Wow, GalaGirl, this is really great information! Thank you. :-)
Your tally is mostly right, but here are the tweaks:
Originally Posted by GalaGirl
- Wants Sarah to be his wife.
- Wants Sarah to be his sub.
- Wants to continue with his other subs? I don't think he had any other subs.
- Wants john to be his friend only? Wants John to die a painful death.
- Wants you to be his friend only? Never wants to talk to me again.
So unfortunately I don't think talking in quad is an option. :-/
Then whoever is not willing, leave the baby polyship/marriages. Plain and simple. Going about avoiding asking the most basic question makes no sense.
I'm not sure exactly what that means - leave the baby polyship/marriages. If I say no to a John having a poly he has sex with, where does that leave us exactly? Mike has already said no to everything. What does that mean exactly?
You are micromanaging a bit there and you are also enabling them to spend time together. Talk about sending mixed messages. Stop mixed messaging.
I see what you mean here, and to be honest I thought by enabling them to spend time together I had been helping. Here were two people I loved who just wanted to spend time together. I didn't realize at the time that I would be lied to and hurt in the process. I never saw Sarah's presence in our lives as a reason for John to betray me, until after it happened. I think if those things hadn't happened, I would still be okay with things like the possibility of them having sex. But now I'm not.
The problem is, any change of comfort level on my end that translates in to limits on their end has been met with resistance and fights. So I'm not exactly projecting the possibility of them resenting me. I'm saying - it's already happened, and I have no reason to believe it won't continue to happen.
If you want to only soft swing and be otherwise monogamous in your marriage -- that is what you want. You have the right to want what you want. Do no compromise yourself to accept things you do NOT WANT. You will feel yucky. So own your OWN behavior, and be clear stating your own wants, needs, and limits.
But what I want isn't even an option anymore. Swinging isn't a possibility when they're already in love. I do not want to have a poly relationship. But my husband is in love with someone I want to stay in our lives. I've added DarkOrchid words below to clairfy.
So which is it? If you are indeed willing to try to go toward polyworld (Not particularly, no, if that means my husband has sex with someone else he's in love with)-- you all need more education.
If so, clean it up. Stop projecting your emotions on it or predicting their emotions. Let everyone hold their own emotional baggage.
You could rewrite it like this... if this is actually what you feel:
I don't know what Sarah and Mike marriage will be.
I expect Sarah and Mike to sort that out on their own time.
I would like to remain friends with Sarah.
I would like to remain friends with Mike.
I expect you two (John and Sarah) to give Sarah and Mike space.
I am not making out with anyone but my own husband at this point until the storm passes.
I am willing to try a polyship (without any sex at all) where John is the shared sweetie to Sarah and I am a metamout. My offer and terms for the next 3 mos are:
HARD LIMIT (no negotiation):
SOFT LIMIT (could change in time):
- I would like to NOT be out of the poly closet EVER. You must be discreet. We need a plan if someone is accidentally outed.
- For now I'd like a limit of sext, talk all you want, and even make dates as long as they hide from the public eye.
- No sex for at least for all forseeable future so we get past this hullabaloo before adding more to the mix. Keep it at making out, no intercourse.
- In 3 mos we can do a temperature check and see where everyone is at now in their various healings/processes and what can be reasonable/rational to take on board in the following 3 mos.
Could something like that work for you? If so, offer it. See if something like that would work for John and Sarah... and I guess Mike if he's still in the polyship or not?
But don't even bother to offer it if you do not mean it and you are not TRULY willing to go there.
If deep down what you want is monogamous marriage with a little soft swing -- that is what you want. There is nothing wrong with that. But articulate your clear want. Don't go after things you do not want just out of fear. It's not reaching for your own happiness if you do things like that. It prolongs the suckage.
I will look through the links you suggested and talk to Sarah and John about this. Mike isn't speaking to me or John, and barely speaks to Sarah these days. Thank you so much for your help, GalaGirl.
Still open to any advice if people have any.