Looking for advice on open relationship

kingofmice

New member
Hiya. So, I'm totally new to this. I recently met an amazing boy, we get along great. We've been on a few dates and he's just wonderful. We have worlds in common, and he's probably the most understanding, non-judgmental human being I've ever met. Before we started really hanging out though, he told me that he had a girlfriend, and that the pair of them were in an open relationship. Never having tried anything like this, I gave it a good long think before deciding to move forward. But after much meditation and deliberation with myself, I decided that I was open to the idea. I'm the first girl he's chosen to "date" outside of their relationship. She's seen other people, also, and is currently "dating" another boy. Recently, I started talking to her, and the two of us get along great. I actually got to meet her for the first time the other night, though the meeting was sort of a surprise. It went well, and one of my favorite (or most comforting) aspects of the situation is that he is very good at giving attention to the person he's with. I was scared that when she came around, his affection would default to her because she's the "girlfriend" and I'm just the girl he's "seeing." A friend of her's who is in an open relationship passed along "The Ethical Slut" and now he's reading it. I'm supposed to get it next. My questions/worries are as follows:

1. Are there any other good texts concerning polyamory?
2. Though I understand we can define the boundaries/roles in the relationship for ourselves, is it typical that the "extra" people outside of the "open relationship" (me, in this case) don't get the same rights/attention emotionally as the "girlfriend"/"boyfriend"? The idea is that one can be "intimate" with multiple partners, but is this intimacy restricted to sex, or can it be emotional? I tend to be a very sensitive, open-hearted, giving person, and I'm worried that I'll fall in love without the chance for these feelings to be reciprocated.

Any advice or kindness would be really appreciated. I'm at a place where I'm very scared, and a little unsure. I think that both of these people are amazing, and I feel like I can learn a lot from this relationship, and I'd like to continue pursuing it. I'm just very nervous I won't be afforded the same possibilities because I'm coming in from the outside. Thank you.
 
Me! me! let me be first - then you can all shoot me down later.

First of all, 'this intimacy' is most definitely NOT restricted to sex. The "amory" part is exactly the point. Multiple sex partners is one thing, more than one love is another thing entirely, although not unnaturally one tends to like to have sex with one's loves.

As to same rights, for me a lot of the poly mindset is freeing oneself from the idea that you have rights per se over another human being. It's about letting them be free to love as they feel fit.

That said, it does seem that many people find that 'other' relationships can take priority over 'original' ones. People sometimes use terms like 'primary' and 'secondary' but for me these don't accurately reflect how I feel, and give the wrong impression. My 'secondary' is just as dear to me as my 'primary'.

Time is always a problem. There are blessed groupings (Vs and Ws) that manage to live together or at least close, but I seem to only manage to attract partners several hundred miles away (bad pheremones??!) and struggle to balance time. On top of that I value 'me time'. So any of my partners tend to feel slotted into spare moments. I wish I didn't have to work!

For what it's worth I have got to a place where I try to let people and relationships be and become what they naturally will. Obviously in this I will and do have my disappointments.

I used to think that to not be damaged personally by such disappointments, one would have to be hard and non-loving. My experience is different. You can indeed keep yourself warm and loving but retain your own sense of self-worth and control of your own happiness. Try to enjoy the pleasure your partner has in his other partners. Getting to know them reportedly helps but as you can imagine this is hard work for me!

Anyway, welcome aboard! It's not an easy ride in the current social situation, but for me the feeling of rightness and alignment with my own mores overrides everything else.

Rusty

(let the flames begin!)
 
Hi there and welcome,

You've come to the right place for anwers...that being said your questions are very telling, are these things you've discussed or are you just curious? Because as with monogamous relationships there are no guidelines to speak of, just what works for the particular relationship.

To answer your questions specifically:
1. This board is excellent for poly reading, I encourage your boy to read it too, both the new to poly threads as well as the blogs; couples who have been where you are before are great sources, as I found them to be.

2. You're human in a relationship; you have rights same as his girlfriend. I found the maxim of "fair but not equal" to be a good idea when starting out. In this case it means that because your coming into an established relationship you should expect to be treated fairly but understand that his girlfriend may set boundaries. Intimacy is not synonymous with sex, emotional intimacy is real, and if you feel like you might develop feelings (sounds like you already have) for this boy you need, need, need to discuss these things with him and with his girlfriend.

The worst thing you can do for yourself is assume that you are inferior in the relationship, but you must understand that you might have to adhere to the boundaries set by others. That is second to not communicating, if you make assumptions about how available emotionally and literally he will be for you it will end badly, again you need to discuss this with him to set clearly intentions, boundaries, and guidelines of what happens if someone has issues that need addressing.
 
