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-   -   Poly gal in love with gal with is fearful/conservative/virginal/etc (http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3258)

OhioLove 07-19-2010 08:46 PM

Poly gal in love with gal with is fearful/conservative/virginal/etc
 
My primary and I have been discussing polyamory (in the non-actual sense; it's been just strictly theoretical) since he and I were “boyfriend/girlfriend.” Now, we are married. We’ve been married for 2 years. Very happily.

I have had, for also nearly 2 years, a very very close woman (I am a woman) friend, who identified then and even now as “straight.” I was instantly attracted to her the day I met her. Our friendship has grown very deep and very strong. I love her unconditionally, but also think she is the most attractive woman I’ve ever known. The chemistry between us is insane. She is my best friend who is a woman. My other best friend is a man, my husband.

About 6 months ago, I told her I was attracted to her. Then, a few months after that, I showed her the TV show The L Word. After watching that show, she revealed to me that she “suddenly” finds some women very attracted—and she said, before the viewing of that show, she never thought of women as potentially sexy or as a potential playmate. A little while after that, I tried to kiss her, but she rejected me. It hurt like hell, but I got over it and continued to be her best friend. Then, about a month later, she came onto me, and we had a blissful night of kissing. Since then, she only wants to have sexual encounters with either my husband present or her husband present. To me, she seems guarded. She seems so full of fear. And too full of “what ifs”…she is constantly retreating, she is constantly putting up barriers and walls and boundaries. To be frank, she is quite a virginal character—she has only slept with 2 people in her life before me: her husband (they only had sex AFTER they got married), and her high school boyfriend just a few times (bad young sex, with guilt, etc). Add on top of that, she comes from a conservative background. Add to that that her husband is somewhat homophobic, and not very culturally-advanced; case in point: the other day he said to me, “The love between a man and a woman is very sacred…it is not as good as the love between the same sex.”

HA!

I am in love with this woman. But I fear that I must let go of the romantic hope/feelings, because I feel very angry and emotionally frustrated at the rate of her sexual and mental and general slowness. She is so cautious! She is so fearful! I cannot discern whether or not she is just “adventuring” with me just to support her marriage (her husband has lesbian fantasies, etc) or if she truly does have romantic feelings for me. I can never tell--even though she claims she is being honest and open with me about her every-shifting feelings. The problem is--I don't know when and if she is being honest with herself.

I am in love with her—and I would like to have an ongoing sexual relationship and intimacy with her—but she keeps running away, and only making maddeningly small baby steps. And I want to be intimate with her WITHOUT our husbands present.

Last night she came over, and watched as me and my husband fucked, but she refused to let me undress her or kiss her very much. It made me so mad. My husband actually got soft during sex, because he could feel her emotionally retreating, during the event. She wanted to do it, yet was on the edge of the bed, about to bolt. Why was she there, if she only kinda wanted to be there? What is she up to?


I don’t really need or want advice, per se, but I’d really like to hear some stories about people who may have experienced similar situations. What happened? What were the details? I’d like to compare notes, and get a sense that I am not alone. Like I said before, my husband and I are new to this. This woman is the first real experiment into poly-land since we initially got together. And I feel very lost. I recently purchased “The Ethical Slut”—and it’s so great! But I want to type/talk to others…
Help!

Ariakas 07-19-2010 09:05 PM

My first instinct is one you may not like. She is straight, likes you, may have fantasies of women but is in the end still straight. If you do eventually have sex with her, you may not appreciate the aftermath. A lot of bi-cuious people walk away from who they got to play with because of discomfort. What throws up flags for me

1 - her demand to have the man in the room, almost as if she is trying to be turned on, or continue to justify her straightness by having the man in the room, like a straight safety blanket.
2 - her husbands well..everything. In you want a poly relationship with her, you have to work with him. He is homophobic and clearly doesn't get poly. By getting involved with her, you may REALLY rock their boat

My wife and I have been through..similarish situations. We were open long before we were poly, we found a few girls that wanted to try being bi, but ended up straight. We found them at the right time, they were willing to play and give it a go. You seem to have patience, but it may be a while before she is ready to just dive in :)...

Quote:

“The love between a man and a woman is very sacred…it is not as good as the love between the same sex.”
In its own way, this is quoted by every man who is willing to let their wives have sex with women but not men. It might not be this bold or in your face, but I think this is believed more than you think, and by apparently progressive people too.

