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-   -   Not sure if this is the place or not..... (http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30191)

wokeupconfused 10-11-2012 11:54 PM

Not sure if this is the place or not.....
So, my lady's 16 year old son was just diagnosed with a lymphoma cancer. She is falling apart, I am not sure if I can help her, since I just watched my mom die of lymphoma this last spring. It seems every time I try and be supportive, I make her cry.

She believes counseling is a waste of time.

HOW can anyone believe that a god is all loving and kind, then put cancer in a 16 year old boy... Let alone adults.... This all just confirms my thoughts on Christianity and organized religion as a whole...

I guess I needed a place to just say something. This was the place I came to, first. I want to scream curses at any and all entities that may be involved. I want to know WHY! I want to know what that young man did to deserve this???? I want answers to why I have had to watch not only my mom die of this horrible disease this last spring, but my dad waste away in front of my eyes almost 20 years ago. And now, I have to watch this young man fight for his very life, before he even gets to go to a Prom. I know life is not fair.. but hell, this kid has not even experienced life yet!!!! :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

GalaGirl 10-13-2012 03:08 AM


Sigh. :(

There's sometimes just not enough words. There's always enough Heart -- give your people (and yourself) the Heart they might need at this challenging time.

Will send good thoughts/prayers your way. My deepest condolances.


InquiringOne 10-15-2012 02:37 PM


My condolences to you on your losses and this boy's battle. My sister died after a 5-year battle with cancer. She was only 19. Your feelings are entirely normal.

There's not much great advice as everyone needs to deal with these things at their own pace and in their own way. But I'll try to give a few things.

1) as far as taking care of yourself, just remember that if you have any feelings of guilt over their loss that the only person that is hurting is yourself. it won't bring them back. if you have anger at god, the universe, etc. that will eventually spill over to the people in your life. so while it's understandable to feel that an implicit promise of religion, that the good will be treated well, has been broken, the anger is not a solution to your grief.

2) in taking care of others, often the best thing you can do is to just listen, hold their hand, and be there to hug them when they need it. there are no words that make it better for them. you can only re-affirm your love and care for them which will eventually carry them through.

best of luck to you. and I hope he defies the odds.

wokeupconfused 10-16-2012 11:01 PM

Yes, I am angry. I can not seem to work that anger out of me, no matter how hard I work at it. I am angry to have to watch people I love, waste away to nothing, be in excruciating pain, and finally die a horrible death, that no one should have to bear witness to, or endure.

I am angry that some diety/entity/whatever the hell you want to call it, seems to enjoy watching people suffer. I am angry that due to profits for research facilities, the FDA is bribed into keeping alternative methods of curing cancer out of our country.

There is a reason there is no cure for cancer.. it is the billions of dollars that are made researching for the cure... :mad:

As for me helping others... I love her with all my heart. I will make sure she is taken care of, and will help with anything and everything I can. She will know I am the rock she can lean on, if it kills me.

Thanks for letting me vent...

GalaGirl 10-17-2012 01:18 AM

Do you feel like your faith is being tested? You bring that up twice already.

I do not know your spiritual/religious beliefs/denominaton might be or where your faith development stage process is at. I do not want to intrude or assume at a fragile time in your life.

But I wanted to share that I do know the rage of that. I experienced that rage at the death of my grandfather. "Furious God would allow such a thing..." and well. All that stuff. It's powerful stuff to feel.

It marked the change from stage 3 to stage 4 for me in my faith development on the Fowler chart. (and I did not know what that even meant until much later! I would have felt SO much better at the time had someone gave me that chart -- so in case it could help, I give you the link. Maybe it doesn't help at all! )

But yes. BTDT. Both with crisis of faith and then enduring serious dx in loved ones and having to bear it. :(

Keep hanging in there. Shine on even though your inner light is dim or wobbly right now.

I do still see you. I cannot relieve you of your suffering but I can take on a bit of that burden -- to read and respond and thus let you know you do not suffer alone and unseen and unheard.

I see you.
I see you.
I see you.



wokeupconfused 10-17-2012 04:18 AM

I was raised in the Christian church, sent to Christian schools, etc...

