How do you practice polyamory?

sashalessinphd

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HOW DO YOU PRACTICE POLYAMORY?

POLYAMORY & AHIMSA: Communicate with Lovers’ Significant Others by Sasha Lessin, Ph.D. www.worldpolyamoryassociation.com

I attended the Network for a New Culture’s two week August community meeting in Oregon and found myself in the middle of an earnest debate that, bottom line, concerned alternate ways of doing polyamory.

On one side of the debate, my wife Janet and I advocate complete candor with the significant others of our would-be-lovers–before we connect sexually with these prospects. Before we even tell anyone either of us is attracted to someone, Janet and I speak privately about whether to communicate our attraction to the objects of desire one or both of us has. If both Janet and I agree to go ahead, we ask the person(s) if they’re interested in getting to know and perhaps become friends and then lovers with us.

If our prospective lovers say, “Yes, let’s explore going deeper with each other,” we ask to speak with each of their significant others before we and the prospectives engage sexually. If, when we communicate with our prospective lovers’ lovers, these significant others say. Okay,” we proceed to get to know each other with the intention of assessing whether to become more intimate.

If the significant others of our prospective lovers say, “Wait till we too get to know you and Janet,“ we honor this. If they say, “Wonderful, we fully support you connecting.” we proceed to develop the friendship that can lead to poly loving.

If, however, the significant others of our prospective lovers indicate that it would create distress for them which they wish to avoid, we keep our relating to the would-be-prospectives on the level of friendship and share no sexuality. We choose to create no pain for others; it hurts us to distress others, so we refrain from sex with their lovers.

On the other hand in the debate we had at the conference, some polys took the position that each person was autonomous and needn’t consult anyone–wife, lover or otherwise, nor need their perspectives consult anyone before engaging in sex. If their prospective lovers’ lovers get uptight over it, too bad, that’s life and maybe pain’s what the prospective’s lovers need to grow–if they even have a candor commitment.

We advocate ahimsa–harmlessness–candor, transparency. We believe in truth, disclosure and kindness.

HOW DO YOU PRACTICE POLYAMORY? How do you manage communication with the significant others of your prospective others? On this site and at the World Polyamory Harbin Hot Springs (CA) Conference June 23-27, we continue this debate in our panel discussion, How We Do Poly. Let us know your perspective.
 
I have noticed this too and practice similarly to the two of you. I would never feel comfortable with a lover that doesn't consult my feelings before engaging in a sexual and/or intimate relationship with another. It just wouldn't work for me.

My feeling is that people such as that are unable to love deeply and respect the connections they create with others,... but I have no idea on this and it is simply my own perspective that keeps me from feeling hurt by such actions. I recognize that and live with the knowledge that it infuriates others. So be it. I think it's dangerous and uncaring and not my way of being poly. Seeing as many people as one likes without having a need to tell them what you are doing, to me, is dating.
 
I'm with you guys.

I think the "decent" thing to do as a human being is to try not to hurt anyone, so much as you have the power to avoid it.

Going around careless of what effect your actions have on others is selfish and juvenile.

I do think that if someone is feeling negative emotions about a positive thing like love, then it is beneficial to them and their relationship as a whole to confront those negative emotions and see the positive. But that doesn't make it perfectly fine for me to go around inflicting those emotions.

At the end of the day, we can only be responsible for our own feelings and actions. Is it my fault if someone doesn't approve of me dating their SO? No. Is it a kind thing for me to do, knowing that's how they feel? Definitely not. So it comes down to, do I want to be a kind person or a careless jerk? Personally, I prefer to be a kind person...
 
I think the answer is VERY clear!

Of course I am very new to polyamory but in my understanding of polyamory, isn't it about love in the agape sense? For all concerned? Whole, true love? How is this created when one partner disregaurds or is unconcerned with the others feelings? Might as well be monogomous and have affairs!! How is it possible to develope compersion? (I believe compersion is developed, not innate. At least not in these circumstances.)

Would not the new relationship have an even greater sense of wholeness with the blessing/blessings of the other partners?

To me this makes no sense. With that being said, something I have noticed or a better term may be "sense" in the poly community is there IS a divide! I've explored hundreds of "groups", read articles etc and have come to the conclusion that there are those that are swingers under the cover of a polyamorous lifestyle/rationale. They are not all about love but sex is the primary goal. This is my opinion... my sense of things. I'm sticking with it, my perspicaciousness has never failed me. I could go on to explore further but I refrain due to lack of refined poly literary skill.

One more thing... the Bible, while I'm aware not all here are christians, has what I consider the PERFECT definition of love. I've meditated on this many many times... and frankly it is part of the reason, along with my relationship with Jesus, that I've been able come to terms with myself, reconcile my faith and desired "lifestyle" and the great love I have inside me and the need/desire to express it.

1 Corinthians 13

4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. 8 Love never fails.

So taking in this verse and considering the debate... which is better way to practice polyamory? I think the answer is VERY clear!
 
