A Mono's Journey Into Poly-Land (or, "Aw hell, there's no road map?!")

It is so refreshing to see I am not alone. I am almost feeling forced into a polygamous relationship that I do not want to be in. I am straight monogamous, and he is poly... it is hard. He wants a partner with us other that just us. The other problem is the other girl, him and myself all live together, and I just do not know what to do.

Hey there SnowCrystal,

I caught your other thread and wanted to send a couple more virtual hugs your way. :) My situation isn't the same as yours, so I may not be able to empathize all that well (sorry), but if you need an ear feel free to PM me (this blog thread may not be the best place if you want to vent :) ).

Luckily, P and M1 have been extremely respectful and good about trying to all get together and work through our difficult moments when we have them. I tend to have more than they do, but their difficult moments come up once in a while too. ;) It's okay to have feelings and misgivings, and I'm lucky to have a partner and metamour who are understanding of all that.

I just need a place to toss around my thoughts and vent a little once in a while. :)

Hoping for the best for you...
 
Difficult night (and day) and a craptacular overreaction.

What a draining couple of days...

Security+ training for work (required), so lots of cramming to remember a multitude of acronyms that all dissolve into alphabet soup after reading/studying a bit too long. Encryption, algorithms, standards, network security, physical security, bla bla bla. And I'm not even really going to use this in my day-to-day activities - this is just required to perform the occasional admin-level login on an isolated system.

So my brain is full and I have just been cooked for the past few days. I still need more studying and drilling, and then need to find a facility that tests for the certification. Then hopefully pass so I can forget about it for the next three years, or until the requirement is dropped. :rolleyes:

Tonight was a rough night emotionally as well...

My daughters danced with a girl whose brother committed suicide a few days ago. My niece was friends with him. We went to the candlelight memorial tonight, and it was sweet but so incredibly sad. Both girls were in tears (as was I) and we ended up leaving early because I think it was a bit too much for my youngest.

Ugh.

Last night was emotional as well (and dribbled into this morning), and I am ready to just sleep through tomorrow and into Monday (but alas, the kids have been invited sledding and I plan to chill with the 'rents and have a drink or two :) ).

I'm pretty annoyed with my reaction, actually. P came to me and mentioned that his buddy wants to get together with him and play some music on Tuesday nights. Great, right? In fact, that's the night I spend extra time with the kids before bringing them back to their dad's, so my first reaction was, "Cool - works for me."

Until I thought, "Oh, every Tuesday?" And started getting all stressed out about what that would mean for our time together, as P wouldn't really be getting home until I was ready to hit the hay, and it would mean that we really wouldn't see each other much at all on those days.

P and I have a two days on / two days off schedule, where he alternates time up north with me and down south with M1, 1.5 hours apart. While our relationship was still pretty young, we didn't have overnights on weekends (and really didn't spend much time together on weekends), since I had my kids on the weekends, and didn't want to overwhelm them with my new relationship so soon after the divorce from their dad. It was extremely difficult, as I am a "Quality Time" person (STRONGLY) and couldn't see myself building a "partner" type of relationship with anyone on anything less than half-time. That was pretty much my limit.

After a while, we were able to introduce P overnight on the weekends, and we pretty much approached a full "half-time" schedule between me and M1.

Every so often, I still feel the pinch for time. The holidays were extremely rough, with activities, things with the kids, family, etc. When I don't have enough "P time" (without M1 or a large group), I get really antsy and start hoarding time with him, occasionally to the point where I'm extremely cognizant of how much time we have left together before he leaves, and being very clingy about it all. It's a sucky place to be, emotionally, and after those triggering events (holidays, vacations away, etc.), I really do need some recharge time with just him.

I'm coming out of my post-holiday "cocoon time" with P. And then immediately swung right back into worrying about how his hanging with his friends every Tuesday would impact us. Started worrying about our time slowly getting picked at, little by little, until it wasn't enough, and I took myself down the rabbit hole emotionally. It ended this morning when I finally plotzed (an apparently amusing flip-out where I tried to storm out of bed, and instead couldn't get the sheets untangled from my legs all that gracefully) and then we finally had a good conversation where I wasn't metering every word coming out of my mouth (too emotional and spent).

It sucks to be the one (the only one) out of me, P, and M1 who is a Quality Time person. They don't get it (although M1 has been extremely accommodating in that respect), and I feel like I'm speaking a foreign language at times. It sucks to think that I may be right at that time balance, where any sort of upset is going to be extremely difficult and unmanageable for any length of time. And it sucks to worry that I may have to be the one to go to P and say, "This isn't working" and have to end it when there's absolutely nothing wrong with the relationship itself (on the contrary, the relationship between us is absolutely fantastic when I'm not dealing with other external triggery stuff).

And I have to back up and go, "It's only a fucking Tuesday night with his friends!"

He's torn between trying to understand and starting to get resentful about having to "ask my permission" to go do something for himself, and I aggravate myself for putting him through all that.

Sigh.