I have, however, gone from there, to not believing in ANY organized religion, to not believing in Christianity, or a Christian god. I have always leaned more towards the Native American belief system. Not any one in particular, more of a hodge podge.

So, to answer you, no I do not feel my faith is being tested. I am not sure you could say I have a specific enough faith to be tested.

I will take a look at you link (thank you very much, I appreciate it), and see if it applies at all.

Yes, I feel like my light is very dim right now. Not shining through the thick fog at all. It has just been a very rough year and a half, and I would really like it to start swinging towards my favor for a change.

I had to call and file a complaint yesterday in response to how my lady was treated by a company. I had to call back and apologize, for how I sounded. I just went a bit to far. :(

Thank you so much for hearing me.... it is so hard to have family, but even though they listen to what you are saying, they do not hear. :(

LovingRadiance 10-17-2012 04:23 AM

Some days, its a minute or less at a time, not even able to manage one day at a time.

I am sorry for your loss and the ongoing traumatic pain and suffering.

There's so little to say, but I too am watching your thread, listening to your pain and hearing your anguish.
You aren't completely alone even if we remain unseen.

GalaGirl 10-17-2012 05:07 AM

Ah. Your faith IS being tested then. Your spiritual health bucket is taking hit points. Your spirit is low, your faith is struggling, you are in a Dark Time.

I am not talking about your Path -- whatever one it is you have chosen for yourself. Sounds like you grew up in one path (Christian of some type) and you incline toward Native American as an adult person -- perhaps some other Pantheist types too. That is fine. Again, I'm not talking about your Path that resonates with you.

I'm not talking about denomination. I'm not talking about organized religion community worship things like Catholic mass. Not informal community worship things like pagan ritual. Not community worship like in a church or temple -- community worship is only ONE possible expression of one's spiritual practice activities.

I am talking about your Journey along Faith Development across your lifespan. And the tending of your spiritual health bucket. Your spiritual well being and your faith. How YOU tend to it.

I do not know what your normal spiritual practices are. Do some fall under "body practice" like yoga? Tai chi? Do some fall under "mind practice" like journal writing or meditation? Justice practices -- like volunteering in a soup kitchen? Soul practices like creating things -- model planes? Paintings?

What are the things you DO to feed your soul? The things that bring you that joie de vivre feeling? Where you spirit soars and your soul SINGS and you love the feeling of being really, really ALIVE!

You are experiencing a life challenge and need to draw on this bucket, but the spiritual health bucket is turning up low. So... You sound like you need some spirit health bucket stuff to top up to me. You probably do not want anything a high "volume" or too complicated either.
  • We have mental health.
  • We have emotional health.
  • We have physical health.
  • We have spiritual health.

Just as there are body bucket development charts for a new baby to learn to sit up, crawl walk? There are emotional development charts. When new baby can only cry or not cry. Baby has needs met. Baby does not have needs met. Baby has to learn a lot about emotional expression!

Then the mental development charts -- a baby cannot understand object permanence for instant. That is why "peek a boo!" is so exciting to children that age. They really do think you disappear somewhere and come back. They do not yet understand that even when hidden, the thing or person is STILL HERE. Just under the blanket. :)

So there is the development chart for the spiritual health and development bucket too. If you do not like James Fowler one, you can try Scotty McClennan. There are other charts -- find one that makes sense to you so you can get your bearings and see if anything there speaks to you and give hints to what you may be able to do for your bucket.

If you find your general faith being tested, it could be a time for growth and changes in that spirit bucket. Growing pains will be had. Expect some of that, and knowing that, perhaps this Dark Time will be a tiny bit easier to bear?

Pain is pain, but sometimes it helps to organize it so you can bear it and be able to ENDURE.

If you can separate out some of the UGH you feel and be able to file it under "Oh. This part is bucket growing pain -- annoying but safe to ignore" then perhaps that helps lessen the burden of the "terrible dx" pain. And the "Cannot help my lady" pain. Try to Name it, and then try divide it up so you can ultimately conquer a small portion, the doable bits first. Day by day. Or minute by minute.

It does not sound like a burden you can carry all in one go. YKWIM? So just let it sit there a while -- this grief burden thing.

