"You aren't my type, or are you?"
Introduction: My wife has had a poly mindset for years. We have been together for 2 years, married for 1. I have always thought in the mono way. I told my wife when she first explained her polyness to me that I wouldn't have another person in the relationship. I just didn't trust another man to have the same morals or ethics as me or to keep her best interests in mind. I believed that if she were not allowed to have another partner, then I was also not allowed to have someone else.
I have been opening up to the idea for the last 2 years though, thinking more about it, and coming to a realization that it was ok for us. I know my wife and I are going to stick things out in the worst of times and even find happiness during these bad patches, which will make the best of times much sweeter.
This will consist of three things:
- a semi-long explanation of the events covering the last few months of my life.
- my thoughts on how they seem to be.
-lastly, I will open the floor to get different people's perspectives on what the situation seems like to them.
With that being said the names I will give to everyone in the situation are:
Me = Me
TM=my male friend
***BTW these are not initials, just a reference point.***
TM is a guy that I work with. Out of the small group of people at work, TM is the only person that has the same core values that I have. We are both married, happy, and we are not cheating on our wives. We have all been hanging out with each other in a group setting. He and I spend most of our time at work. HT and DM hang out watching AM together as well as having almost daily girl time. HT developed a liking for TM very soon emotionally. It was nice for her to spend time with him. DM told HT about a smaller level of liking for me, finding me attractive, but too dominant for her.
Fast forward 2 months… HT tries to put little ideas out there about me liking DM and telling her "you can have him anytime you want." I was anxious about how things would play out. Over the following weeks, HT put more information out there to DM and I do not believe that it was well-received.
One night, we stayed at their house. AM had been put to bed. TM went to bed. HT, DM, and I were sitting on the couch watching a movie. HT started a conversation… "You know he likes you."
DM said that she had talked to TM about everything over the past few days, he didn't like the idea of DM dating me, and she also added "You really aren't my type."
I talked to TM about it the next day. His only response was "It's cool. If I got mad about every guy that liked DM, I wouldn't have any friends." We let things go back to normal, and we have all been great since.
Lately, DM has made quite a few comments to HT about me being great with AM and helping out with the “parent like stuff“. She also made comments about enjoying the attention I give to her.
At this point, HT and I decided to take a break from the D/s dynamic of our relationship, focus on just being us individually, and finding what we needed in the form of D/s. Over this short time, it has let DM see
who I am without the dominance and control I have over HT. Her eyes shine in a different light when looking at me. She goes out of her way to "let" me smell her perfume, and she always asks to smell my cologne (the four of us have been buying so many new sprays and scents because of each other).
About a week ago, DM was out of the room. I was in the bathroom, and overheard HT saying to TM "He wants to be on DM's team tonight during the game." Shortly afterwards, we all sat down, DM beside me, and HT beside TM.
The names had not even been drawn yet. TM fiddled with the small box that we draw the names out of for what seemed like a minute or two, more than enough time to be sneaky about it, then TM put the pieces of paper on the table in front of DM folded up very small, not revealing even the slightest part of the name. He read the teams. Guess what happened… TM read off DM and I, and DM read off HT and TM.
During the game, there were multiple times I had my feet under my chair. DM "rested" her feet on the side of my chair. I felt her toes curling and VERY slightly she placed her toes on the back of my feet. The second time she did it was certainly noticeable, but when I looked over, she didn’t turn her head to acknowledge that I knew she was touching me. It happened for about 5 minutes the first time. The second time it was for a good 15 minutes or so. She touched her foot to the back of mine significantly more forcefully this time.
DM made a point to whisper to me about a game move the other team made. She put her mouth close to my ear, almost touching it with her lips. When I whispered to her during the game about another move, she put her ear even closer to my lips than my ear was to her lips. During the last few minutes of the game, in desperation it seemed, she put her legs up under the table slightly touching her leg to mine. After about ten seconds it became apparent she was doing it on purpose. If I were on a rolling chair, I would have moved back about a foot. Still, no acknowledgement that I knew she was touching me. HT and TM won the game. They make a killer team for game nights. HT and I said good night to the both of them, and went home.