So... After gnawing on it a bit, I'm thinking that all this emotional wonkiness is getting triggered from the wrong thing. The Tuesday nights? What's the result? That I feel the pinch for time? Okay. Been there. Felt that. Dealt with it before.

The REAL trigger should be feeling that pinch for time. THAT is what should get me talking with P and saying, "Okay, I need more time with you - how can we do this?" This is the thing that needs to be dealt with. I can't deal with a "what if" based on fear. I *can* deal with something that actually happens.

Now the trick is getting my heart to agree with my brain in all this and actually shift that focus.

I don't like feeling like a heel when I get all emotionally out of whack and P ends up just not wanting to do whatever it is he initially asked about. I feel manipulative and unstable. I feel like I'm encouraging resentment. And I feel like I'm encouraging P to not be honest with me. Not something I want to encourage.

So... Something else to work on. At the very least, P's understanding (as much as he can be) and we're moving forward.

And boy that glass of Merlot hit me pretty hard tonight. Tweeeeeee...
Methinks it's time for bed, before I babble myself into a corner. :eek:

As always, it's an adventure. Not always a pleasant one, but it sure the hell is an adventure.
 
Slightly clearer head today...

This weekend was pretty much a whirlwind, so I'm taking a little time to get this down now that my head's a little clearer (obviously I was cooked - one glass of wine tipped me over the fuzzy-headed stage and I went all rambly).

My thoughts on this whole thing are that it really interrelates closely with the struggle I'm having thinking about P as my partner, given circumstances, distance, and the time available. When we first started this relationship, we struggled to get to the point where we truly were half-time. I babbled about that somewhat in my last post.

And now we're here, barring odd schedule changes or holiday stuff that makes it more group time than "us" time. When it's not getting perturbed, it works, and it's comfortable. When the balance goes awry, though, like it did over the holidays, I go back into needy, time-hoarding mode. My thought going into this was that half-time would be the minimum amount of time I'd need for it to really feel like a partnership - that this was also his home, and that our lives had that amount of interdependency that I desire in a "partner" type of relationship.

And again, when the balance isn't getting tipped, it feels comfortable. But boy, it's easy for it to tip.

This new Tuesday thing felt like it was going to tip the balance again. And I'm sitting here wondering if I either need to dial back what I feel our relationship is (i.e., will I feel better if I call him my "boyfriend" in my head rather than my "partner") and ratchet down my expectations accordingly, or do I need to rewicker what I think a "partnership" is?

At this point, I feel like we struggled so hard to get to a point where we're half-time, and now maybe he's at a point where he can't be happy without taking more time out for himself (which I know he needs), and I can't be happy with less time for us, at least in the relationship we have.

Sigh.

I'll need to see how this Tuesday thing works out, but this is what I'm struggling with right now. If I dial this back, it isn't inconsequential, even though the mechanics of our relationship may not significantly change any. I'll no longer think of him as my partner. I'll no longer think of this as "our" home. I'll no longer want him to be vested in my life at the level I want our lives to be interconnected because I won't want to depend on him, won't want to be able to count on him being there, because that's not what our relationship will be, to me, anymore. And if I ratchet this down, we've been handfasted for a couple years now... I won't be able to do it again this year if it doesn't feel like a partnership to me. It'll feel like a lie if I don't feel that level of commitment. Our relationship will truly be that "leaf on the wind" thing that he subscribes to (that I hate - I'm somewhat of a planner, at least inasmuch as I like to have some control over my own destiny), and I can't count on that to be around if it just floats hither and yon.

So this is heavy. This has the potential to be one of those turning points in our relationship, and I'm not sure where we're going to end up. It stinks because there's nothing in our relationship itself that's problematic. We're damned good together, and that makes this potential decision even harder.

So, we wait and see if I feel the pinch. And if I do, then we have to make a decision. I don't want to go forward with a relationship where one of us is doomed to be unhappy. I don't want to give him a hard time about picking away at "our" time when he needs time for himself - that way lies resentment, and the last thing I want is for him to resent me for trying to keep our relationship something it may not be able to be.

I'm hoping that his "me time" doesn't feel like too big an impact, but I've gone over it in my head and I think I'm ready for the alternative. I guess this is what's meant by not being attached to an outcome? I'm ready for either and I'm done trying to steer it. But I don't want to give up too soon either. I guess we'll both know when it's not working. We'll just need to be honest when each other if it reaches that point.

Ah well. It's Monday, I had a late start to work, and now it's time to focus. Time to close the box on this vent for a little while, put a bow on it, and move forward.

Wednesday, we have free passes to see the new Miyazaki film (anyone who's a fan in the Boston area should check out the schedule for the Brattle Theater). That'll be a nice night... I love hanging out in Cambridge, even in winter. And P's birthday is coming up, so M1 is plotting (and trying to find bad-back-friendly activities, which is sweet of her :) ). Onward and upward...
 
I am struggling with a similar situation. What does a primary partner-type relationship look and feel like when there isn't the usual 'markers' of primary-ness, like shared residence, shared finances, raising kids, etc. And I too need a certain amount of time to build and maintain an intimate relationship.

Unfortunately I have nothing useful to add beyond mutual sympathy.

