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-   -   Poly people she could do without. (http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14023)

redpepper 08-30-2011 06:01 PM

Poly people she could do without.
I found this article on a FB group I am on and wanted to pass it on....

Heartless bitches international: "Poly people I can do without."

its about people describing themselves poly but seemingly having no interest in the "love" aspect of poly as most of us here on the forum know it.... The catch phrase being, "Your feelings are your own. I'm not responsible for your feelings."

I have hear this term on here before, and thought it might be useful to discuss what it means, how it comes to be that this is seen as poly and what peoples thoughts are on it. I am interested in understanding how and why this idea is important to people as much as anything else. Thoughts?

SourGirl 08-30-2011 06:12 PM

You picked one of my favourite threads on there !

It actually helped me learn, not to describe myself as poly.

It also helped me recognize It wasn`t just in my head, the things I noticed in the basics of polyamory. The things people tend to do.

I like what she wrote a lot. However I think you can`t really know if someone is taking responsibility for their own feelings in a good 'tough love' kind of way, versus shifting the responsibility, until you have been through various experiences with them.

If someone has that attitude in many areas of life, then yes, they are 'shifters'.

redpepper 08-30-2011 08:49 PM

I love the part about narcissistic polyamorists!
and how she points out that when your fuck up, fess up!

Damn! I love all of this!

opalescent 08-30-2011 08:56 PM

I went and read the original article. Thanks for the link RP! I'm now exploring Heartless Bitches.

I think the author's rant falls under the category of People are Assholes Everywhere. There is a long history of people taking advantage of ideology to do, and then explain away, what they damn well wanted to do anyway.

The 1970s free love movement had men having sex with lots of women, and taking no responsibility for any of it - birth control, child care, emotional issues, money.

One thing I found interesting is that de-emphasizing the 'love' part of polyamory allows some irresponsible people to disavow any responsibility for their actions, and the consequences of those actions. I suggest that love, without responsiblity and ethics put into practice, also results in assholery. We've seen many posts from people treating each other poorly who love each other. It's not the love part that makes poly unique, it's the ethical, responsible aspect of it.

Anneintherain 08-30-2011 09:03 PM

I agree people are responsible for their own feelings, but only say it when a person says "You're making me feel guilty/like I'm being selfish/angry/sad" To my SO at least, I'll flat out say I'm not making you feel anything, and it might be more helpful to rephrase it in an "I feel" statement, so we can figure out what is really going on. I've found it the best way to put the focus on what action they or I have done that the other wants fixed or changed or discussed instead of shifting the focus to blaming and defensiveness.

Of course that's because I'm not TRYING to make him feel whatever he's saying he feels, I'm just trying to let him know how I feel. I know there are some people out there who only care about doing what they want, but telling a person like that "You are making me feel" just enables them to use the "You're responsible for your own feelings" argument in a "suck it up" way. I think those people would rather argue than work on problems or admit they are being selfish, and using those "I feel" statements makes it a little harder for them to get away with it.

I used to find myself saying "YOU'RE making me feel" and I think I'm broken myself of that bad habit finally. I can't remember how many times discussions never got past the hurt feelings stage with the focus on "I feel bad because of what you did, and subsequent implication "therefore you're an asshole if you don't feel bad because I feel bad". Now I can quickly cut to the root issues of what's going on, no matter who the upset person in a situation is.

Luckily I don't think I've run across anybody for a long time who operates in the "you're responsible for your feelings and I don't care how you feel" way, but then again I haven't been excessively social lately, and I'm sure they are out there.

That's a really interesting article. especially the different bullets on what "Responsible" should entail. I usually assume the best of people, so it's useful to be reminded what sorts are out there, and to keep an eye on people's motivations through their actions.

marksbabygirl 08-30-2011 09:52 PM

*grumbles about stupid IT blocking "adult content" websites*

SourGirl 08-30-2011 10:29 PM

The 'heartless bitches' site rocks. I highly recommend reading the posts about dealing with manipulators, as well.

1stTime4Everything 08-30-2011 10:45 PM

wow...this is certainly hitting the nail on the head for me....the points she makes are points that I have made to my husband in our discussions to opening our marriage...i love the entire article...I think its great.

redpepper 09-01-2011 06:10 AM

My only complaint is with her general sweep that people with mental health issues should be avoided at all cost. I don't think that is fair.... he experience maybe, but not everyone's...

I think its a good heads up to relationships of any kind in life really.

nycindie 09-01-2011 06:23 AM

Oh, yeah, I do like that blog. Thanks for reminding me about it, I never bookmarked it. When I found it about a month ago, I posted something here that I liked from another one of her articles. I'll repost it here:


Originally Posted by nycindie (Post 94727)
I will share a few paragraphs from a blog article I recently read:
". . . you fell in love with someone who was compassionate, loving, sensitive and caring... Expecting or asking that partner never to fall in love again, never to love another, is like asking them not to be themselves. I rejoice in the fact that my partner can and does love!

Sometimes people fear that they would never be able to handle their partner having another love... to this I pose the question: If you felt secure in yourself, and your relationship with your partner, if you had a solid and comfortable level of communication, do you think that you would still feel threatened by your partner having another love? Love is not something which one can quantify. It's not like we have a limited supply and we must remove love from one person in order to give it to another... Now time is something we have a limited supply of, but with communication, sensitivity, and honesty, we can come to arrangements which do their best to meet the needs of all partners... Of course, an important component in all of this is to get past some basic insecurities. To do that you have to trust and believe that you are deeply and truly loved for who you are, and not for superficial things like your appearance, your financial status, or the kind of car you drive.

Sometimes people fear that if their partner loves another, it must be due to some lack in them. Again, this has its roots in insecurity - You can love more than one person, very deeply for very different reasons, or for exactly the same reasons. It is not necessarily because something is missing, that someone connects with or has an affinity with someone else. In any case, we can never be all things to our partner(s) at all times. How burdensome and scary it would be to be the sole source of someone else's happiness and joy in life!
The rest of the article is here: Some of my thoughts on Polyamory.... It's a good, short read.

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