Best of luck on your journey, I am sure more people will comment. Maybe someone will understand this all too closely. But if my wife and I were in this situation, I would be trying to convince her to keep her close as a friend and step back, leave the door open of course, but to back away and give some room. :)...

jkelly 07-19-2010 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OhioLove (Post 36684)
I don’t really need or want advice, per se,
...
Help!

Well, nevertheless...

It sounds to me like you should consider that a way of being a good friend to this woman is by respecting her boundaries.

It may not be happening at the speed that you would prefer, but she's obviously becoming more willing over time to become more intimate with you. Let her get there at her own pace.

OhioLove 07-19-2010 09:37 PM

Dear Ariakas,
Thank you for your reply! What you say seems right. And relieving.

I supose I am just feeling like I am done being so patient, as I have been for so long. I feel like both my husband and I have been playing "sex teacher" to both her and him (When we all met up for the first time, her husband blushed at even the smallest sexual innuendo--and now he openly can talk about some sexual issues, without embarassment)...and the badness of how last night went makes me feel like I am done. Possibly for a long while or forever. My only concern is that I have this sneaking suspision that she will try to kiss me again, one day. And while logic tells me to learn from my mistakes, learn from this current pain, that I would have a hard time turning her down. She is so beautiful. Both inside and out. She's a real gem.

I guess I can't give up "hope" forever...but I want to. Ug.

In any case, I am done playing teacher with her. I'm going to tell her that I'm backing away as a sexual lover but not as a best friend.

I would like to open myself up to meeting someone new, perhaps a woman or a man who can teach me something new about sex. I want to be a student for awhile. I want to be in the presence of someone who can teach me for once!!

OhioLove 07-19-2010 09:40 PM

jkelly,
That's true. I have been patient, going at her "pace," this whole time. What makes me want to stop being her lover is this: The nagging feeling that I am being duped somehow. Also, I want her to teach me something about sex! At the very least, I want her to have the courage to rise to my level of understanding.

Jade 07-19-2010 10:07 PM

It sounds like she just doesn't have what it takes to be what you want her to be. It also sounds like she has some sexual curiosity, so she doesn't automatically quash you. Be careful. If she hasn't given you direct reason to believe that there's hope for a lover relationship with you (with just you, not with you and your husband or with you and hers - unless you're satisfied with that), don't get all excited about the possibility. Sexual curiosity is just that and can end when it's satisfied.

immaterial 07-19-2010 11:32 PM

You have been thinking of her almost entirely in terms of what you can get out of her. It's no wonder she's not interested. You seem to be increasingly angry and frustrated simply because she's not putting out to your standards. This seems like a fairly thin kind of love that's got some serious strings attached. When men do this, it's called sexual harassment. Certainly, she might have some kind of curiosity or perhaps an agenda, but your disrespect for her comes across really powerfully in your post, much more than just simple impatience or sexual frustration, at least to me.

Immaterial

TruckerPete 07-19-2010 11:50 PM

If you well and truly value your friendship, I would recommend you cut off sexual contact with her.

Two and a half years ago, I lost my best friend, who was curious, knew my orientation and had a boyfriend she wanted to please. There were a couple of encounters between the two and three of us and while some of it was good, I fell hard for them, she turned out not to like women, and became frightened by the connection developing between me and the boyfriend.

I still miss her.

That said, I could see all the warning signals and still plunged ahead. We all have to make our own mistakes. :o

redpepper 07-20-2010 07:04 AM

I agree with almost everyone here, bi curious, but not bi. I think its wise to use caution and step back and just be her friend. There is lots of time to see if anything more develops, but I would just let her know it has to be initiated by her and because she loves you, not because she is curious or pleasing her boyfriend.

I don't get where this is harassment immaterial. She said she loves her several times. I don't see any using going on here by the op, just from the other woman.

OhioLove 07-20-2010 03:07 PM

Bi curious?
 
Whoah! I am feeling more lost now. I understand why Immaterial may have gotten that impression--my "mood" of that moment (while typing) was anger/rage, but, in general, I am loving and generous and patient and compassionate with her. We come from very different values/backgrounds, and sometimes I get very frustrated--which comes out in me ranting against her. This comes from my fear that she won't love me back romantically. My actions and words to her have always remained respectful and not threatening or manipulative.

Quote:

Originally Posted by redpepper (Post 36771)
...bi curious, but not bi.

What I'd really like to understand is "bi curious." I honestly have always believed that anyone who is curious is actually (in their heart) bi, whether or not they want to defy culture, and their past image of themself as "straight." At this point, I don't know if I believe that bi curious really exists. Forgive me if that seems stupid...Can anyone explain this distinction to me?


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