<<Hugs>>
 
The sympathy is much appreciated, Opal, and I'm sending hugs right back your way...

As I was walking back from a meeting about 10 minutes ago, I realized that part of the irony of all this is that I don't even know if MY life can support what I think I want out of a partnership. My kids don't want/need another adult around 24/7, even if he could accommodate that. They want time with me, and unless we're doing a shared activity with P, then it ends up being P separating himself from us so I can have mom/kid time without him feeling like he's inserting himself into that. I'd love it if we were more family-like, but it's not going to happen with my 13-year-old and I respect that.

That, plus the distance, and the fact that I'm NOT going to consider moving until the kids are out of high school and away to wherever they're going - that all adds up to my not being all that able to compromise in a way that would help achieve my own goals here.

This led to the realization that my goal here is more of a marathon than a sprint (or a "where I should be now"). Maybe once the kids are grown, I could consider finding a job that's closer and maybe moving and helping out the time balance that way. He's trying to make an even balance out of two relationships an hour and a half apart from each other. If he wants to take time for himself and do anything at his southern locale, it's an automatic 1.5 hour impact on our time (which would be why, even with an early night jamming with his buddies, he'd be home probably no earlier than 11:30pm, when I'm ready to wink out).

So I may feel the pinch for time. I've pretty much accepted that I will. I guess the question is, will the rough moments be tolerable if I look at this as progress toward a goal and not a "chipping away" of what we have? Then I don't really have to redefine anything. Just maybe work on what a more reasonable expectation for the role of "partner" is while we're under these constraints.

While I was wrestling with all this the other day, he asked, "So you couldn't ever be married to someone who worked second shift?"

And that didn't feel right to me... I felt that if I were married to someone who worked second shift, or drove a truck, or was deployed, there'd be a goal - retirement, or a shift change, or a return home, or some sort of respite for a while. I get blinded by the poly-ness of the situation and think that well, this will never change. He'll always be poly. I'll never get a respite, or retirement, or whatever. But that really doesn't mean I can't take my own action to help the other circumstances change in the future.

Interesting epiphany. Odd that it happened after a scheduling meeting, but I'll take it. :p
 
I have been following your recent thoughts, and I wanted to send you some hugs. My advice giving is a bit rusty, so I have nothing positive to contribute. I do hope you find something that works out in due time.
 
Thanks, Ry. I appreciate it. Here's hoping you're feeling better! :)

Last night was our semi-regular "powwow" between me, P, and M1, so some of this background stuff got aired there (I wasn't really intending to, since it's pretty much between me and P, but he alluded to it, so it got talked about. NBD).

Afterward, I was pretty much cooked and didn't get into what I'd thought about earlier that day. He asked if I wanted to talk more (since I said we had more to talk about), and I didn't. He was okay with that, and we had a nice, quiet rest of the night.

Today, he's not home with me, and Wednesday, we're out seeing a movie, so I wasn't sure when we'd have the opportunity to talk, so I typed up an email with "the rest of the story". I'd rather talk face to face, but sometimes, you just don't know when you'll have time.

Without doing the cut-and-paste thing (because I get a bit wordy :eek:), I basically went into how I feel I'm triggering on the wrong thing (being worried about feeling the pinch for time rather than USING that feeling as a gauge to say, "okay, let's have some 'us time' now."), and that I need to try to realize when I'm doing that, and shift my focus to the REAL problem.

I've also been treating the situation as having struggled to get to where his time is now split 50/50 between me and M1, and I've felt that now that we've gotten there, anything is just going to chip away at it. Like we've built something and it's done and the only thing that can happen to it is that it gets taken apart brick by brick.

Except that's not even close to reality. What's on the calendar may remain consistent, but our circumstances now and ten years from now may be wildly different. We're not "there" yet. We're not anywhere yet that's on any particular map. We haven't finished the 5k; we're still running the (ultra-)marathon, and we have no idea where the hell we're going.

I personally have my own scheduling issues that don't allow for some of our time together to be "quality time" - him too. Once our kids are grown (and I'm not trying to rush it!), we'll be better able to spend good quality time with each other, rather than driving all over hither and yon. Also, once the kids are grown, I no longer have any ties to the area, and I would potentially be freed up to move somewhat closer and not have this extra 1.5 hour commute contributing to the "death by a thousand papercuts" of our time together.

Basically, we still have a ways to go (and who says there's a finish line at the end of this thing, anyway?), and I'm glad that we're going it together.

There will be hiccups. I will still feel the pinch for time, and I will still ponder what I need/want out of a partner... however, if I keep in mind that we're still on the journey, maybe it'll be easier to continue to work these things out over time, rather than think of them as things that need to be done now because we're here now and this is what we're supposed to be - now, dammit!

I'm a planner. I'm goal-oriented. I'm competitive. And that all goes out the window here, and it throws me for a loop. I reached my goal on paper (the 50/50 split for time), and then finally looked up into the real world and realized it doesn't mean diddly when you look at the real-life circumstances that will change as time marches on. I am NOT good with open-endedness like this. My movies and books need to have endings, dammit!