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Hi,
My husband and I are both really new to poly, and for that matter avoiding anything but friendship because we are having some career related difficulties in our marriage that we are being counseled for right now. However, once those resolve, and we reach the stage at which it is a good time to add other loves, neither of us see how any relationship that is truly loving can proceed based on lies or even evasions. How is it loving to jeopardize your new love's previous relationship by not being totally inclusive and honest with the other love or loves of your new love? I am Jewish though lean a bit to being pagan friendly (no one who is interested in the dark side however). My husband is a convert to Judaism of his own wish himself. I really fail to understand how sneaking around on at least one of someone in the poly group's partners is either loving or true to poly as I've been understanding it, and I really think that approach is doomed to produce the kind of unhealthy dramas that some folks are posting. I really enjoy seeing the posts of Redpepper and her partner as it gives me hope that stable healthy poly relationships are not a myth.
 
How do I practice polyamory?

In my head :p I haven't had the opportunity to explore a "poly" relationship yet - its all a theory at this point.

But I thoroughly enjoyed watching my husband enjoy himself in intimate moments with another woman the other night :)
 
Our theory is the same as yours... if the spouse, partner, or S.O. of a particular interest either isn't comfortable, or isn't happy with them dating one or both of us, it's a dead issue. We don't do DADT, cheating, or infidelity. Period.
 
I practice polyamorous the same way I practice my business, friendships and family life....... With complete honesty and frankness. It is my opinion that once an individual feels the exhilaration and satisfaction which is experienced as a result of a life of complete openness, honesty and sharing.....they will never want to lie or withhold the truth from the people they care about any more.....since this is the heart of an intimate connection.
 
Well, to answer the question posed, "Not like that." It may be exaggerated for emphasis to inspire a conversation, but I found the description of how you practice polyamory both very couple-centric and very formal, and pretty far from my experience.

We advocate ahimsa–harmlessness–candor, transparency. We believe in truth, disclosure and kindness.

Well, sure. I don't advocate harming people, either. But I think that there are some assumptions here that I don't agree with. For one thing, I don't think that asking for permission from a potential date's (every other?) partner is a very effective way of making sure that no one will ever get upset or be made uncomfortable. For another, I don't know that making someone uncomfortable or upsetting thm is "harming" them. For yet another, I'm pretty sure that I could, if I looked hard enough, find someone somewhere who objected to my dating anyone I could possibly be involved with, and I'm not sure why their opinion doesn't count in terms of absolute harmlessness.

I'd be unhappy in a situation where I didn't have a friendly relationship with a partner's other partner(s). It'd make things kind of awkward and uncomfortable, and it would impact my thinking about the relationship. But I generally expect that my partners are going to be better at managing their other relationships than I would be, and don't think taking responsibility to try to do it for them makes much sense.
 
"couple-centric?"

You reply that it is the responsibility of the person you are dating to manage their other relationships. Assuming that person and all their other relationships are already openly poly, one could call that a reasonable policy. Let's say though that you are interested in dating a member of a previously only mono couple that have not even yet had a poly discussion between them. Given the stigma many members of mono-minded couples feel about asking a partner permission to enter a poly situation, wouldn't you be worried that you may be initiating a relationship based on sneaking around the other mono partner?
 
This is a great reminder that even between poly people it is important to define what that means for each when entering a relationship. The ends of the poly expectation spectrum are almost as far apart as the mono-poly spectrum.

Regardless of how anyone practices relationships the first responsibility of an individual should be to communicate their expectations even when dealing with the same general labels such as monogamous and polyamorous. I think the second responsibility is to promote a healthier community by caring about other people whether you know them or not. Isn't that a principle of building a loving global community?

Just my thoughts.
 
Let's say though that you are interested in dating a member of a previously only mono couple that have not even yet had a poly discussion between them. Given the stigma many members of mono-minded couples feel about asking a partner permission to enter a poly situation, wouldn't you be worried that you may be initiating a relationship based on sneaking around the other mono partner?

Interesting question. I've never been in this situation, so I'm left to guess what I might do. I'm going to ignore the "not even yet had a poly discussion" part, 'cause if I knew that I would already know that I wasn't going to date that person.

I'd be pretty leery of being a previously closed couple's first experience of polyamory, but not for the reason you give. I have a hard time imagining the person that I both wanted to date and believed had the capacity to be dishonest with their partner. I mean, I'm totally open to the idea that I could be confused about whether or not they had that capacity; my judgement of people isn't infallible. But if I thought that they had that capacity, it would make them a terrible choice of person to be in a romantic relationship with, right?

I'm generalising, but it seems to me that a lot of previously closed couples don't do polyamory particularly well, and/or have a lot of rules that would make me avoid getting involved. I might get involved with someone (against my better judgement) whose partner has a veto, or "always comes first". I might get involved with someone (against my better judgement) whose partner isn't enthusiastic about being poly-. I might get involved with someone (against my better judgement) with someone who is defensive about the fact that they're asking their partner to open the relationship. But all of those things at once? It's hard for me to imagine. Still, this doesn't really answer your question, and might not apply to any given situation.

