HPV - Shouldn't we talk about it?

HA! Not quite. When I talked about getting it by touching things, it was more about when the virus shows up orally.

Those "things" are almost certainly mucus membranes of infected humans. The actual oral cancers are rare, but the oral spread is probably pretty common.

You can pick up the virus just by touching something that's been touched by someone with the virus.

Let's lay this to rest, too. IF you picked up the virus by touching "something," you would then have to relatively immediately touch your own mouth or genitals to "get" this.

Ceoli - I am not at all arguing with you. You and I, as far as I can tell, are both single poly women and, if that's true, I can only feel the greatest affection for you. I really appreciate your points because you are allowing this dialog to take place where others can see it and maybe it's helpful to them. Thank you. Really.
 
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And it's about time they've started considering that men need testing and treatments as much as women.

This is true. On the plus side, there is an incredibly low (practically no) personal risk to heterosexual men even if they are in contact with a woman who has active HPV. On the negative side, this allows men to be carriers with relatively low motivation to check it.
 
It is something that's VERY treatable and there is a LOT going on around researching newer and better preventative measures and treatments for it.

Treatable but not trivial. Women should know it's not like you can take some antibiotics and it all goes away. IF it gets to be a problem, it's a pretty significant medical expense and concern. IF, IF, IF. Again, IF. It often does NOT get to be a problem. I am NOT trying to scare people.
 
Those "things" are almost certainly mucus membranes of infected humans. The actual oral cancers are very very rare, but the oral spread is probably pretty common.

Let me rephrase: By touching infected mucous membranes then touching objects. When the virus creates a sore, it is shedding virus cells to spread.

I did just re-read the article that suggested evidence of secondary transmission (it was an article I had read last year) and it only shows evidence of the mechanism, not the actual transmission. Though there is anecdotal evidence, that's not enough to suggest it, so I'm recanting that piece of information I thought was true but probably isn't. However, the study did say that about 15% of people with genital warts end up having detectable levels of the HPV virus in their hands and under their fingernails.
 
This is true. On the plus side, there is an incredibly low (practically no) personal risk to heterosexual men even if they are in contact with a woman who has active HPV. On the negative side, this allows men to be carriers with relatively low motivation to check it.

Actually there are some new studies that link HPV to throat cancer in men and also to lung cancer. This might be why there's more energy going towards actually regarding men's role in the spread of the virus, but that's more of a feminist rant I have about the medical system in general.
 
Actually there are some new studies that link HPV to throat cancer in men and also to lung cancer. This might be why there's more energy going towards actually regarding men's role in the spread of the virus, but that's more of a feminist rant I have about the medical system in general.

Yes, but very rare and almost certainly bi- and gay men.

EDIT: This is probably incorrect, though there's no real explanation for why the same increase does not seem to be seen in women (or if it is, it's not in the studies I saw). The studies showing the connection to oral sex are linking these cancers to so many other factors at the same time that it's really difficult to take much away from them. The number of cases that aren't complicated by other factors, like smoking, may be too few to conclude too much right now. The safest thing to do is to get regular dental exams so that any changes in the mouth can be monitored just like with PAP smears.
 
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Let me rephrase: By touching infected mucous membranes then touching objects. When the virus creates a sore, it is shedding virus cells to spread.

I did just re-read the article that suggested evidence of secondary transmission (it was an article I had read last year) and it only shows evidence of the mechanism, not the actual transmission. Though there is anecdotal evidence, that's not enough to suggest it, so I'm recanting that piece of information I thought was true but probably isn't. However, the study did say that about 15% of people with genital warts end up having detectable levels of the HPV virus in their hands and under their fingernails.


We should make it clear that the HPV that causes warts are not the same strains that cause cancers. Therefore, you won't see evidence of those types like you do with the wart causing ones.
 
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I feel the love always from you RP, but perhaps less exclamation points next time. :)

I get a bit happy with the exclamation points don't I? I say "respect" a lot too I noticed. Damn it! I have to get my point across! respect.

Just as a note, I AM scared and feel like clamping up my pussy now. :D:p
heh, just kidding, kinda.
 
Yes, but very very very rare and almost certainly bi- and gay men.

Actually no. It's linked to oral sex, heterosexual or homosexual and straight men have just as much risk (though even if it was just bi and gay men it bears consideration) At this point HPV causes as many cases of oral and throat cancers as smoking does. And it's beginning to overtake it. There is a marked increase of HPV linked cancers.

Cases of HPV-linked throat cancers have been rising 10 percent a year in men under 60. Some believe that it'll overtake cervical cancer at some point soon. Though that could also be because there is more awareness and testing to catch cervical cancer in women.
 
I get a bit happy with the exclamation points don't I? I say "respect" a lot too I noticed. Damn it! I have to get my point across! respect.

Just as a note, I AM scared and feel like clamping up my pussy now. :D:p
heh, just kidding, kinda.