Barring that, though, they need to have something interesting to think about and/or hope for. And I guess this "To Be Continued" has that in spades. :) Which is good, because it aint' over 'til it's over. Cue the Lenny Kravitz song...

And it was received well... he got a little something in his eye and told me that he's also glad we're in this together. Then we used a few more running metaphors and then ended up joking about how he just lags behind and stares at my ass anyway, so there ya go. Swagger. ;)

I love that he and I can talk about this stuff and usually come out stronger on the other side. The processing and actual DEALING with the emotions sucks, but once we're done, it makes for a better us. Kiln-fired us, I guess. :)

Onward and upward...
 
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Just wanted to let you know that I have been following your blog with interest. Thank you for sharing so much of your day-to-day thoughts and struggles with us.

I am empathizing right now with the struggles associated with having a relationship with someone who lives over an hour away. Lotus (and her husband) live an hour+ away from us three.

The other weekend she and I were out for a "girls' day" and having a conversation about "how does it work to love someone who lives over an hour away...that you will never live with." Our answer was "hopefully, we will have plenty of time to find out.":D
 
It certainly has been an interesting road, Jane - my first time navigating a poly relationship, I wasn't long out of my divorce when we started, AND we're 1.5 hours apart when he's not here. I never do anything the easy way... Go big or go home, I guess. :D
 
I need Spring and I need it now.

Ugh. I have never been this impacted by the winter before, but this year, I am feeling it creep up and just engulf me. So much snow, it seems like we're shoveling/snowblowing every night or every handful of days. The snowbanks at the end of the driveway are about as tall as I am (which doesn't say much, but still). It's dark, it's cold, and my finances are such that I'd rather put my money toward April vacation with the kids and not go out and do something that requires money (so my signing up on Meetup.com is a bit of a big fat nothing right now, since the photography meetup costs money, the woodworking meetup costs money, and the one stained glass thing I signed up for was cancelled... boo...). I have not been motivated to do anything around the house, and then I feel like a slug because I'm not doing anything around the house... other than lug wood and push snow around.

After not even getting a proper January Thaw, I'm looking forward to the three days of 40-50 degree temps we'll be getting, even though it'll all freeze at night and make things a bit treacherous.

Last night, we celebrated P's birthday. I wish it were as idyllic as I'd hoped (or as, I think, P believes it was), but of course it had its share of hurt feelings on both sides.

The plan: a beer tasting and gourmet pizza. P's son (who just turned 21) was supposed to make it, but the coworker who was going to switch shifts with him was unable to. I attempted to make custom etched glasses (the association with P and ravens has been going on a long time, so M1 drew up a silhouette of a raven with a stein, and I was going to etch them on glasses with "Raven's Flight" on the back - word play is fun :) ). Sadly, the glasses didn't take the etching chemical, so we had plain glasses with a story to tell instead. And good beer. And good pizza. And a food/beer coma. And some tipsiness (which didn't help the hurt feels).

We shot the shit a bit, and it was interesting to see that when M1 gets tipsy, all that Facebook stuff I was angsting about ("She's so much more verbal and OUT THERE on FB than in real life") shows up in person. Except it felt less interesting the more I started to feel like the odd man out. As she got more flirtatious, making a couple of jokes that were really between them, etc., I started backing off more, which didn't help my feelings any.

We ended up on the couch just kinda sitting around. Someone suggested coffee, so I put on a pot. I wasn't sure if M1 was going to crash on the couch or drive home (or if she was okay to drive home), and this led to some upset on her part, thinking she got shooed out when I was just waiting to see what she'd decided (and how to make sure the door was locked, etc., if she stayed and left after we did) before breaking up the party.

As it was, without going into TOO much detail, she felt like she'd been politely shooed away, that she wasn't welcome to crash on the couch for the night. I felt okay with her staying, but wanted to know when she'd be leaving so we'd know if she should have a key to lock the deadbolt or if she'd leave in the morning when we did. I felt like I needed alone time (given the odd-man-out feeling), but P was enjoying his time with both of us so much, I didn't want to break up the party, and P was so cooked by the time we did get to bed, there wasn't much alone time to be had before the snoring began.

Sigh.

It was a fun night (for the most part) up until we didn't know how to end it. M1 sent out an email this morning, and I sent out a reply, so hopefully we clear the should-I-stay-or-should-I-go thing up in short order. Next time, I'll just ask what she'd rather do, rather than wait around for something to get said or asked. :rolleyes:

So, as a somewhat related aside, something got said last night that really bugged me...

When we were all sitting around the table, shooting the shit, P brought up how happy he is (which isn't the part that bugged me - I know he's happier than he's been in years, which DOES make me happy). I forget the exact wording, but sort of went down the path of how he's happy to have us both in his life, and that he could never go back to just one, and having a nagging, awful relationship again.