I think the dealbreaker would be that I'd be totally weirded out by trying to date someone and never interacting with their other partners. I expect to be involved in the life of anyone I date, even if the relationship is relatively casual. I think that expectation makes me more or less immune from the danger of winding up with someone who is cheating, without needing to ask for permission from anyone other than the person I actually want to date.

It's possible that at some point I could get burned by this by having something happen with someone whose relationship rules forbid that thing ("No eating ice cream with anyone else on the third Friday of months the names of which begin with vowels"), because I don't expect sign-offs but rather expect normal, friendly interactions. But I think that there might be a correlation between taking sanity and honesty for granted and winding up in sane, honest relationships.

P.S. Upon re-reading this, I realised there's some chance that someone might think that I think that "having rules that mean Jkelly is less likely to date you" and "doing polyamory badly" are related. That's not the case! I am totally confident that there are people out there doing polyamory well and have rules that mean I wouldn't want to be involved, or even that they are doing it well because they have rules that mean that.
 
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My partners and I currently consider ourselves open & swinging poly. For us, that means that we have a committed, emotionally-connected poly triad but we are free to hang out with and have sex with whomever we want outside of that triad (and we are open to playing together with others at events and/or with a couple friend they have been swinging with for about five years) it's not really a requirement to share thost trysts, though, we do. We agree to only be emotionally connected to each other (on a companionship/intimate level) and to only have unprotected sex with each other. If and when the time comes that any of us meet someone we believe would be a good additional partner we would then discuss our thoughts about it with each other, with the person, and probably arrange some quality time where we all can hang out and see if it is a possible for us all. Now, in this case, it probably wouldn't be a 'no-go' if the person wasn't interested in all of us as a group (fmf) in an intimate way but it would probably be a 'no-go' if the person was not open to connecting with all of us emotionally.
 
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While I personally would be open to having more than one person I feel emotionally primary to, my husband's boundary is that he wants to be my only total primary with whom I share a home, finances and child/children with (at least at this time he feels that way), and we really started exploring poly because he wanted to explore things in more of a swinging style, to enjoy pleasurable friendships of varying duration.
My boundary is that I am a very slow to warm up personality type, so swinging, at least the version of it that I saw on some of the boards (two dates and lets get it on sexually) felt uncomfortable to me. I like to hang out with people for a while, and know that we're compatible for more than sex, and that I want the person or persons in my life for long term with sex being only part of a lot of areas where we have fun, compatibility and emotional and intellectual connection. I could see doing something like swinging with someone(s) who are more friends than lovers, but they would have to be really good friends already. I do have room in my life for pretty much one main secondary relationship right now, but haven't met anyone yet.
 
I am in the "go slow and check" camp. I am very fortunate that my partners feel the same way.

There is no rush to dive into a committed relationship or into bed for us. There is plenty of time to check back with the other folks involved in your relationship about how they feel. This person will become in some way a part of our dynamic, and that will probably change the dynamic in some way. To me, it's only fair to give my existing partner(s), no matter how many of them there are, the chance to agree with or object to how that dynamic may change.

This would more than likely mean that everyone gets to hang out for a while, maybe several times, to get a better "feel" for the people involved (this would apply for the person interested in coming into the relationship as much for those already involved).

To me this phase isn't about whether the new person is fit to join the group or not, but about a mutual growth of understanding of each other so that whatever is entered into is done with eyes (and hearts) open for everyone involved.
 
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I agree that any new relationship (except maybe a one night stand - with someone outside your relationship set, when the relationship set is ok with one night stands), even what seems to one individual or even part of that set, to be casual friendship has way relationship changing dynamic potential. So far hubby has not done much, and neither have I. However, despite 'Squished' in my personal update, and despite some more med changes (or should I say, failure to have courage to make changes and just piling on more of 'em) by my shrink done today, yesterday and today have gone pretty well. Other than that my last kosher item from a phase when even my dishes were kosher, was 'treffed up' by my familly which was emotionally upsetting for some reason, even though to me it is more important that food be supervised in a kosher way, rather than all the separate dishes is more important to me. I live in a part of town where people have very few choices for safe, reasonably priced food.
 
Direct

It sounds like a lot of words.... and I thought I was bashful in the beginning.... that's a lot of words for just saying that you should or want to check with your partner prior to letting someone know they are hot!

:)

I'd just be, hey sexy-pants... your hot.... come meet my other hot.
Giggles
 
It sounds like a lot of words....

Sorry, polyandrylady, but to whom are you directing your post? I'm a bit confused. It seems that, tonight, you've resurrected a few rather long older threads, which is perfectly fine to do, but you haven't quoted or specified which post you're replying to in some of them (including this one). Just would be more helpful if you were clear about that.
 
when we got together with the couple we are dating I made it clear to them that I have a few ladies that we occasionally engage in sexual behavior with. these are pretty good friends of ours and have been long term lovers. I told them i would not seek out additional partners but I wanted to still be able to be with people Im already involved with. they were ok with this compromise to the whole polyfi thing they wanted but I dont feel inclined to tell them any details about my sex life with these other people since they pretty much gave the green light.
 
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