It's a little scary. I think I'm more scared of anal sex now that I know this causes anal cancers and that it wouldn't normally be caught in testing and that the treatment is awful, etc.
 
We should make it clear that the HPV that causes warts are not the same strains that cause cancers. Therefore, you won't see evidence of those types like you do with the wart causing ones.

Absolutely!! But I wasn't aware we were only talking about the HPV strains that cause cancer.
 
Actually no. It's linked to oral sex, heterosexual or homosexual and straight men have just as much risk (though even if it was just bi and gay men it bears consideration) At this point HPV causes as many cases of oral and throat cancers as smoking does. And it's beginning to overtake it. There is a marked increase of HPV linked cancers.

Cases of HPV-linked throat cancers have been rising 10 percent a year in men under 60. Some believe that it'll overtake cervical cancer at some point soon. Though that could also be because there is more awareness and testing to catch cervical cancer in women.

Yes, ok, maybe (though I think infection of the lungs is still extremely rare). I think the studies showing a strong link between smoking and HPV are more likely on the right track. It seems likely that smoking reduces the body's ability to fight off the virus. It also seems likely that this is not really rising, it's just that we didn't know before that HPV was causing cancers. May not be rising so much as being discovered.

EDIT: The first post on this has been edited.
 
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Yes, ok, maybe (though I think infection of the lungs is still extremely rare). I think the studies showing a strong link between smoking and HPV are more likely on the right track. It seems likely that smoking reduces the body's ability to fight off the virus. It also seems likely that this is not really rising, it's just that we didn't know before that HPV was causing cancers. May not be rising so much as being discovered.

What studies have you read that suggest that the cases aren't rising? I'd love to read them. (and I'm not making that point argumentatively. I have a clutch of friends among whom we share and talk about any STD info we find and HPV has been a hot topic the last few months)
 
What studies have you read that suggest that the cases aren't rising? I'd love to read them. (and I'm not making that point argumentatively. I have a clutch of friends among whom we share and talk about any STD info we find and HPV has been a hot topic the last few months)

No, I don't have any definite info on this. I'm seeing studies (we mostly have the Johns Hopkins, I believe) that link these to higher alcohol consumption as well as to tobacco use and seeing that they are based on increased numbers of diagnoses (always problematic as testing rises) which amounts to about 5000 cases a year, which is not a huge sample. It's also possible, of course, since we are seeing this more in young people, that it's actually related to the increase in sex education, because that is accompanied by the belief that oral sex is safer than other forms as well as possible increases in testing.

Again, my real concern here is to bring out information that will help people manage how much risk they are comfortable with. Everyone has to evaluate this limited information for themselves.

Let me thank you again, Ceoli, for helping me bring out points that might be of interest to other people who are reading. I really appreciate it.
 
No, thank YOU for starting the discussion.

I should note that my little STI clutch of friends was started because we were all sitting around and sharing horror stories of being shamed in one way or another at the gynocologist for being sexually active young women with multiple partners. And we were pissed off that we all had a story about that. We formed the group to not only share info, but to normalize talking about this stuff for ourselves and to support each other in our talking to doctors and partners and friends about this stuff. One of the girls had to deal with cervical cancer, but it was caught early and treated.

So thank you for creating the same kind of support by posting this thread.
 
Here's a few things that people can take away from this that aren't scary.

1) If you have multiple (new) partners, (or exposure through your partners' partners) keeping your immune system strong by taking care of yourself is a good idea, because you will be constantly exposed to HPVs, which is maybe something nobody told you before. There's some evidence that folic acid is important to fighting off the viruses and some evidence that smoking and alcohol lessen your resistance. Remember, this is just a virus, a bug, you can try to avoid contracting it, but your more realistic goal is to fight it off, like a cold.

2) Getting a PAP smear regularly is a very good idea, even if you are not concerned about birth control, which is something else that I think women over 30 haven't really been told. The great majority of deaths from cervical cancers in the developed world are among women who have not had a PAP in more than 5 years.

3) You are safer using condoms even with people that you might think are otherwise safe because they have been tested for STIs, etc. Even though it doesn't prevent transmission entirely, it can cut down on transmission and may lessen the severity when it is transmitted. For those who might be new to the whole idea, it needs to be said, condoms with anal are also a good idea.

4) "Time" with one partner or a limited number of partners is your friend so that the virus strains that you are all exposed to can be cleared out of your bodies, so it may make sense to introduce new people slowly if you think there's a risk.

5) Once you have been exposed and fought off a strain, you have antibodies to it, so only people with seriously compromised immune systems probably need to worry about that strain again. So, take into account exposure through secondary exposure from partners of partners, but, other than that, there's probably no real reason to avoid contact with people you've already been exposed to.

6) There is no point in being afraid. Fear will not help you to be safer in any way. In every life, good things happen and bad things happen and there is very little of significance that we can ever really anticipate. Live your life. With joy and love.
 
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