Be with it. Don't change much about it. Just do what you do to get grounded first so you get some room to breathe. It's ok to be between a rock and a hard place if you have some room to breathe. So do just enough to get some breathing room and then do nothing. Sit. Think. Sit some more. You will know when you are ready to make another change.


If you find comfort in the Native American path -- perhaps this is the time to turn to some of the sacred texts of that tradition, or music, or art or whatever -- to help aid you in facing this life challenge. The balm to soothe your soul.

Go with what resonates and speaks to you and helps you refill that spiritual health bucket that's feeling a bit tired right now. Faith is not a button one turns on and turns off. It is not a rock that you keep in your pocket -- you have faith, you do not have faith. Faith is a muscle you exercise like any of the other bucket health things -- It gets stronger when used.

So you are coping as best you can. Carry on. You will feel all kinds of things. Be open to feeling it and just... let it blow on through.

No. It will not erase the suffering to decide to suffer WELL.

But perhaps it can make the weary load a bit easier to bear until the Light returns. And it WILL return.

Having faith? That's believing your inner light will shine bright, shine dim, shine wobbly, shine upside down. But dang it! It is YOUR light and if it wants to shine in purple or in invisible octopus color today -- it's damn well shining on and on and on! Because you say so. Because you have faith. Punch out anyone trying to blow it out and even if it does? You have a box of matches to rekindle. You have friends with a light to spot you a light if need be. Not into candles? You can get a flashlight. A torch. Tiffany lamp! Because you have faith.

Maybe not entirely sure what to do with it, how to work it, or how to tend it or how to refill. But you do have a spiritual health bucket! Everyone just comes with one! It's ready to hold the faith.

Me? I know where I go -- border country. Where land meets air (mountains) or where air meets water (in the ocean on a ship) or where land meets water (shore lines.) Laying eyes on border country soothes my soul for some reason. So does laying down on bare earth. Doesn't get more grounded than that!

I don't know if those ramblings provide any comfort. I know it's ramblings. :(

Sometimes the ministry of presence is just to choose to dwell in another's pain for a moment. Not because you can really do a whole lot. But so that they don't have to be enduring alone.

Hang in there. You are not alone.


wokeupconfused 10-17-2012 05:37 AM

What makes my soul soar? I would most likely be told how terrible I am for the things I do, that get my spirit in tune..

I like you go to the borderlands... the mountains soothe me, relax me..

Sometimes it can be as simple as sitting on a stump, listening to the breeze moving through the grass and leaves of the aspen trees... or it can be as complicated as listening t the elk bugling as they go through their fall mating ritual.

To really get my bucket refilled, it takes time, sitting on a river fishing, going hunting, and watching the wildlife interact as I creep through the woods looking for the deer that will become the venison on my plate.
(yes, I am very respectful of my quarry! And yes, I thank the spirits for their sacrifice to feed me!) That to me is just as religious as someone sitting in a church and listening to some man preach at them on how they are supposed to believe.

I also do photography. I photograph wildlife, and nature. I also dabble a small amount in artistic nudes, and bodyscape photography. I also create the ammunition that I shoot from my firearms. I can spend hours, reloading, whistling, remembering times spent doing the same thing with my dad.

So yes, I do creative things. I, also, do simple hidden things to help people as well.. I am not an attention seeker for what I do, so do not do things publicly.

To be honest, I have no clue where I am spiritually anymore.. I have taken so many hits over the last year and a half, I am just not sure anymore... I do need to pay attention to that, and take care of myself in that respect. In fact, I have started in the last week, as it is fall and hunting season is open. I went out opening morning, and had my annual talk with my dad, about the prospects of deer hunting without him again, since he passed, there have been almost 20 of these conversations. Always ending with me in tears, but knowing he is beside me watching, listening, waiting with me.

I feel like I am rambling here... sigh. I feel a flood gate opening, if I allow it... not sure I can face that flood, just yet.

Thank you again, for hearing me.. both you and LovingRadiance...

LovingRadiance 10-17-2012 05:52 AM

Sounds like sane rambling all around.
Go to the woods!!
There will be amome t in this battle, where you can do that.
If it can be managed, take the boy too.
His buckets are surely low as well.

Dh and I go to the woods. The fishing soothes his soul and same for both the kids. Me, I just wander. The trees soothe me.

Go-its just as important as dr visits.

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