turned his glance elsewhere it would mean the end of what we have. He said he would still be in my life, but as a friend. That was not okay with me, I always feared he would leave me for someone more suitable, someone mono-minded. He's mono, and that's how it works.

He always said that what we have is perfect for him. I don't require huge amounts of his time. I leave him to his own devices, as I have my own life going on with others and require a large amount of independence. I was challenged when she came into the picture. Especially as his crush had gone on for months and he never told me. She felt the same, it turned out. I still think she does and that is why she continues to write to him at interesting moments where I am particularly close to him (as is evident on FB).

I thought we had an agreement-- no blindsiding. How does one go about not doing that? It's impossible in mono relationships when they end, I think. Maybe if it ends before someone new comes along? That's the only way I can see that a mono relationship would end without one person being blindsided by their partner leaving them for another. Either you are in the relationship or not. There is no working in another partner together with them.

The two of them could not be together, because she is married, another thing that makes me very nervous. Her marriage is struggling and he offers a way out to her, I think, even if it's a fantasy of something different, exciting, new, more rewarding than what she has with her husband.

If he decided to be poly, she would have to be part of my life and he would not want that. He doesn't think we would get along. He would have to choose, if that was the case. I wonder if that is why he chooses not to take on a poly relationship with her. He could push for it, if she meant that much, couldn't he?

If she didn't work out, maybe someone else would, someday. He says that this was a unique experience. Maybe he's right. There are a lot of complicated factors. Who knows?
 
If he decided to be poly she would have to be part of my life and he would not want that. He doesn't think we would get along. He would have to choose if that is the case and I wonder sometimes if that is why he chooses not to take on poly with her. He could push it if she meant that much. Couldn't he?

RP, I am just wondering if this idea is really something you are more flexible about than you think. What does it mean to you to be "part of your life"? I know you spend a lot of time with metamours and that metamour friendship is an important part of how you do poly, but do any of your partners have partners that you don't see, or that you've just met briefly?

If Mono wanted to tackle poly, and his involvement with somebody meant he'd be out of the house a few days a week for dates elsewhere, because he felt more comfortable keeping things segregated, would that affect you in any other way than you might be lonely because he wasn't around as much?

This just made me wonder if you'd look differently at a new partner who happens to have a lover who doesn't want to hang out with you (as in, it's not your ideal, but it's fine because you know what to expect going in), vs how you are with Mono. If he had a new partner, you'd be much more comfortable if they fit into the framework/family you have that already exists, so that unknown is much more scary if even his poly might be exclusionary instead of inclusionary.

Is there a way you could meet this woman? Could you go out of your way to pick him up while she's present, or something? I just get the feeling that if you just had the chance to say hi to each other, things might get clearer for all three of you.

I too would think that other circumstances in the future could lead to a situation like this for him again. I don't know how much of a loner Mono is, if his current leaning towards still feeling firmly monogamous after this long relationship with you is actively about not being poly, or wanting/wishing to spend a majority of his time with someone he loves.

It seems like you spend a lot of group time with your loves/family/friends, in order for you to be able to have face time with everyone. With retirement coming up, and you dating Brad, and having less exclusive time with him, he'll have more time on his hands. If part of his struggle is having less time with you, and needing more shared time to get to be with you, that will need to be addressed. Maybe you haven't talked about that, since the focus may have been on what's going on with the female friend, instead.
 
I put some thoughts into words today and thought I would share. I have been trying to explain to Brad how I don't have any primaries or secondaries and why. I have a husband, but I've never thought of him as primary. Brad is just as important and vital to my life as PN or my other loves (Mono, Derby).

I think it's because I chose whom I agree with, and don't agree with. Just because I have a commitment with someone doesn't mean I have to agree with everything they do. That was a profound understanding of myself, in terms of my independence from others. I have my own set of values. I don't meld with those that I am partnered with. It's mine. I created it and I nurture it.

I find that often couples entering poly think that they have to support everything their partner does and be there for them, regardless of how it effects them. I don't agree with that. I think it is okay to say, "You know, sweetie, I don't agree with what you are doing (and this is why) but I love you enough to not let it come between us. I think you have to go do that yourself and find others to support you on that one." It means that you can have a separate life from you partner, yet still be committed to them.

I have different friends from my husband, different loves, different hobbies, even different dreams, but when I committed for life, I meant it and intend to be there regardless of what he does. I make that same commitment to every partner I have. I commit to being present in OUR RELATIONSHIP, not in everything they do. That is why I have no primary. I am responsible for how I represent myself and I will do what it takes to portray who I am as a person, not as a unit of two or more.
 
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