And that just struck me, hard. Is he saying that, if we had gotten together before he knew about Polyamory, that we would be destined to have that sort of relationship just by virtue of it being monogamous? M1 was mm-hmming and nodding her head the whole time - I know she's not big on marriage in general, as she felt too stifled in her own, but I don't feel that a relationship structure dictates the type of relationship you're destined to have with that person, period. I've seen references to poly relationships that were super-controlling (OPPs, rules put in place that would have made me run screaming), and I've seen monogamous relationships where the individuals were free to be who they are and are very happy, for the most part.

I have always felt that, if there is a problem in the relationship (not so much with external factors like time or distance), then that is a problem with the PEOPLE in the relationship, and not the structure.

I felt I was sitting at the table among marriage-bashers. That P was insinuating that, if we had gotten married, that we wouldn't be able to have the relationship we have, and that was just insulting to me. That the relationship structure would dictate what kind of partner I'd be.

But it was P's birthday, he was happy, M1 was in total agreement with him, so I figured I'd let it drop for the moment. I didn't want to shit on his birthday.

Bleh.
We'll talk about it, like we always do, but I was really hoping for a birthday celebration that didn't end up with crappy emotions. I guess we'll have something to shoot for next time.

And I keep telling myself that the weather is not helping these emotions. Spring can't come soon enough.

Edited to add: Well, I just sent out a dump regarding what I was feeling. M1 asked, P seemed concerned about what we were going to talk about, and I didn't want to drag it out and raise anyone's stress levels. Still, I find it kind of pointless to talk about the flirty behavior, since we were all tipsy and that shit happens - I tried to make it clear that I wasn't blaming anyone and wasn't asking anyone to do anything different, but that since I was feeling like a third wheel at times, I should have asked for alone time when I needed it, rather than worry about ruining his "together time" on his birthday. I brought up the marriage-bashing thing as well, and I'm not sure how it's going to get taken... I prefer talking face to face, but we're not seeing each other until Saturday and it's way too long to drag this out and walk on eggshells. I guess we'll see...
 
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Well... that was quick.

So, after a few emails and a phone conversation with P, it's all talked over and put to bed. I think that's the quickest we've resolved an issue in, oh, ever. Is there some odd poly award for "group conflict resolution"? I think we may qualify. ;)

Anyhoo, I was misreading P's point in the marriage discussion, I've determined to just ask to head upstairs to bed when I need to (rather than wait everyone else and the rest of the night out), M1 stated that yes, she does get amorous when tipsy, so she'd watch that out of courtesy, and we cleared up the whole stay-or-go thing pretty quickly and cleanly. She'll make it clear when/if she wants to stay, and I'll just point-blank ASK if it seems to be heading that way. We all waited around for cues from everyone else, which obviously weren't coming because everyone else was waiting too.

So. Done. <Brushes hands off on pants>

Next?
 
I am not sure if there is an award, but a tip of the fedora to you all for resolving it that fast!
 
So, after a few emails and a phone conversation with P, it's all talked over and put to bed. I think that's the quickest we've resolved an issue in, oh, ever. Is there some odd poly award for "group conflict resolution"? I think we may qualify. ;)
...
So. Done. <Brushes hands off on pants>

Next?

Woo-hoo! Good job!:D


... I've determined to just ask to head upstairs to bed when I need to (rather than wait everyone else and the rest of the night out)... and we cleared up the whole stay-or-go thing pretty quickly and cleanly. She'll make it clear when/if she wants to stay, and I'll just point-blank ASK if it seems to be heading that way. We all waited around for cues from everyone else, which obviously weren't coming because everyone else was waiting too.

This is, for me, a VERY important step! I'm pretty much a hermit - I like my routines and quiet time. I get antsy if I feel compelled to play hostess (or guest) for an extended time. If any of us are close enough to someone (friend or partner) that they are spending a significant amount of time in my home - then I want them to be free to "make themselves at home" (you don't need to "ask permission" to eat/sleep/drink/bathe/watch TV/read a book/play music/do your laundry/etc.).
 
All-righty, then!

My creativity has been challenged. Another thread asked, nay, pleaded for nicknames rather than initials. I have to admit, with P and M1 both beginning to date someone new, who I'm about to meet and am enjoying interacting with her on FB, I really don't want to make her M3 (since there already was an M2) because now people are starting to sound like BMW models.

I liked the anonymity of initials, but they do get confusing. I concede. :)

SO, from here on out, we've got nicknames.

P is henceforth known as Chops.
M1 will now be Xena.
New metamour/friend will be Noa.

You're welcome. :)

Anyway, today was a slow day, but over the weekend I resolved to finally get my ass up and moving again. I went from running regularly and teaching spinning classes, to running irregularly and teaching spinning, to not running at all but still teaching spinning, to hurting my back and doing jack squat. And now I'm putting on more weight and feeling it. I don't like not being able to bound up a flight of stairs without breathing hard at the top. Yuck.

So, we got the treadmill operational (after having it in the garage for over a year and a half, getting it into the cellar was the biggest hurdle!). Problem is that the belt is too loose and I only have metric hex wrenches, so no using it tomorrow (unless I go slowly) until I make a trip to Harbor Freight. Still... progress.