Dang Rusty beat me to it!

He makes a lot of good points. In my personal experience I guess I would have been the 'primary' as my wife and I had been together almost 2 years prior to opening up our relationship. When she started dating her boyfriend to ensure she didn't disappear in a puff of NRE (new relationship energy) we had clear guidelines...as her relationship with her boyfriend progressed we moved away from the primary/secondary idea to one of equality with all involved voicing what their needs were in terms of time, intimacy, etc.

Again it goes back to communication, and like Rusty said, it's about accepting your own self worth in the relationship while understanding that their is a third person with their own needs that you need to respect as well.
 
Well put Indigo

"The worst thing you can do for yourself is assume that you are inferior in the relationship" is a problem not helped by the label 'secondary'.

Rusty
 
Wow! Thanks for your help, gentlemen! For starters, I'll admit that yes, I do have feelings. My goal at the outset was to let the relationship develop naturally, "que sera sera" and all. But I can tell that I like him, that there's potential to really give of myself. For the sake of context, I'd come out of a very restrictive (emotionally, sexually), dependent, monogamous relationship. Communication was always a problem. In this relationship, it's not only encouraged, it's expected. When I say, "I have something important to tell you," he says, "Spit it out." I feel like I can tell him anything, like there's a safety net beneath me.

Not thinking of myself as "inferior" or "novel" seems to be my biggest challenge. Neither of them have given me reason to believe that this is how they view me. There's just that fear that since he loves her (their relationship is very comfortable) he can't possibly love me. I realize how green this makes me sound.

There's also the issue of timing. I feel like I'm going to have to have the conversation soon: When do you typically see her? When can you see me? Is it selfish to think of it in these terms? Or too rigid, absolute? I just want to know where I fit into the relationship as well as the routine.

For example, let me tell you about the "surprise" meeting we had. It had been established that he and I would spend time together last Thursday. Early in the day he told me she'd be coming over around midnight. She lives far from him and so they group their time together into a few days. He said I could stick around and meet her if I wanted, or I could leave. (The amount of understanding this boy possesses can in no way be stressed enough, he's like a paragon of acceptance.) My initial knee-jerk reaction was to say I'd go before she got there. But the timing was against me. He and I had gotten side-tracked, and it resulted in us meeting. We stared at each other like surprised rabbits for a bit, then we got to talking. I like her, and she likes me. I'd feel comfortable spending time with her, and I'd like to spend time the three of us. I guess that once again, communication is key.

There's also the part where we're all young, and we're all living with our parents. We're all just barely in our twenties. So there's that. How does one explain to one's parents that one has two girlfriends? It's all quite perplexing, but totally worth it.

Anywho, thanks again for the help. Any particular blog you can point me to?
 
There's just that fear that since he loves her (their relationship is very comfortable) he can't possibly love me. I realize how green this makes me sound.

It makes sense, because that's what we're raised to believe, that's what we're shown everywhere, and it IS the way some people work. Possibly including you, in which case it would be even harder to wrap your mind about his working differently.

In cases like that, I think you need to look at the way he treats you, and see for yourself. You can usually tell when someone cares about you by the way they act with you, whether they have another partner or not. I think for polyamory to work, you need to be able to be comforted by your relationship with him regardless of outside relationship, seeing it as its own thing without constantly trying to compare or wonder if he does this or that with her too, for instance.

It's not unreasonable to try and set date times. If you want, for instance, a regular date night that would work around all of your schedules, it makes sense to get together, say how much you'd like to see him ideally, and then work around what's realistic depending on how much she wants to see him as well. It might really help having a regular pattern if your lives allow for it, since this way you don't have to check with everyone every time one of you is free (for instance, if you're free, you need to check that he's free too, but also that she wasn't planning to see him already. While with a regular schedule, you don't have that worry as much).

Dates with the three of you together sound like a good idea so you can get to know each other. For you, she's the established relationship and therefore a bit "scary" because of their history together, but for all you know, for her you are that shiny new person and you might seem threatening too. It should be good for both of you to see each other as individual and therefore worry less, as people tend to worry more about the unknown.

As for relationship hierarchy, different people act in different ways, and you should feel free to ask about that. It might be hard to ask "so, do I always come after her, or...?" but maybe you can find a way to ask that won't make you as nervous. Maybe you can start by asking what you should expect from the relationship or something? He seems to be willing to listen to your concerns, so talking about them shouldn't be too big a problem.
 
