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Old 08-25-2011, 09:49 AM
trueRiver trueRiver is offline
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Manchester, England & Tain, Scotland
Posts: 85
Default Place of B in GLB: ancient history

Originally Posted by BlackUnicorn View Post
... there was furious head-butting back in the day ... over the place of "B" in the GLBT. It used to just be gay lib, then girls got invited too, and then some of the girls thought it was wrong to let the bisexual crowd in...
hi, I was around and adult during all that, and it was even more complicated than that.

Gay Lib originally included all Gay women and men.

Some of the RadFem Lesbians objected to the label Gay as they said it did not apply to them, to be a lesbian was not anywhere near the same as to be a Gay man. (Remember the RadFems were pushing the line that all men were rapists in the mid 70s, which I still hate them for ((you are right, not a Quakerly attitude, but sadly true))

It took me a long time to understand that they did not speak for all feminists, and for me that understanding came from reading The Sceptical Feminist

Many men who faced that allegation still have not realised that the RadFems were not representative of most feminists, just (for a while) the most noticeable ones.

But, back to the story: So we had GL...

No. Someone else did not like that as the Gay wimmin got counted twice, and yet others insisted that women should come before men, so we had 'Lesbians + Gay Men' for a while which was not allowed to be abbreviated (I forget why).

Then in the mid 1980s we had the flagrant heterophobic hatefest of the RadFem Lesbians, who denied their own 'sisters' the right to choose partners of both sexes. When I got together with my gf, she had a male husband and several female gfs. Husband was tolerated by her RadFem friends as an understandable way to compromise with the evil patriarchy.

When I got together with married gf, didn't get any flak from anyone about being poly; but gf told me about getting 'betrayal' shit from the RadFems: having a second bloke in her life proved she actually liked men and wasn't just pretending.

The Good News in this story comes at the end, and is the thing I really don't understand: a heartening example of the triumph of human decency over hatred, and its the fact that poly also came out of the same RadFem critique of marriage as patriarchy.

And when the RadFems had got somewhere close to what we now know as poly, the B was firmly in place in GLB (still no T) and the B wimmin were allowed by the L wimmin to share the idea without further criticism.

The RadFems were the Fundamentalists of the Feminist movement, and just like all other Fundies they brought their own cause into disrepute, and just like all other Fundies, their hate-free reasonable colleagues still seemed reluctant to disown them.

And yet, despite all the above, out of that came poly, which in its 2011 form is totally hate free, everyone accepted for who they are, not just accepted as far as it supports a policital point.

((maybe it is time to stop hating them RadFems after all))

My perspective is that of a man raised by a feminist mum who came to Uni expecting to support the feminist movement and being rejected and insulted by that very same movement. Inevitably my slant on some of it differs from that of women and wimmin who have written about it. But on its own, herstory is no more complete than history.


There are two Rivers here now: which one is this?

quaker poly experiences and poly: a quaker perspective

I hope other British Quakers who are poly (or wonder if they are) will contact me here, thanks, Friends.

Last edited by trueRiver; 08-25-2011 at 10:58 AM.
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