A few days later, I drove HT over to have girl time with DM for my lunch break. TM wasn't there. When walking into the den, HT made a comment about them both wearing the same pants (I bought them for her and for my wife). As HT passed DM, DM lifted her shirt so that her butt was definitely visible. She knew I was looking at both of their pants in the first place. That night, we all had dinner together. DM sat in one of the middle seats. HT's plate was placed at the far side opposite her. I put my drink down beside DM. HT came and sat beside DM, so when I came back into the room DM said "So you don't want to sit beside me, huh?" in a condescending tone.
I know that AM is foremost in the minds of TM and DM. DM also has beliefs that she has been raised up with that tell her not to have a relationship outside of her marriage. She is worried, as HT and I can tell,
about TM being OK with anything outside of friendship happening.
Now for my thoughts on the matter:
Things were rushed at first with HT pushing a conversation so soon about the matter, and all hands being played openly. I didn't really believe DM at the time when she said "You're really not my type," because the way it was said was not genuine at all. From everything I have witnessed, she is being openly forward and flirty even in front of TM, who doesn't seem to have a problem with it, and even went so far as to be sneaky and sabotage the name drawing.(HT asked him about it a few days ago, and he gave a "No I didn't" even though he had his lying face on.)
The lifting of the back of DM's shirt, the hint of "Oh, you don't want to sit by me?" and the subtle game of footsie she played with me, coupled with the saying of "It is nice having your husband around to pay attention to me," tell me that she is challenging her views in her own mind and seeing where things might lead. I have never in my life been in a situation like this. While reading a single person comes easy to me, reading a couple is quite hard. At work and hanging out after of work, TM seems just fine with me, so I am not really worried about anything negative coming from him. I do worry, however, that he is just totally oblivious to it all and doesn't realize blatant signs of flirting and things of that nature, because he doesn't pick up on the subtle things people do or say.
I just want some general opinions of how you all perceive this situation. Do you think that.
1) She knows that I consider it being flirty when she does the things I have mentioned, and
2) He knows about her being flirty and interested in me as more than a friend.
…and any other tips and bits of info you may be able to share. I apologize for the length.
So, yesterday HT, TM, DM, AM, and I went to a get together that one of the married guys from our shop was having and he invited all the married couples over. HT and I were not sure if we felt like going, getting an invitation late. DM begged HT for us to come because she prefers HT's company over most other women. I was kind of dressed up compared to the other guys there, wearing a button down shirt, slacks, and nice shoes. We arrived at the get together. We were social for a bit, with HT and DM taking turns holding a new baby. TM and I were mostly watching AM. TM started helping with the grill, so that left me to watch AM. I started back inside, making sure to tell AM to come inside as well since TM would be helping with the grill. About 15 minutes later, AM said "I want to go outside," starting to head out the door. I asked DM if she wanted him to be outside, with her response being "Not if you won't be out there. I don't trust TM to watch him and do the grill." So I went outside with AM, playing with him by pulling him around in this little red wagon. Quite a few times, I took a quick glance back toward the window, catching DM staring at me with either an appreciative look on her face, or a contemplative look on her face. I was catching looks from her all the rest of the day, watching me eat, hula-hoop, and coming outside for the 4 of us to sit and watch AM.
I have to admit, I am like TM when it comes to the subtilties of a woman flirting with me...it goes right over my head, no matter how blatant my wife says it was.
"I just want some general opinions of how you all perceive this situation. Do you think that...."
1) She knows that I consider it being flirty when she does the things I have mentioned...No, how could she know what you think/consider being flirty unless she is a mind reader or you tell her? Try commenting next time she flirts with you about what a little flirt she is being and pay close attention to how she responds...what she says, her body language, etc. I would do it privately first, so as not to possibly emabarass her in front of her your wife or her husband. If she continues the flirting, I'd take the first chance to call her on it in front of both the others....something light-hearted and playful, like "Are you flirting with me?!"
2) He knows about her being flirty and interested in me as more than a friend.
Yes, I think he knows somewhere inside himself, whether he admits it or not. He may just be choosing to ignore it, figuring it's just a playful, friendly type thing his wife is doing.