Got back on a spin bike for the first time since hurting my back (well, second time if you count the 5 minutes it took for me to try it out and nope right out of there because my back hurt too much). I got through a 45-minute class (as a student) without straining it too much (and I was able to change position when I needed to), and I managed to work out enough to have tired legs afterward. More progress. Going back Wednesday and hoping the motion limbers things up a bit. Baby steps.

Chops and I are meeting Noa for dinner next week, and I'm really looking forward to it (not nearly with as much trepidation as I had meeting the not-to-be-nicknamed M2, who isn't in the picture anymore). She and I have been interacting on Facebook, and she's a peach. Like I said earlier, I do believe we'd be friends even if Chops weren't involved, so that's huge. I have a feeling we'll be doing a lot of shooting the shit (and hopefully not shutting Chops out of the conversation... hee hee hee). She and I seem to have a lot in common, and she even has a yummy homebrew that she's going to deliver. Whee! :D

Nothing else too big on the Poly relationship front. Chops has been extremely attentive and loving and cuddly (I heart the cuddles and together time), and it's been a really good few days after the initial stress from the birthday gathering. Riding the wave.

And I'm trying to get off the internet a bit more and actually DO stuff. Getting the treadmill back in good shape is a nice project, but I've been playing around with installing a Plex server (cut the cable TV cord and I'm looking for any way to get HGTV). It's a good excuse to be geeky. ;)

Family is up and down... Mom is in the middle of radiation treatments and she's doing really well (hooray!). Middle sister seems to again be in a bad emotional state, but she's at the point where she's realized that her decisions are what got her there, and (I hope) are what will get her back on her feet. Baby steps. I'm hoping this is a good thing, but time will tell. Fingers are crossed.

Tomorrow, I'll either head outside for some exercise or I'll hit the fitness center at work and bop around on their equipment for a while. I've got a family history of folks getting diabetic as they age (and bad habits creep in) and I would really like to avoid that. Hoping to get to the point where Chops and I can run a 5-mile race in May that we've done the last couple years together, but we'll see. I'm still hoping to run another half marathon by the end of the year. They have a nice seacoast one in November that may be doable.

So... goals. And again, riding the wave while things are good. Looking forward to Spring, though, and getting some air in the bike tires and getting out some more.

Oh... And Chops got a motorcycle. Gotta get me a helmet. Thinking a purple metal flake bubble helmet will be my style. I wonder if we can mod the bike to make Jetsons noises... :D
 
On Metas...

Well, some updates first:
  • Treadmill is still busted. It was working fine until I cranked the incline up to "8" and it ground to a halt. Oops. Probably need to replace the belt.
  • The race Chops and I want to do in May is $50 to register for nowadays. Boo. Methinks we'll shift our tradition around and find another race to run. It's a GREAT race, but with other places my money's going this year (Disney, Universal Studios with the kids), I've gotta eat ramen, y'know?
  • I am DONE with Winter. That is all I have to say about THAT.

Now, onto the topic at hand...

I met up with Chops and Noa for dinner on Monday - she's really nice, and we had a fun conversation. I think it went really well, and I didn't end up in a teary ball afterward (like I did after the awkward dinner with M2). In fact, she mentioned that maybe she and I could get together sometime, which would be fun, but I know her time is at a premium between her job, her husband, her kids, and dating Chops AND Xena, so I'll let her take the lead on that. :) Good conversation, everyone got to talk, everyone was engaged and interested, lots of stories on all sides, and some good laughs. And the Random Google Dinner Pick of the night was this teeny-tiny "Authentic Mexican" restaurant about halfway between us... the food was FABULOUS, but the pacing was fast and ambiance was nil, so maybe we'll find something a bit slower-paced for the next time. :)

All in all, it went smashingly.

In other news...

Over the last couple days, events have transpired that I think really put my finger on why I cannot be close friends with Xena (and why I may still harbor some lingering resentment). I almost reconsidered putting this down in the blog, as I worry that either she or someone she knows may see this, but it's my blog and my space to vent and think things through. Beware all ye who enter here...

I've finally come to the conclusion that it's not that she's deceptive, not that she's dishonest, but she seems to be truly oblivious to how her actions (or lack thereof) impact the people around her. In fact, it's this obliviousness rather than any deviousness on her part that makes it so random and unpredictable (and therefore, even MORE aggravating to me when it happens).