In cases like that, I think you need to look at the way he treats you, and see for yourself. You can usually tell when someone cares about you by the way they act with you, whether they have another partner or not. I think for polyamory to work, you need to be able to be comforted by your relationship with him regardless of outside relationship, seeing it as its own thing without constantly trying to compare or wonder if he does this or that with her too, for instance.

Thanks, those are really good points. Like I said, when our surprise initial encounter happened, I was terrified she'd take precedent. For the first few minutes, he kind of hung back and watched us interact. I think it was all very thrilling for him. Then she sort of went about microwaving something and chatting, and he came and stood beside me. I think people's physical positioning is really indicative of how they feel. It meant a lot that he'd stand next to me. She, too, was very apologetic that she'd interrupted our time together. After wards, he walked me to my car and kissed me goodbye. He's also very good at ignoring his cell phone when we're together. Us time really feels like us time, and I want to be respectful of their time as well. So I suppose the conversation about when we can expect to make time together is important and should happen.

I feel the need sometimes to take a step back, like because I'm new I don't have the right to bring these things up, like I'm assuming I have a place amongst them. But, as I mentioned, she and I get along well. She's accepted me. And I'm confident in his feeling for me. I have no real reason not to be. Every fear I seem to have is a projection from either my last relationship or my expectations of what a relationship "should be" as informed by the majority of society. I guess the transition part can be hard, harder than my excitement has allowed me to anticipate.
 
It makes sense, because that's what we're raised to believe, that's what we're shown everywhere, and it IS the way some people work. Possibly including you, in which case it would be even harder to wrap your mind about his working differently.

Oh! And on this. While I'll admit that my awareness of "polyamory" is brand spanking new, my motivations for engaging in this particular relationship go way beyond my feelings for him (though he's amazing, and she's really great, too). I mentioned that I have a big, open heart. This is not hyperbole. It's a relentless organ. Giving, loving, accepting. It has even been a bit of an issue in my previous and unsuccessful monogamous relationships. I've never cheated (I believe firmly in establishing a relationship's boundaries and adhering to them, and if I felt compelled to stray I'd exit said boundaries by ending the relationship). I think the young men I'd find myself with simply didn't understand how I could be so loving, how I could love so much. Naturally, then, the idea of being able to love many people in the various ways that love would manifest (for each love is as unique as the two individuals evolved) attracts me deeply. This whole experience has been amazingly liberating for me!
 
So happy for you!

Entering into an established polyship, I feel that respect and space are two of the most important things you can give to your brand new metamour. She probably feels as if not more threatened than you, and is wondering how their relationship is going to change as a result.

And once you allow your new metamour to come sniff you out at her own pace, and she gives you the assuring lick on the nose (what? how do you mean I spend too much time around rabbits of late?), the two of you can start the ooshy-gooshy metamour crush phase.

NRE turns perfectly lovely people into monsters. It also tends to drive people to definitely more monogamous interaction patterns. This can be really hard to the established (I prefer this term to 'primary', which I connect more with household economics than anything else) partner. Hence the respect and space.

The one thing your parents will be worried about, if this relationship progresses and you out yourself to them, is if you are being used. Responsible non-monogamy as a concept goes pretty much against everything we as a culture are taught to believe is right and good.
 
NRE turns perfectly lovely people into monsters. It also tends to drive people to definitely more monogamous interaction patterns. This can be really hard to the established (I prefer this term to 'primary', which I connect more with household economics than anything else) partner. Hence the respect and space.

The one thing your parents will be worried about, if this relationship progresses and you out yourself to them, is if you are being used. Responsible non-monogamy as a concept goes pretty much against everything we as a culture are taught to believe is right and good.

BlackUnicorn is right on these points. I reference disappearing in a puff of NRE a lot because it can be a very real possibility, but I dont necessarily mean physically disappearing; emotionally NRE can focus one partner to the exclusion of another...it's something you need to be aware of and again communicate your needs for time and emotional concerns openly.

As for outing to your parents, I have not yet myself. I want to wait until I have an OSO so they do not see my wife in a negative way. Likewise when my wife came out to her father, he had concerns about her being used and a lot of his questions betrayed a bias toward thinking I had pushed her into a poly relationship when if fact I was the one who had to be convinced... My advice would be caution, come out when it feels right and you feel that circumstances make you comfortable enough that their reaction won't drastically affect your life if it goes poorly.

As for blogs, I am sure there are many that will be helpful. I think reading blogs from another perspective in a poly relationship really helped quite a bit in my case, and I recommend the same for you.
 
So glad I got in first! Kingofmice, I am so happy for you. Please don't take what follows as patronising. It is heartfelt and genuine, believe me!

