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Seraphic 02-16-2012 06:39 AM

Hi. I'm really new to these forums and...well, this lifestyle all together. I'm married to a monogomous man.

He's given me *me* guidelines.... a mutual friend of ours was well within my guidelines (ie: He groped me, jokingly). My husband has now decided that he's upset with said friend because said friend "betrayed" him (because the friend did not know he had permission...although *I* had permission to allow it). If I have permission, that's fine. But, the guys don't. They have to have the forethought to ask him. So, the guidelines of "You can kiss and grope anyone one you want; anyone you want can get you off, but you can't reciprocate" means.... the person in question has to talk to him first to make sure *they* have express permission. It's a bit confusing to me. Am I the one that's out of line, as he insists I am, or am I out of line thinking that he's going a bit overboard? I don't know what to think and I don't know what to feel.... It feels like he's saying "You can be polyamorous all you want, but I'm going to hold you to monogomy because anyone that touches you without my permission (even if they have yours) is a dead man."

NovemberRain 02-16-2012 06:55 AM

So, why not have hubby and bf-hopeful talk it out before you hang out with bf-hopeful?

My boyfriends are deep friends, First bf knew Current bf before Current bf knew me. They became friends first. Before I was added to the friendship. When we came to this poly crossroad, I talked it out with Current bf, and he assured me (a few hundred times) that he really was okay with it. I said, would you call First bf and tell him that? (I don't think he ever did, but I don't know, and I wouldn't know, because they don't talk to me about their friendship. much.)

Anyway, you have permission. Ask him to give permission to the guy.

Seraphic 02-16-2012 03:44 PM

Sorry, I didn't provide enough info. I was really upset and trying not to make it sound like I was typing to someone about him whilst he was going off on me.

From an e-mail from December:

Me: 1 You could cuddle, kiss (even mooch, which I didn't give up easily), and grope. (Intimate) is really all I want....without the "grope" part. It's not because I have a deep desire to be intimate with anything that moves...it's more of a need to feel and express to my friends how much I love them.

Him: I've always been okay with cuddling and handholding. I am okay with kissing, even if I'm there. Mooching and full on macking are now permitted. I'm totally okay with all of this.

Me: so, honestly, just knowing that I have the option to do that first thing listed, gives me the sense of freedom to just be me.

Him: You have it, but please please please remember the safety thing. I'll just have to learn to trust you here. I really don't know how I'll react if you decide to mooch someone who I wouldn't be comfortable with and got raped. You're a good judge of people, but you're not perfect. Err on the side of caution.

As far as what spawned this post, he told me he felt betrayed because I knew I had permission, but our mutual friend didn't know /from him/ that he had permission...which then extrapolated into the new bf coming and how the new bf's never physically talked to the hubby about anything...the bf has gotten all his information from me. The hubby says "it's a respect thing..." Which, I do get.... but...to me, that's not how the original agreement ran....so, a bit confused, a bit miffed, and very much hurt. It's not like the bf and the hubby don't know each other and have never spoken; they've just never talked about *that*....

opalescent 02-16-2012 03:52 PM

The content of your post bothers me. I realize that this is only the tiniest window into your life and not the whole picture by any means. Still, I am bothered.

Your boyfriends actions as described sounds to me like he thinks that you are his property. He believes he owns you. And you seem to agree, or at least not openly disagree. Are you in a D/s relationship?

It reads as very, very controlling and I find that disturbing. You belong to you and no one else.

Also, it does not sound like you and he talked things over and came to an agreement on boundaries. He just told you what was what. If that is the case, this is not cool. Agreements, permissions, are mutual things developed by the couple. They are compromises that often change over time as the people and situations change.

He seems to see you as a thing with no will or intent of your own. If you are interested in someone, and you and he have agreed that you can go outside the relationship, then that's that. Why should your potential dates have to get his permission separately? Are you not an adult? Yes, your potential dates should be respectful of him and your relationship, but this permission thing - separate from your own permissions already given - is overly controlling of yourself and your potential dates.

The whole thing rubs me the wrong way.

drtalon 02-16-2012 04:56 PM


Originally Posted by Seraphic (Post 125289)
our mutual friend didn't know /from him/ that he had permission

Without having any idea what "mooching" and "macking" are, it sounds like your BF thinks the Bro Code wasn't respected.

Would it have made a difference if the guy you "mooched" or "macked" hadn't been friends with your BF?

It's pretty common for partners to meet other partners when relationships start to get serious. In my relationships, that meeting or communication usually happens sometime after kissing and before fucking. This isn't a "permission" or an "approval" thing. It's a "hey, look, we do have an honest, open arrangement we agree to" thing.

Some relationships do use a "veto" or permission between partners. Some people demand "Don't Ask, Don't Tell." Other people have a "NO DADTs" policy.

There's a lot of difference of opinion about vetting new partners. What's important is that you set up a process with your current partner(s) that everyone agrees with, and that everyone then follows.

Seraphic 02-16-2012 08:25 PM

Yeah, I'm just so confused about everything.

We're not in a D/s relationship (though he wishes we were). He's mono, I'm not, so I guess that's where the "control" comes in. He says he's compromised a lot for me and that I've not done anything for him... I dunno. I don't know what to say think or do. I think I just need a place to come where no one knows me or him and just lay things out (naturally, from my perspective) and get feedback.

He has my 100% permission to sleep with whomever he wants (except one person because, well, she's a skank). I've actively encouraged him to sleep with a couple of our mutual friends. One of them is also married and that couple as a DADT policy...but, because my husband hasn't heard it from her husband (because they don't know each other), he won't sleep with her. He expects the guys in my life to have that same "respect" for him.

Incidentally, he never asked my dad if he could marry me. Even though I'd asked him to do so.

drtalon 02-17-2012 12:03 AM


Originally Posted by Seraphic (Post 125337)
but, because my husband hasn't heard it from her husband (because they don't know each other), he won't sleep with her. He expects the guys in my life to have that same "respect" for him.

This stuff goes better when you understand each others' expectations upfront. But, first you need to realize your expectations might be different. It seems like you two just realized your expectations are different.

You'll hear the "Communicate! Communicate! Communicate!" mantra a lot in poly circles. One reason for that is once you agree to a relationship style outside the cultural norms, all the tacit expectations from that cultural norm are called into question. It's only natural that different people may expect different things. It's a problem in monogamous relationships, too, but the monogamous cultural programming gives people a set of expected behaviors and responses to fall back on. There are not many polyamorous examples to fall back on. That's why it's a good thing in poly relationships to try to talk about all those expectations.

Seraphic 02-21-2012 01:11 AM

Thanks for the support and opinions and such. This weekend actually went well, all things considered. The first day that the new guy was in town really upset me, since it was the night before that things had been stated, but... once they got a chance to speak privately, the hubby pretty much gave carte blanch permission to him.

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