Examples:
  • A while back, when Chops and I were planning to spend our first night together (and were VERY MUCH looking forward to it), it was probably about a week beforehand when Xena dropped the bomb that she had one of the cancer-causing strains of HPV, and had unprotected sex with Chops, exposing him. She'd had it before, assumed it had gone away (!) and had just gotten her pap result back. I'm glad she got her pap before we spent the night, and Chops and I have since worked through that, but GAH... such stress that could have been avoided if we'd known beforehand.
  • Xena's move out to this part of the country (and in with Chops) coincided with my move into a new house (and an emergency "OMG my shower needs to be gutted" project). This happened after she reassured me that she wouldn't be coming until around a month out ("spring at the earliest") and I was caught off-guard and felt abandoned when I needed help. She admitted there was no real need to move when she did, but she didn't feel like staying out there anymore. I acknowledge that her decision to move is her decision to move, but wow, did it make for a difficult couple of weeks...
  • She has a potentially life-threatening nut allergy and seems to be completely resistant to getting an Epi-Pen. Her choice, but it basically puts everyone else around her in a position where they could be responsible for her life if she has an episode (which she did last night and didn't wake Chops up when she got home to tell him). I DO NOT understand this one. At all. Why force the people around you to suddenly have that level of responsibility for your well-being? Chops was pissed that the guy she was on a date with didn't refrain from eating something with walnuts, and I'm wondering why it's HIS responsibility... Sigh.
  • No health insurance, which used to make me wonder if she'd need to "emergency marry" Chops in order to get on his insurance if anything bad happened... at least now with Universal Health Care, that doesn't need to be the case, but it's just one of those things that spark other decisions, or non-decisions, like getting an epi-pen (since you need a prescription).
  • Random, other smaller things that just irk... like putting in a date with Noa on the calendar for the day and time that Chops and I were going to meet with her (in case there was snow and we couldn't make it). I can understand wanting to make alternate plans, but don't make it seem like you can't wait for my plans to fall through. It's like hovering around the coworker who's leaving, so you can snag their office supplies. Wait 'til the ground gets cold, please!

Gah.

The moving thing - I get that it's not her responsibility to worry about MY move. Chops could have told her he couldn't support it all, but felt that he couldn't leave her in the lurch (which he told me as *I* felt left in the lurch, so *that* went over well...). The rest? sometimes I just want to tell her to take her blinders off and see how she's impacting people.

As for the calendar thing, I fired off an email to her when it popped up (shared Google Calendar, so I get notifications when something changes), and I got the "just putting it in so I don't forget!" answer. No apology, but at least some reassurance that my original plan was still priority, which was fine (and was really all I was looking for). I found it strange, though, that she profusely apologized to Chops for it, when he really didn't care (or notice). It just strikes me as odd that she'd apologize to the person who *doesn't* care and not to the person who questioned her about it... but I think I'm reading too much into that one.

Methinks my brain is looking for patterns here, which I'm trying to avoid - I don't want to constantly be critical about her every action, or think the worst of it. Still, when there is a preponderance of this type of thing happening, I'm leery. I don't like how her "head in the sand" behavior sort of popped up as a surprise exposure to HPV, nor do I like that it's making it everyone else's responsibility to protect her life if she makes a nut-allergy mistake (and then getting on a train afterward, where basically, you're trapped if something bad happens!). I'm leery of her decisions at this point, and it makes me just want to stay at arm's length.

sigh.

Getting it out helps. I can't really vent to Chops about this (although he heard my opinion about the Epi-pen and "making it everyone else's responsibility" thing this morning), nor to any of my other friends, since some already consider her the villian anyway ("You don't think she does this on purpose? I do."). I really don't think she's doing any of this maliciously, but jeez...

To be honest, it really doesn't matter if she is or isn't, when you get down to brass tacks. Chops loves her to pieces, and she loves him. I will continue to keep her at arm's length, since that's where I feel most comfortable (and less impacted) at this point. I will continue to be friendly - I do like her, after all - but I won't let my guard down. I haven't anyway, but now at least I've put my finger on why.

And knowing is half the battle.


Edited to add:
If anyone thinks I'm being unreasonable, please feel free to comment... heck, feel free for any reason at all. I know it's a blog thread, but I'm not going to be hyper-sensitive to anyone's comment saying that I'm looking for problems here and need to chill the eff out. I'm definitely open to hearing it, and it may do me some good to see this from someone else's point of view.
 
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I don't think your misgivings and frustrations are unreasonable at all. Xena sounds... narcissistic. Her own satisfaction seems to be her focus all day, every day. So, in that sense, she is doing these things on purpose, not out of a vindictive or devious need to throw a wrench into other people's lives, but simply because it's all about her and what she wants, and any concerns about others is either secondary or not thought of at all. Yes, oblivious because no one else matters, yet people like that can be incredibly lazy about doing the work needed to take care of themselves. They just want to be special.

I work with someone very much like that - the world revolves around her - and wow, she is extremely frustrating to deal with. Now that I am her manager, I have been so perplexed as to how to deal with her, and my boss has told me that she has never had to manage anyone like her before. We both have to strategize how to handle her.
 
I don't think your misgivings and frustrations are unreasonable at all. Xena sounds... narcissistic. Her own satisfaction seems to be her focus all day, every day. So, in that sense, she is doing these things on purpose, not out of a vindictive or devious need to throw a wrench into other people's lives, but simply because it's all about her and what she wants, and any concerns about others is either secondary or not thought of at all. Yes, oblivious because no one else matters, yet people like that can be incredibly lazy about doing the work needed to take care of themselves. They just want to be special.

Reading this really caught my attention, because that's exactly how I thought of my ex. We moved across the street from his mom, she owns the lawnmower (that my ex borrows), she owns the snowmobiles (that he borrows), if he ignores home repairs (like he does), she'll arrange the handyman for him. She takes care of her ex-husband, too, by handling his finances for him, because "he can't do it himself".