You sound like a lovely person and I wish I had had the insight and self-knowledge to realise how I am wired back when I was 20 instead of fighting to fit the norms for 30 years.

I also would like my 'secondary' to be half as good a communicator as you are - and by the way she's way older than you.

You did ask about books. It's reviewed elsewhere but I have been reading 'Sex at Dawn' which massages my pretentions to intellectualism whilst making poly sound like the most natural thing in the world. Oh and it's a good read too. Just what I need.

There have been so many great comments that I don't really have anything much to add but do drop in from time to time and let us know how you are getting on.

Rusty
 
Again, I cannot stress enough how wonderful it has been to read everyone's responses. Knowing there are others rooting for me and my partners matters a great deal. I'd been looking online for a while, hoping to find a good support group. My gosh, I think I've found it!

Above all, what I've gathered from your responses and advice is that communication first and foremost is key. As soon as I am able to secure some solid time, I'm going to bring a few things up with my gentleman, if but for comfort and clarification purposes. First, when can I expect to see you? How often would you like to see me? When do you typically see her? I've been mulling over the NRE phenomenon. Without knowing what to call it, it has been a concern of mine from the outset. I likened it to the transplantation of a new sprout into a garden. When you move a living thing from a pot to new soil, it takes a good deal of tending. The right about of water, love, food, and sun are all crucial to its adjustment. In that same way, I feel like this "new" relationship needs attention, both from him and eventually from her. I'm just as excited about getting to know her and grow emotionally with her as I am with him. I feel like if we keep a good head on our shoulders, and try to include everyone in the NRE process, then we can make it through this transition with a really solid foundation.

Again, it's just been amazing to have your interest and support. I will keep you posted!

(Also, going to go pick up "Sex at Dawn" asap.)
 
I am glad you mentioned your age. I thought you must be young, because you use the terms "boy" and "girl," although you write well and give the impression of being a mature thinker (Sidebar: It's a pet peeve of mine, though. If you're sexually involved with others, start thinking of yourselves as men and women. It helps in terms of developing maturity in a relationship to stop referring to the parties involved as children). Anyway...

If you want a very good source to read about poly relationships, check out Opening Up by Tristan Taormino. Sex at Dawn is about the anthropological study of relationships, so is focused on more of the background in humanity behind polyamory -- BUT but Opening Up is really like a poly user manual, and is written very clearly. It addresses many of the issues that come up and shares experiences of real poly peeps.

About your other questions, just because this relationship has the added twist of your guy being polyamorous, does not mean that you need always to defer to his other relationship(s) in order to ask for what you need. Being a "secondary" does not mean you are a second class citizen, so to speak. You still deserve respect and caring and to ask for what you need. Of course, it is quite reasonable to inquire about a schedule.

And I wouldn't worry about what he's going to tell his parents about having two girlfriends, either. First of all, that's his problem, not yours. AND it's really more expected for a young man in his early 20s to have more than one romantic interest; most older folks (and I speak as someone over twice your age) wouldn't really question that for someone who is really just at a point in life where relationships are a new aspect of life. In fact, I would think it more odd to see someone "settle down" that young. If it were you who came home and said you had two boyfriends, that might be met with a somewhat different attitude, as parents are usually more protective of their daughters.

I think if you read Opening Up, a lot more things will make sense to you. Plus, keep coming here and asking questions. Welcome!
 
Last edited:
AND it's really more expected for a young man in his early 20s to have more than one romantic interest; most older folks (and I speak as someone over twice your age) wouldn't really question that for someone who is really just at a point in life where relationships are a new aspect of life. In fact, I would think it more odd to see someone "settle down" that young. If it were you who came home and said you had two boyfriends, that might be met with a somewhat different attitude, as parents are usually more protective of their daughters.

What I find extremely funny is that many people would understand if I was having an affair with a married man, because 'things like that happen', but when I tell them that his wife has been told and we are all trying to adjust they get very defensive! And I'm not talking about random people here, but good friends of mine. I've been accused of being more selfish for wanting to let his wife know than if I were to just carry on the relationship in secret, especially after I made it clear that I don't want the two of them to break up.

Again, it's funny that responsible non-monogamy is something that is such an alien concept to so many people that they would be more accepting of outright cheating if it was 'for love'.
 
I've been accused of being more selfish for wanting to let his wife know than if I were to just carry on the relationship in secret, especially after I made it clear that I don't want the two of them to break up.

That reminds me of when I told people I was seeing a man who had 3 kids. I was 20 and he was 25, and we were friends with benefits.

