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-   -   Wow. She really hates me. (http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2444)

EdibleStrange 04-03-2010 12:20 AM

Wow. She really hates me.
 
I am a married female, and have been poly my entire life. I don't LIKE people. I really don't. I never JUST LIKE anyone. I either love them, dislike them, or don't care. Sometimes it feels like I'm going to boil over from the love I have in me. Sometimes I cry because I can't tell my heterosexual, monogamous, female friends (or, for that matter, my much older professors) JUST how much they mean to me. I live in fear of the people I love not knowing how much I love them.

Sorry. Minirant. Back on topic.

Anyway, I'm happily married, and I also have a particular male friend who I'd like to pursue a relationship with. He has made it pretty clear that he is interested in polyamory and in me in particular. Problem? His girlfriend.

She hates me. Bitterly. She has hated me long before any talk of polyamory started. She hated me before she even met me (Facebook can do that!). She just...never liked me. Long before I had any romantic or sexual interest in her boyfriend, I worked really hard at trying to be kind to her and make friends...but she wasn't interested. Her loss.

It would still be easy if they had a happy, healthy, productive relationship...but they don't. When he talks about her, he never smiles. There's no happiness or light in his eyes. They fight a lot, and while he doesn't really vent about their private shit to me, they are both REALLY BAD at hiding it. She is controlling, to the point of skipping class just so he doesn't go out with his friends. We aren't talking late night partying. We're talking "I thought you had class til 3? Well, I'm not going, so come home. I miss you." We're talking simple lunches with groups of friends that she doesn't want him going to. We (meaning me and his social circle from school) make efforts towards including her...but she often says and does really grating things (like calling our Catholic friend a child molester) and now anytime she shows up, everyone else leaves. They are originally from out of state, and she has no interest in making local friends...ergo, why does he need any?

I want to love her. I really do. But there just seems to be so little to her aside from immaturity and cruelty. Whatever he sees in her...I don't see it. I wish I did. I wish I loved her.

She keeps giving him the HER OR ME ultimatum, and he keeps dodging it like...something that dodges really well. I think he might be lying to her about how much/when/why he talks to me as well. And that shit isn't healthy.

I have tried talking to her. She ignores all communication from me. I try talking to him, but he very clearly wants to focus on happiness when we have our rare opportunities to talk, and I don't want to be ANOTHER nagging, controlling bitch. The last thing he needs is TWO women making demands.

I just want him to be happy. And I want her to be happy too, but she seems so determined NOT to be...

Breathesgirl 04-04-2010 12:25 AM

Some people just aren't happy unless they have something to kvetch about! If they can whine, moan & complain they're happier than a pig in shyte! Nothing wrong? They find something wrong.

classycaveman 04-04-2010 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EdibleStrange (Post 25442)
...and he keeps dodging it like...something that dodges really well.

Like a rodeo clown in Pamplona during running of the bulls?

Like a hemophiliac in a mosh pit?

Like iron man in a magnet factory?


Sounds like he responds to being controlled. Learn her tricks and use them on him. It's for his own good. And everyone else's. Except her. Dump some GHB in her drink and put her on a bus back to her own state.

...Or something slightly less illegal... find her dream job back home or something, I dunno.

RickPlus 04-04-2010 02:00 AM

Hi Ediblestrange,
I figure about 10 to 15% of the people I meet are assholes. I don't spend time with them; I don't allow them to get power over me; I avoid them. I can see no reason why you would want to spend time with her, and if somehow a poly family formed with her in it, she would just make people miserable.

I would forget about making her love you or worrying that if you could love her things would be better. She is unlovable until she gains some maturity and some significant personal growth.

My suggestion is to keep your boyfriend (bf) at a bit of arms length until he resolves things with her. Tell him that you have tried many times to be friendly with her and you are tired of being snubbed. When she starts being nice to you, then you will reciprocate.

Good luck. Rick

ArtemisHunts 04-04-2010 04:04 AM

I think I understand your position, sounds like mine was very similar.

Its almost like playing a game with someone who you know is cheating/not playing fair. You know you cant win because you aren't cheating, but if you DID cheat, you wouldn't deserve to win any more than she does. Worse, you would be letting someone you don't respect/love shape who you are and how you act in a way you don't really want.

