Wrote this today in response to this thread.
No wonder my brain is spaced out. Between dealing with mundane life stupid like laundry, dealing with my abused friend, dealing with eldercare things, dealing with my health things, dealing with house things, I'm dealing with my own clarification and thought processing on this whole "Enaged to Consider OPENING" with DH.
Thank god for long ass engagements!
Because I don't WANT to do more thinking and processing today. Waaaah! I feel FULL.
I want to get my kid and dutifully need to visit the grandparents and make sure no elders are runnin' around blowing things up or having any new cows today.
Then I want to take kid to get a frozen yogurt or something. I want to experience frivolity and kiddie shenanigans to see if my mood lifts.
This I now choose to go do. Just try to STOP me from choosing my next behavior (in response to how I currently feel) to change my next reality and see how I might end up feeling next!
“Everything can be taken from a man but one thing: the last of the human freedoms—to choose one’s attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one’s own way.”
― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
(Meta Me: Well that worked. I was feeling all arghy and then decided to deliberate think about my next immediate options rather than service to future options and talk to myself in my usual "Lo! Behold! I rule my own destiny! Small destiny it may be but ALL MINE! " way. I got the self assure and the self validate and I feel better. Go me. )
Meta Meta Me: Kid was right when she told me our thinking does not directly influence our feelings but it does have indirect impact on them. (Mini Me talking to me-- argh... to many me's in too many versions.)
Meta Meta Meta Me: Hee hee. Kid learned that at home. Yay.
Meta Meta Meta Meta Me Brain Board of Trustees President and Chair: Yay. We hold our own bag. Yippee. So what do we have to DO to get us a Klondike bar here, already? Meeting adjourned.
And being friends with your metamour (the lover of your lover) is BAD how?
The fear with the long term male is that I worry that he and I would not be any more than friends.
I think the fear is speaking to something else. What does that fear speak to?
I see you are still working out your thoughts. That's great! Keep going!
I like to work out my own in terms of wants, needs, limits so I can better see where I might chose my next course of action. Below I chopped up your original post so you can see what info seems missing to me, what you might need clarificaiton on, where you could grow. You are you guys -- you know your own reality better than me. Maybe seeing the information organized in a different way helps you in your continuing conversation.
I do not expect you to answer ME on the questions I raise. Your answers are to each other. It is not any of my biz.
I just want to lift up that before you go there, know where you are going TO. And know HOW to go there so you are in right relationship to each other. Everyone figures that out for themselves. DH and I work with our playbook.
You and your Sweetie are busy writing your own life story here -- and your own way of going. Kudos! Keep on living and thinking together. Don't ever stop. Life Shared is a trip of a journey.
I just offer it in the spirit of "hey, maybe this organization of it could help you organize and clarify your thoughts when you talk to your sweetie some more."
Do with it what you will.
- to be the female hinge in "V" shape polyamorous relationship. She would be the Shared Sweetie. (Heirarchy? Not? What type open relationship V is this that she wants?)
- to be free of fear I will cheat again (She will do___ to address her fear. I will do __ to help on this one.)
- to be free of fear that I will drift away toward another partner. (She will do ___ so I have no reason to feel my reasonable needs are not being met "at home." I will do ____ to help on this one and give her a list of my needs. Are my needs negotiable? Realistic? Reasonable? )
SHE IS WILLING TO
- drop the whole idea if I am not willing to go there without acting out at me for exercise my right to "no" she has given me. (Am I willing try opening up? Am I prepared enough to if so? Do i know clearly what I am signing up for? Does she? )
- if my feelings develop for her other, and it is returned by him, she is willing to consider ending the "V" and negotiating it to a new "triad" shape polyship
SHE IS NOT WILLING TO
- I do not get another partner because of my cheating past. (Soft limit (it could change in time?) Or hard limit? (no way, EVAH!) Am I happy with that limit if it is hard?)
- to know her reasonable needs that are actually meetable by me are being met by me. (I think that is what you mean by "I want her to be happy." But actually you cannot control her happiness mood meter. You can only do /not do actions. So she will help you by giving list of actions she expects you to do? Not do? And you will do? Not do them? Is this list negotiable? realistic? reasonable?)
- to be free of worry that I am not right/enough for her. ( I will help do this by___ . She will help do this by ____.)
I WOULD BE WILLING
- To tell her NO. I am not going along with something I'm not 100% for or not prepared well for. (I'm not hearing this loud and clear. Are you willing to say NO in the interest of perserving your own best healths? Mental health, emotional health, physical health, spiritual health?)
- To go there, and not act out at her later if it turns out my choosing to go there is not what I thought it would be like. (I'm not hearing this loud and clear.)
- To have sex with a man with her (AND be situational bi?) even though my default is not bi. (Is that what this means? "I have not actually found myself sexually attracted to a man, but I would not be against the idea")
- I am accepting of her wanting to be ethically non-monogamous, should she choose to have different partners (Am I polyamory educated enough? Swing educated enough? What she want?)
- Willing to think about a triad? Threesome? with her and her Other if it grows that way naturally. (Get vocabulary with her down pat so you both are talking about the same thing. I get lots of mixed messages in your post.)
- I would be fine with my love at home and various flings outside of it. (again, what is the open relationship model(s) here? Is she talking poly? And you are talking swinging? or some kind of combo? Where is the saturation point? 2 others? 20? 2000?)
I WOULD NOT BE WILLING
- lacking knowledge of vocab. (not criticisim, just pointing places you could grow)
- lacking knowledge of polyamory and swinging (not criticisim, just pointing places you could grow)
- could work on my articulation skills and asking my partner for the clarify skills (not criticisim, just pointing places you could grow)
- I don't know if I can be happy in a long lasting polyamorous "V". (A threesome hard swing is one thing but a life relationship is another. Is THAT what you mean?)
- She must be open and honest about everything that happens in her other relationships. (poly? or swing?) (To what degree? Full disclosure? What if the OTHER partner does not want to share their private personal details with her with YOU. Then what? You expect her to betray other's confidence to enlighten you anyway? Could sit to determine what is MUST have info and what is NICE TO HAVE info from your hinge. What info do you want going or not going the other way? Hinge is responsible for defending the TMI wall.)
COUPLE AT LARGE WANTS
- to assess terrain well before choosing to open?
COUPLE AT LARGE NEEDS
- ID common pitfalls to polyamory/swing/whatever model it is they are trying to pick for themselves
- in the mental health bucket
- in the emotional health bucket (jealousy issues?)
- in the physical health bucket (sex health?)
- in the spiritual health bucket
- ID how they could cope
- ID couple strengths/weakness in communication/conflict resolution skills
- ID human and non-human resources required for success (time? money? willingness?)
COUPLE AT LARGE WILLING/ NOT WILLING
- offer the newbie?
- offer themselves?