People assumed he was much older than he actually was (middle aged or so) and that he was married (which he wasn't), and they were fine with it.
But when I came out as polyamorous much later (long after I was done being FWBs with him), that's what people thought was outrageous.
 
There is a book recommendation sticky at the top of this forum http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1096 It has lots of good books on it... There is a lot to read on line too. I suggest reading about "primary/secondary," "NRE," and anything else that catches your eye when you have a look at the tag cloud.

At your age there should really be no need for primary/secondary relationships. They generally seem to be useful in terms of family/children/joint finances/property. Of which you have none. I would be rather sceptical if I were your age and someone said I was secondary... in terms of time management perhaps one partner can meet up more than another. Anything other than that would be more about a hierarchy and that to me is not fair. Sometimes when someone new comes along the partner that was there before feels a sense of entitlement because they were their first. I would be careful with this as it is valid that they feel some jealousy and be concerned that there won't be enough time for them or they are not loved as much... it takes time sometimes to get through that, but that has nothing to do with someone being better and more of a primary over another.

As to telling parents? Well, they dated at one time before and likely dated several different people at one time... it was called "playing the field" and just "dating." I would think that they will smile knowingly at your arrangement. If you are super open with them then you could talk about poly, but otherwise telling them you are keeping your options open is quite normal and reasonable for your age and stage, not to mention within their realm of understanding... As you grow older and all those expectations of settling into having one partner come down on you, you might want to elaborate then; if in fact you still feel you are committed to having more than one partner by then. You could decide that you just want and can only handle one. If so, then so it is to be. As long as what you do makes sense to you and makes you feel happy.

I haven't read everything others have said here, I hope I haven't repeated what others have said.
 
Hey! So, an update is in order. For starters, I told my mom. The conversation (about the theory of polyamory) had been coming up of it's own accord. The first time it was her who brought it up. Yesterday, we were walking our dog, and I confessed the situation to her. She was totally supportive and receptive. About our age, I realize we're all young. But all three of us are unusually intelligent and in touch with ourselves. Like I said prior, I've had a hard time understanding the way I love, and coming into polyamory has really shed light on parts of my character I hadn't been wholly aware of prior. So while I understand everyone's need to mention that we're/I'm young, and can sympathize with any reserve our ages might strike you to possess, I can assure you that we are all addressing the situation with as much maturity and level-headedness as we can. That said, I pointed them both to this thread. They read it, we talked. The one thing I'm most certain of is the importance of communication in creating our foundation, and I thank everyone for their guidance. It's important to have my mother's approval, but it's amazing to have found people who have tread this path before me, people older and wiser who can help me on this journey. Gosh, that was corny as all hell. But, really, thanks. I'm very excited about everything I've learned so far, and look forward to the potential for more understanding to come.
 
1. Are there any other good texts concerning polyamory?

Likely everything has been mentioned. But I would say hit up different sites. There are a number of poly sites, read all views. Poly is diverse and interesting. It has a full range of people who are involved in it. Google the hell out of it and enjoy the reads. Nothing has been more valuable than seeing all the sites and living breathing poly/open relationships.

Ethical slut is acceptable. Its a good gateway book. But its feels off to me sometimes. I preferred Opening up which has helped me in many ways find better footing in being open.

2. Though I understand we can define the boundaries/roles in the relationship for ourselves, is it typical that the "extra" people outside of the "open relationship" (me, in this case) don't get the same rights/attention emotionally as the "girlfriend"/"boyfriend"? The idea is that one can be "intimate" with multiple partners, but is this intimacy restricted to sex, or can it be emotional? I tend to be a very sensitive, open-hearted, giving person, and I'm worried that I'll fall in love without the chance for these feelings to be reciprocated.

As with any relationship structure, you have a huge chance of being rejected. Monogamous people have the advantage of remaining protected and sheltered from heartbreak (ideally)... You won't have that protection. You have the ability to love mutiples, meaning you have multiple chances to have your heart broken.

Same rights/ rules/ boundaries as the primary relationship takes shape on an individual basis. Best thing I could say is be fluid. Understand that each relationship is its own, let the strength of that relationship be flexible so that you can accept incoming people and/or situations. Ebb and flow baby...;)

Any advice or kindness would be really appreciated. I'm at a place where I'm very scared, and a little unsure. I think that both of these people are amazing, and I feel like I can learn a lot from this relationship, and I'd like to continue pursuing it. I'm just very nervous I won't be afforded the same possibilities because I'm coming in from the outside. Thank you.

Fear is a good thing. Its hard to understand how to engage a huge change if you don't fear it. Its just your choice to run, or embrace it ;)
 
Back
Top