In my case, I decided that I didn't want to become that, and even if I was willing to, I didn't want to have that kind of relationship with him. It was important to me that he make his OWN decisions and have his own strength. Being true to who I was, and hoping he will be true to whats good for him was more important than "winning". (Plus, you can't really help people who wont help themselves or who aren't ready)

When I made that decision, I was almost certain I would lose out because of it. Fortunately, I didn't!

I can't say that will happen for you, or what the right choice is for you. But I do know its a much better life if you focus on controlling yourself and not other people. Some things you have no power over, and that's OK.

Hope that helps, and best of luck!!

EdibleStrange 04-04-2010 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickPlus (Post 25503)
She is unlovable until she gains some maturity and some significant personal growth.

The idea that someone could be unlovable is personally offensive to me. No matter how much I currently dislike this girl, or anyone else for that matter, that does NOT mean that they are undeserving of love.

I think that the idea of withholding love from someone until they live up to standards is extremely disturbing. I do not like it in the least.

I don't want her to stay miserable. I want her to grow and be happy with her life, regardless of my involvement in it. Because she's a human being, and that means she deserves love and happiness.

We probably have differing views on what the word means (who doesn't?) but for me, love isn't something you earn. It isn't conditional, and it can't be revoked if you misbehave. It just is.

For all readers' future reference: I am NOT interested in ways to get rid of her, ways to tear her down, or ruin her relationship with the man she and I both love. That's destructive, and I don't want to be a destructive force in anyone's life. I want to build them both up, and make them both happy. I want to love her because obviously, she DOES deserve love! BECAUSE HE LOVES HER!

Oh...and I probably should add that she did reach out to me today. Kinda. She basically told him to tell me something nice (it was that she loved my new apartment so much she wished they both could move in with my husband and I) and considering all circumstances? That was an incredibly kind and generous thing to say, even if it may have not been genuine. I responded by telling him to tell her that I would gladly make her pancakes every morning. And she liked that.

EugenePoet 04-04-2010 04:46 PM

Quote:

I want to build them both up, and make them both happy. I want to love her because obviously, she DOES deserve love! BECAUSE HE LOVES HER!
I like that philosophy.

Wouldn't it be nice to have such a generous spirit that all pettiness and resentment passes beneath you like ripples under a sailboat? I suppose in terms of the metaphor you would still respond to the urgency of joy and love just like a sailboat responds to the wind, but the small stuff -- small-minded stuff -- would just slide past and away from you.

I dunno if that's possible for anyone but the Dalai Lama, but it's nice for me to imagine.

On a practical level it sounds like you're already doing good things -- asking about her, making thoughtful gestures toward her. My GF's husband and I do similar things -- we're not close, but we're aware of and considerate toward each other, and we can welcome each other with honest affection when we do meet. Maybe that's where it could come down with you and your BF's (BF-in-potentia?) partner.

"Could" because if she really is controlling and is also centered on him as the only relationship that matters to her -- you write that she has no other friends, and alienates her potential friends -- then that sounds like a dynamic which cannot be overcome from the outside. You cannot heal whatever damaged her psyche. She has to do that.

Even when a couple's relationship is really dysfunctional I tend to think it's counterproductive for a third party to try to fix things. Just like with a damaged individual, an outsider cannot heal whatever's broken in there.

But it's a tough line to walk, isn't it? When someone is complaining about the behavior of a relationship partner I tend to waffle and say things like, "Well, she must feel really bad about herself if she's acting that way to you." But I suspect you know that technique already, you seem conscious about that kind of stuff.

I wish he did not have to be less than honest and transparent in this, though. I understand his difficulty, but it makes me nervous that he can't act in a plain, forthright way at this point.

Good luck! You may have to be just a good friend to him until his primary relationship either relaxes and opens, or disintegrates. Either way, if you've been a kind and generous friend you will be on his short list of best lovers if that becomes possible.

classycaveman 04-04-2010 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EdibleStrange (Post 25515)
I want to love her because obviously, she DOES deserve love! BECAUSE HE LOVES HER!

I can't see how that works. Apply that to a woman in an abusive relationship who is in love with her abuser. I probably have a different take on the whole concept of people "deserving" anything though. I don't believe we are born with any rights as people. We are only born with rights as members of society. That's why we don't have the 'right' not to be affected by natural disasters, for example.

But society is our own ongoing construction. If you want part of that construction to be that everyone deserves love, then fine, have at 'er... My society would punish bitches like that.

Glad to hear of the progress though. Since you're not going to do things my way, I hope your way works out, and I hope you get to spend more time with your sweetie.


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