It explained why he didn't want me to move out of the house after we divorced - I was the major breadwinner. He was scared to death of taking care of himself.

(And no, I do NOT do his finances for him... :rolleyes:)

My ex would do similar, randomly annoying things as well, such as coming home at dinner time (when I'd waited to eat with him), and saying he had a HUGE lunch at 3, so he wasn't hungry. And doing this over. And over. And over. After we'd made dinner plans, of course.

<shudder>

Luckily, Xena seems to be remorseful when her action (or inaction) does hurt someone. She has apologized for how the move impacted me, for example, and she doesn't really want to upset anyone. The "head in the sand" stuff is still infuriating at times, but I think at this point it's much like your coworker - I have to figure out how to manage my relationship with her. It was actually progress for me to fire back an email after the calendar thing, and ask, "So does this mean the dinner with Noa is canceled?" I think I'd have avoided the conflict in the past. Someone who's got blinders on sometimes needs another person to jump in front of them with their hands waving, though, so to hell with the conflict avoidance at this point.

I work with someone very much like that - the world revolves around her - and wow, she is extremely frustrating to deal with. Now that I am her manager, I have been so perplexed as to how to deal with her, and my boss has told me that she has never had to manage anyone like her before. We both have to strategize how to handle her.

Best of luck there. We've got some difficult situations here as well, and it's certainly exercising every management skill I have (and making me painfully aware of the ones I don't). Vacation can't come soon enough.
 
Interesting side thought...

So an interesting side thought came up last night.

Chops was talking about how the guy Xena was on the date with during the nut-tastrophe hasn't gotten back in touch with her yet, which he found odd because the guy was usually very communicative. Chops then went on to say how we're spoiled with the level of communication we have with each other, and how it's tough when you don't get it from others.

My response was that, well, this guy hasn't really known her all that long, and they're still in the "dating" phase - maybe it's a bit too soon to expect that level of communication and give-and-take that the three of us have.

Pretty typical conversation, except there's one thing I didn't say, and that's the fact that if I'd been the guy, that nut incident (and lack of ability to do anything about it) would have wigged me right the eff out.

There's a fine line between being Chops' friend and being Chops' partner, and it sucks when I'm conflicted about which direction to go in. Having THAT conversation could be construed as "anti-Xena" and raise his hackles up, and I don't really want to come across as catty, or like I'm trying to badmouth her to him and cowgirl him away.

If I were simply a friend with no stake in this at all, I'd probably have said it - that maybe he's wigged out and maybe this is why (although he really should SAY something to her, rather than just ignore it until it goes away).

Instead, I sit and bite my tongue, and Chops comes to a different conclusion entirely, which is that I don't give a rat's ass about Xena's date and would like to talk about something else.

I suppose if he brings it up again, I'll try to figure out how to delicately say *something* without sounding like I'm trashing Xena. I just hate trying to meter my own words when, if it were truly just a friendship, I'd have said something by now. It's not easy coming across as a neutral party when I'm really not. Bleh.

OTOH, I'm looking forward to a fun weekend in NYC with my daughter's dance group (yes, I'm apparently a dance mom, although I'm not a "Dance Mom"). I think we'll be stalking the Today Show on Monday morning, so if you see a sea of girls in blue, I'll be among the pack of moms. <wave> :)
 
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Wish I could have met up with you, NYC - as it is, I am completely cooked from a way-too-busy itinerary and an early morning so the girls could get on the Today Show. However, they all had a great time, and DID manage to get on TV, so yay that. :)

Next time I'm there sans kids (and sans Dance Moms), I would be HAPPY to meet up. I'm dying for some non-mediocre food right now... Seriously, I HATE eating at chain restaurants (or gimmicky ones) when I'd rather get some good, local food.

In other news...
Xena got approached by a friend who hosts a podcast - she and Chops will be interviewed re. "poly" (which makes me laugh, because the "what is poly" question can be answered so many different ways, it'd take up an entire series of podcasts on its own). Her friend wanted to talk tonight, but she pushed her off until she could talk about it with me and Chops. No real names (especially since I'm not completely open about it with everyone, and really don't want the attention anyway), thankfully. And I got to see some examples of things her friend would like to talk about.

Should be interesting... we're skyping tomorrow night for our next "powwow" and we'll discuss this then (although I fired back an email with some of my responses, since I didn't want to forget and NOT address anything, and I didn't want to go unrepresented, either - it'll be nice to have a poly interview with the perspective of a mono partner too, I think).

We're also going to finalize our "safe sex" talk, since their other relationships may be starting to develop into something more physical.

I find it interesting, and oddly amusing, that I have ZERO problem with the sexual side of Chops being poly, but GOD FORBID something impacts our time together. It sends him for a loop when I'm actually the one to shrug and say, "I don't really care" about something, but Xena is the one to go, "But hold on a minute..." It's kind of nice to not ALWAYS be the "wait a minute" girl. :D
 
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