Finally, I think and believe this type of behavior could cost a friendship because it is not "out in the open" with all 4 adults. Granted, things have to start somewhere, but I personally feel they should start with open and honest communication between partners and then between any other person(s) involved...in this case it is 2 couples rather than a couple and a single.
Playing the guessing game is just that...a game. Hearts get broke over games, friendships have been ruined over games (and I mean literally games, like cards, football, etc.) The dating/mating game only makes the situation more dangerous if there is not open communication going on presently amongst all 4 of you. If you are good friends, you should be able to start up a conversation about this and clear the air rather quickly in this murky situation you find yourself in. Only you can do this. Talking to your wife to find out what DM is thinking, doing, wanting, hoping for is just idle gossip. It will be veiled by your wife's own wants, desires and needs in this situation. Go straight to the source and get it out in the open...with all four of you together at the same time. What is going on is kind of like the children's game "Telephone"...the teacher whispers something to a student, who then whispers it to the next student, and so on. By the time the game is done, what the teacher actually whispered and what the last person comes up with are so very far from one another it is not funny.
I tend to be very open and honest and, hopefully, unassuming, so this situation just sends red flags up for me. Of course this is just my opinion based on a little information provided. I do wish you all the best of luck!
I guess I need to clarify things a little bit more. I did talk to TM about the entire situation about a month or 2 ago. I told him I liked DM, clarifying after that letting him know that I hold a loyalty to his family as a whole over any desire I might have for DM in any way past friends. His reply was "It's all cool man." and "If I got mad about every guy that liked DM, I wouldn't keep any friends at all. It's fine."
I know better than to be flirty or anything else with someone if their partner has no knowledge whatsoever. I also have to add that the basic knowledge of the particular desires is out there to all 4 people involved. Both TM and DM know about HT liking TM and about me liking DM. I made it abundantly clear that HT and I hold a deep respect for their relationship because we value their friendship and AM's well being above all else. While TM doesn't talk about feelings or anything like that, in the very least he knows that without his express blessing in the matter that there will be nothing else that happens along the lines of dating or farther.
Thank you for making me realize that there were things that I had forgotten to put into this to bring a better understanding to anyone looking at it from the outside.
and then you and TM need to sit down and clarify your feelings. because the above to me doesn't scream 'lets have poly relationships'. it screams 'i know my wife's hot, and i can't fault my friends for thinking so too'.
And ask DM. even if as suggested, its just 'are you flirting with me'. and try to open the communication there.
This cannot work for you guys if you're not communicating. [maybe you have really spelled it out already together, but to me, reading your OP it doesn't sound like you've gone through the dot points and discussed it all, made sure its all above board etc. which is what i think is the most important part! don't base your decisions on statements made via a third party]
Partially because everything in her tone towards me when she speaks to me sounds flirty at times, and comfortable the rest of times. Also partially because I just wanted to get all of it out of my head. I am one of those people that over-think everything that happens unless I 100% know what is on the minds of everyone involved. Sometimes it helps to get something out of my head and get the opinions of others on the topic. Also it helps to have people to relate this to, since we both work in the same office, a bit of discretion is called for.
With that all being said, in reply to Pliglet, I haven't, and will not make any type of move at all without hearing TM's ideas and true feelings on the situation. I will just continue to be their friend and my wife and I will spend time with them. We all just decided to be friends for the time being a while back anyway instead of any of us pursueing a romantic relationship with the other couple. That is why it is just so weird to get the specific attention of DM in the way of looks, touches, and phrases. Some of these things are not even subtle hints at all, being very blatantly flirty in front of TM. I do appreciate your concern about my wife and I sitting down and talking about how we both feel about opening up and just being communicative in general. My wife and I have been talking about this kind of thing since we got together. Even though before now, I was not willing to let another person become a part of our relationship, I realized it is because I find most males to be repulsive in the sense that most of them that I have met have little to no values. I did come to terms with that, and being assured from everything I have seen from TM that he is a legitimately good person. I don't keep many friends close, so for me to want to hang out with a guy that much is saying A LOT.
I do also realize that nothing can move past friendship at all until DM communicates with TM about things with the 4 of us, and I have every intention to let them work through things in their own right, and not be awkward around them, or make things awkward for them. All I can do now is watch, wait, and enjoy things as they are from the time being.
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